Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > North Carolina > Western North Carolina
 [Register]
Western North Carolina The Mountain Region including Asheville
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-30-2015, 02:08 PM
 
166 posts, read 163,688 times
Reputation: 274

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by theoldnorthstate View Post
simple, if people are too lazy to read a book and can think for themselves; then those who know are going to be less likely to spoon feed them.
Reading a 544 page book solely for the purpose of filling in missing information from a news story (which should have, by all rights been part of the news story itself) would only be a good idea to someone who has suffered severe head trauma.

A far more extreme example of reading laziness would be failure to read and comprehend the original post, of only a few sentences, before spouting off and presuming to tell the poster how homework should be done. So the next time you fail to even bother to read my questions, do not expect me to spoon feed them to you a second time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-30-2015, 03:31 PM
 
12,003 posts, read 11,926,866 times
Reputation: 22691
Oh, for Pete's sake.

First, LHA is a work of fiction. Yes, it is obviously based on the author's growing up years, but it is fiction. It also reflects its time and place. it was controversial in its day, but those who were offended by it are long gone now. As for the stereotyping, again, this is a work of fiction and much of the racism and anti-Semitism is that of its characters.

Wolfe was involved with a number of women during his short life (sadly, he died of tuberculosis of the brain at age 39, leaving a vast legacy of work), but his primary love was Aline Bernstein of New York, who was Jewish. His mixed feelings for her are reflected in much of his writing. Wolfe also visited Germany during Hitler's early days. He was appalled and wrote about his experiences there - see "Octoberfest" for more insight.

The main character of "Look Homeward, Angel" and "You Can't Go Home Again" is Eugene Gant, the youngest son of a very large, intelligent but dysfunctional family. Eugene yearns for more than his family and hometown can readily provide. He is loved by his family, especially his older brothers Ben and Ben's twin, Grover, but is frequently misunderstood (or feels misunderstood, a common adolescent emotion)

Eugene's hometown, "Altamont", is experiencing rapid growth and an infusion of tourists, some there for reasons of health (mountain air was considered "pure" and good for those battling tuberculosis). Eugene's mother runs a large boarding house catering to these visitors, often to the neglect of her children's emotional needs. His father is a stonecutter, a heavy drinker, a story-teller, and a vital man of great physical strength and energy. The two parents love one another but clash and live mostly separately, with the children divided between the parents' houses.

The town's natives range from educated upper middle class people to real estate entrepreneurs (including Eliza Gant, Eugene's mother), stereotypical mountaineers, plus a black population consisting of servants and small business people. There are also wealthy, socially prominent visitors, educators, clergy, and a few said (in whispers) to be part Cherokee.

Wolfe can be harsh in depicting his characters, many of whom were clearly based on Asheville residents. But his writing is also lyrical and poetic, and his depiction of the Gant family unforgettable. Thomas Wolfe was about 28 when he wrote the book, his first - he was 29 when it was published and immediately caused very strong reactions of many kinds.

If you find "Look Homeward, Angel" too long, try "The Lost Boy", Wolfe's novelette about the same family's visit to the St. Louis World's Fair and the tragedy which beset them there. It was my own introduction to Wolfe's work (which I discovered in college), and I immediately wanted more.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-01-2015, 09:10 PM
 
166 posts, read 163,688 times
Reputation: 274
Quote:
Originally Posted by CraigCreek View Post
Oh, for Pete's sake. First, LHA is a work of fiction. Yes, it is obviously based on the author's growing up years, but it is fiction.
Kind of. The difference I think is that not too many works of fiction begin with an intro by the author that basically says it is largely autobiographical. He seems to have wanted to either create doubt or preemptively substantiate any rumors that might surface later on He might be under rated as a marketing genius if that's the case.

Although (and I think the reason for your opening response) is that the title of the thread could be perceived as implying that Wolfe said something directly, outside the scope of the fictional-based-on-reality-characters, that offended residents of Asheville. I just worded it that way to keep it brief and cram it into a thread title. What I really meant of course is what did he say "under the guise of fiction" in his character portrayals that was interpreted as too close to home by some members of the Asheville community.

Still an interesting topic for discussion I think.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2015, 06:27 AM
 
395 posts, read 463,808 times
Reputation: 697
Quote:
Originally Posted by McWallace View Post

Still an interesting topic for discussion I think.
Depends who you ask.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2015, 07:34 AM
 
166 posts, read 163,688 times
Reputation: 274
Quote:
Originally Posted by lukasage View Post
Depends who you ask.
Kind of does put a lot of faith in human nature I guess, assuming that those who find it uninteresting would be smart enough to simply ignore the thread.

Now that you mention it, that idea may be a bit of a leap
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2015, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Sneads Ferry, NC
13,379 posts, read 27,109,696 times
Reputation: 6997
Quote:
Originally Posted by McWallace View Post
A lot of people on Amazon express the same lack of desire you did to finish it. This is one reason I'm not putting life on hold to read it just to find a tidbit on characters.

Do you recall if he indicated there were a lot of Jewish New Yorkers living there at the time?
No, the character Eugene moved to New York where he met Aline the Jewish publisher. The anti-Semitism coming from the mouths of his Asheville characters was typical of their times. It just sounds harsh to ears more used to polical correctness.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2015, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Winston-Salem
4,218 posts, read 8,545,124 times
Reputation: 4494
Quote:
Originally Posted by McWallace View Post
Kind of does put a lot of faith in human nature I guess, assuming that those who find it uninteresting would be smart enough to simply ignore the thread.

Now that you mention it, that idea may be a bit of a leap
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-02-2015, 09:56 PM
 
166 posts, read 163,688 times
Reputation: 274
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenage1 View Post
No, the character Eugene moved to New York where he met Aline the Jewish publisher. The anti-Semitism coming from the mouths of his Asheville characters was typical of their times. It just sounds harsh to ears more used to polical correctness.
Hmm. That would indicate then, that the anti-Semitism was not a part of what was offensive to Asheville residents of the late 1920s. So now that things are more politically sensitive, he stands to offend more folks in his death than when he was alive. Maybe this was all part of his master plan, upsetting as many as possible -- sort of an evil genius?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-04-2015, 08:10 PM
 
12,003 posts, read 11,926,866 times
Reputation: 22691
Quote:
Originally Posted by McWallace View Post
Hmm. That would indicate then, that the anti-Semitism was not a part of what was offensive to Asheville residents of the late 1920s. So now that things are more politically sensitive, he stands to offend more folks in his death than when he was alive. Maybe this was all part of his master plan, upsetting as many as possible -- sort of an evil genius?
You seem to have already made your own judgment of Thomas Wolfe, even though you admittedly haven't read his works (or even "Look Homeward, Angel") in their entirety and are not familiar with the time and place in which he spent his formative years. Have you read Wolfe's letters, particularly his correspondence with his editors, about his experiences in pre-war Germany? Have you read any of the scholarly biographies of Thomas Wolfe?

If you read nothing else, please find and read Wolfe's realistic short story, "I Have a Thing to Tell You", which was written because of his very serious concern about the situation he witnessed in Germany during his visit in 1936. Wolfe used his creative genius and his experience in Nazi Germany to draw more public attention to that situation, which he deplored and condemned. In more contemporary terms, he wrote the story to help raise awareness, which it did admirably.

Wolfe may have been a genius, but he certainly wasn't evil. Weak on occasion, sometimes prone to poor judgment, sometimes self-indulgent and selfish - but also brilliant, highly productive, creative, poetic, lyrical and literally a giant among men.

You appear to have difficulty comprehending the difference between realistic autobiographical fiction and non-fiction. They are not the same. Wolfe's statement in his intro, to LH, A Is self-protective, certainly - but the book is a novel - fiction - strongly influenced by the author's life, not an autobiography.

A work of literature should be judged as a product of its time and of the author's imagination, and it is important that readers recognize that fictional characters who express what are now considered bigoted views are not necessarily voicing the opinions of the author. Not every fictional character is going to be portrayed as being a paragon of insight, tolerance, and understanding. If they all were such angelic creatures, novels would be very dull indeed.

"Evil genius", indeed. The very notion is laughable to those more familiar with Wolfe's life and work.

Last edited by CraigCreek; 10-04-2015 at 08:22 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-05-2015, 03:30 PM
 
166 posts, read 163,688 times
Reputation: 274
Quote:
Originally Posted by CraigCreek View Post
You seem to have already made your own judgment of Thomas Wolfe.
And you seem to be taking my tongue in cheek comments like "evil genius" way too seriously, I think you'll feel a lot better if you turn your sensitivity level down a notch or two.

You're also gravely misunderstanding the point of the thread I created. Asheville residents at the time were offended, the thread is to discuss why, specifically, and what was said that offended them. It does not matter what parts of the story were completely contrived, or what parts were based on fact. He called the town Altamont but everyone knows it was based on Asheville. Newspaper reports at the time described some of his character depictions based so closely on actual characters, that readers of the book were able to systematically identify them by name.

That may not align well with your beliefs or what you took away from the book, but it does not change the facts. Sorry if that leaves you crying into your pillow but its the way things are so I guess you'll just have to deal with it. I'm pretty sure if you keep reaching and grasping, you can find more things to argue about, but it's really not going to get you anywhere until you understand why I created this thread and decide whether you want to participate in the actual topic, or continue to come up with tangential subjects for debate.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:




Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > North Carolina > Western North Carolina
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top