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Old 06-06-2012, 06:53 PM
 
21,209 posts, read 13,692,733 times
Reputation: 12183

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Cooper View Post

Every state has culture and every state has educated workers. Well, maybe every state but your state, wherever that is.
I'm in Washington State, home of Microsoft, Amazon, F5, HTC, Expedia, Boeing and newcomers like Google, Facebook, eBay, Salesforce, Zynga, etc. From Facebook to Zynga: A guide to the tech giants establishing Seattle outposts - GeekWire
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Old 06-06-2012, 07:49 PM
 
485 posts, read 900,350 times
Reputation: 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildchild_to View Post
Great job Wisconsin!!!! The voters have spoken for the 2nd time..
It's pretty awesome to see an elected official stick to his principles, do what he said would do, and, when some factions didn't like it and thought they could topple him, he wins another election by a wider margin. Good job Scott!
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:43 PM
 
Location: Area 51.5
13,893 posts, read 12,646,806 times
Reputation: 9136
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
Of course you're living on Social Security. And company retirement plans went the way of the dinosaur. They only existed when unions were strong so you benefited by being of a much older generation. Your life would be very different if you were younger now. But enjoy those retirement benefits while you shout down those that are working in a much different environment today.
Another FAIL.

Neither I nor my employer were union.
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:37 PM
 
811 posts, read 1,143,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyInGreatLakes View Post
It's pretty awesome to see an elected official stick to his principles, do what he said would do, and, when some factions didn't like it and thought they could topple him, he wins another election by a wider margin. Good job Scott!
That is what this country needs politicians who will take the bull by the horns an move foward. We want change an an the good folks of Wisconsin showed it for a 2nd time at the poles. It starts with Wisconsin's victory.

The Tea Party has taken a seat in New Mexico an sent Dick Luger of Indiana packing. God Bless The USA!!
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Old 06-06-2012, 10:13 PM
 
21,209 posts, read 13,692,733 times
Reputation: 12183
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Cooper View Post
Another FAIL.

Neither I nor my employer were union.
I know you know this but fine. When unions were common, companies often offered pensions and retirement benefits along with health care benefits. Even for those that weren't union, because unions set a standard and other employers did so to remain competitive. You benefited from that.

You know this better than I because you are older. I've never been in a union but I'm not threatened by them the way Wisconsin is. I'm fine with teachers being able to be in a union. They still make less than most people I know. I don't begrudge teachers, or firefighters or policeman or any other state worker. Wisconsin wants to get revenge on these state workers so they can live with the fallout. I'm just glad I don't live there, the anger and broken families and friends must be exhausting.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:00 AM
 
21,125 posts, read 17,317,836 times
Reputation: 8815
Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
20 yrs in Florida might qualify me for some experience in a right to work state.
Basically you go to work every day hoping you still have a job at the end of the day as you can be terminated and given no reason why,
You will be working for as little as the boss can get away with and you better say how high on the way up if the boss asks you to jump.
No healthcare, and no pensions and if you took too many days off for health reasons you are basically let go.
This is the part that's conveniently left out by the "down with the Unions" crowd. Or better to say that's how they see it fit. Turning everyone into obedient screw in the money-making machine, that's set to *win the global competition* and put them in charge of the world that's ruled entirely by money. Do what we tell you to do or else. At that they love to tell scary stories how those horrid democrats and "big government" are trying to take away their *freedom.* The freedom they love is the kind that can be only purchased, and since they have money, they feel they are entitled to it.
This is the newly-defined brand of American freedom, just slap the right price and freedom is all yours. However if you happen to work for living, this package is out of your reach. They still love to claim however that America is the "land of the free," because it sounds so righteous, almost as "in God we trust." In reality that god they trust are money and money only. Heh.
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:21 AM
 
Location: Kowaniec, Nowy Targ, Podhale. 666 m n.p.m.
371 posts, read 913,192 times
Reputation: 494
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildchild_to View Post
God Bless The USA!!
Nah, God is probably pissing on the USA right now...
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:40 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
854 posts, read 2,848,063 times
Reputation: 686
Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyGavin View Post
The only people that would suffer then is the public. It takes months to get a firefighter or police officer thru the most basic of recruit schools, much less the time it takes to get them to be competent at what they do. That is also without taking into account the time and experience needed to provide all of the other services these agencies provide; many of which the general public doesn't understand.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not justifying the exclusion in the law. I was trying to clear up an inaccurate portrayal of events, something that happened all too often in this whole recall circus; much the same as I disagree with your "fire 'em all" mentality. Talking points aside, people would suffer and some would die with the philosophy you put out there.

In the case with air traffic controllers, planes don't fly and people won't die. The public would be placed in grave danger if public safety walked off the job in mass. Fires won't stop; heart attacks won't cease; criminals won't stop criminal behavior.

True, there are plenty of people who want jobs. Who would train them? Who would provide the experience to guide them along? Without that experience a lot of those stand-in police and fire would be put in body bags, as well.
Agree that there would be a retraining curve, and there would be a public safety concern.

My only point is everyone has to give, and if a select group(s) do not want to contribute to solve a problem, the only recourse would be to take desive action. No group of public workers shoulld be excluded from contributing to fix this fiscal issue. This is a nationwide crisis, and the road to financial solvency will be painful at first.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:39 AM
 
146 posts, read 321,977 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc515 View Post
My only point is everyone has to give, and if a select group(s) do not want to contribute to solve a problem, the only recourse would be to take desive action. No group of public workers shoulld be excluded from contributing to fix this fiscal issue. This is a nationwide crisis, and the road to financial solvency will be painful at first.

Absolutely. I just saw that you're from New Jersey, so I will add some information that perhaps you hadn't heard.
Many fire and police locals have given concessions to the same level as the other workers. All police and fire, statewide, are included in the healthcare language of the law. All city of Milwaukee and county of Milwaukee employees are not included in the pension contribution requirement; the pension requirement only applies to the Wisconsin Retirement System (WRS)...both of those communities, the city and county, have self-funded, independent pension plans.

My personal feeling is that it should have been all public workers written in. However, look at Ohio; they had similar legislation overturned by a referendum vote. The language in Ohio's SB 5 had all public workers included, meaning police and fire.
Just a bigger picture thought, from a political perspective.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:57 AM
 
341 posts, read 599,816 times
Reputation: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by tetka_grunya View Post
I do not understand, why people are so sure about educated residents leaving the state now?
Most positions that require education are not union positions. People expect to get paid on those position on the base of their own achievements. They are motivated to keep up with market requirements and are vital part of our progress. The more educated and motivated people we have here, the better our country is.
tetka_grunya, less are people educated you can easier manipulated with them. Albert Einstein once wrote: There are two things which are infinitive: The Universe and the human stupidity.
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