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Old 01-11-2017, 12:03 PM
 
213 posts, read 167,846 times
Reputation: 490

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I'm puzzled by how you came up with Wisconsin, of all places. I'd reconsider this move. The Midwest in general is a very conformist place - if you're not like everybody else, you can expect to be ostracized or worse, ESPECIALLY in rural areas. Most sexual minorities get out as fast as they can and move to a city. Wisconsin is not really a place that's welcoming to difference - my uncle lived in suburban Milwaukee (Brookfield) for decades and maybe five people knew he was Jewish, because to disclose that meant personal and professional isolation. And the climate for minorities is getting worse, in part due to the Tea Party ideologue governor who's really worked overtime to make the state unwelcoming to anyone who isn't from the in group (white, conservative, Christian, straight).


About the only place in Wisconsin I would recommend living to someone in your situation is Madison. It's a beautiful, diverse, and tolerant city, in part because of the university. Even Milwaukee is dicey - the city itself definitely has pockets of liberal diversity, but cross the city/suburb line and it changes very quickly.


I was just speaking last month to a guy I know through work; he's of Mexican descent and grew up partly in Milwaukee's northern suburbs and went to high school there. He said when he was growing up he never really felt uncomfortable at all because he was different, but now when he goes back he feels a new sense of hostility. He thinks it's because there's been a big influx of Hispanics to areas that used to be almost all white, so the whites now feel threatened, whereas they didn't before. I think the whole state is like that - there's a reason it went for Trump.


Have you thought about New England instead? Massachusetts, in particular the western part of the state (such as Hampshire County) has a similar climate and is also largely rural but is far more liberal and welcoming. It's also got a strong LGBT community. Vermont would also be a possibility.
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Old 01-11-2017, 12:46 PM
 
Location: Downtown Los Angeles, CA
1,886 posts, read 1,481,713 times
Reputation: 2204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rynldsbr View Post
Here is the OP's original quote, and highlighted are the points where Milwaukee fails.

Please tell us what Milwaukee neighborhood is non-violent, comparable in any way to Two Rivers, safe for a teenage daughter, walkable, close to nature and good for those who like to camp? Milwaukee is the most racially, socially, economically, and politically divided city in the nation with recent outbreaks of violence and rioting and you are thinking this is a winning combination for an LGBT family from the south because...(?)


There are a number of areas in Wisconsin, including my hometown and surrounding counties, that would never be a good idea for OP or most non-native people to move to. Great to visit, not great to live in. Milwaukee falls in the same category - great to visit, not great to live in.
Have you ever visited Milwaukee? Generalizations such as you made will always fail when attempting to describe such a vast and populous city.

Per your request, here's a shortened list of Milwaukee neighborhoods that fit your description: Bay View, East Side, Wauwatosa, Downtown, Brookfield, Peawaukee.

Go ahead and compare the crime stats of these neighborhoods (note, not the entire city which is heavily skewed by violence on the north side) to Two Rivers WI. I haven't done it myself, but I'm be whiling to bet the difference is negligible.

- Milwaukee resident 2006-2016
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Old 01-11-2017, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Milwaukee, WI
2,178 posts, read 1,718,861 times
Reputation: 2400
I just knew a few trans-people in Milwaukee... They had their problems, but there are more than one out there and people are not so close-minded when it comes to transsexual issues. I'd recommend Milwaukee before any small town in WI, no matter how nice that small town is. Part of being happy is to be able to be out and around and in a small town with a single bar for entertainment, it's a hit or miss. In Milwaukee, there are bad neighborhoods or neighbors, but you can always go somewhere else until you find your community.


Having said that, Madison or Appleton are also an obviously good places to be. Small towns? It's a hit or miss, I'd rent a house for a vacation and try to get in touch with locals (as in, go into the local drinking hole in quieter day and talk to a barmen, then if things are ok to visit it on Friday night) before moving permanently. If you're religious, I'd go the local church and have a chat with the priest and try to gauge how welcoming and open-minded is he (where goes the priest, their goes his parishioners)...
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Old 01-11-2017, 10:16 PM
 
32 posts, read 33,198 times
Reputation: 50
I don't think Two Rivers is a good idea. Have you been there OP? I have and I'm quite familiar with the Manitowoc area. I wouldn't recommend it for anyone who is LGBTQ person. While there are some nice people there....it's small and full of people that have lived there forever. It wouldn't take long for everyone to know about your son and be whispering behind your backs.

If you really want to live in Wisconsin but a smaller town feel, Appleton is probably a better choice. It's a smaller population area than Milwaukee or Madison but fairly progressive for an area that small.
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Old 01-12-2017, 09:19 AM
 
Location: East TX
2,111 posts, read 2,157,330 times
Reputation: 3275
Quote:
Originally Posted by adr3naline View Post
Have you ever visited Milwaukee? Generalizations such as you made will always fail when attempting to describe such a vast and populous city.

Per your request, here's a shortened list of Milwaukee neighborhoods that fit your description: Bay View, East Side, Wauwatosa, Downtown, Brookfield, Peawaukee.

Go ahead and compare the crime stats of these neighborhoods (note, not the entire city which is heavily skewed by violence on the north side) to Two Rivers WI. I haven't done it myself, but I'm be whiling to bet the difference is negligible.

- Milwaukee resident 2006-2016
I lived in Milwaukee metro area for 12 years. My wife is a Milwaukee native, from near 85th and Capital. I lived in St Francis (right next to Bay View) for two years, south side near St Luke's for two years and my first house was west - near State Fair Park - for 7 years. Yes, thank you, I know the city well.


Bay View may be the best option on your list, but hardly crime free and easy for a teenage daughter to be turned loose to walk on her own.
City-data.com crime index for city (zip code 53207) in 2014 (higher means more crime):
City: 677.5 U.S. average:235.9


East side, no chance the teen daughter goes out alone and the gay scene there is not particularly fond of transgender looking to avoid making waves. I have personal friends with experience in that area.
Wauwatosa is not affordable in areas that are still nice enough to want to live, sorry. Median home price is now $220k in Tosa.
Downtown meets zero of the criteria stated by OP.
Brookfield and Pewaukee are in the most highly concentrated conservative county in the state - you must have been joking, right?


I love Milwaukee. We love to take the kids to visit grandma, who still lives in Greenfield. I enjoy going and getting lunch at the Brat House, catching a Brewers or Admirals game (not into NBA or the Bucks - sorry), and Milwaukee mile is a great place to see the Indy Car series up close and personal (longest operational race track in the world!). I cannot tell the OP, based on their criteria that I already outlined and highlighted in a previous response, that they should do more than visit.


I recommend Gille's for the best custard, Barbierre's on Bluemound for great lasagna and incredible garlic bread, good Greek food at Zeb's on 27th and Morgan, and the best deal on breakfast is a hole-in-the-wall little joint on 84th and Clevaland that I can't remember the name of. Anniversary dinner I suggest Caterina's off 92nd and Oklahoma.


Then leave. Get out of the city and go home. Don't live there. It doesn't hit the criteria OP is looking for. Might be great for you or someone else, but not for OP.

Last edited by Rynldsbr; 01-12-2017 at 09:20 AM.. Reason: format
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Old 01-12-2017, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Downtown Los Angeles, CA
1,886 posts, read 1,481,713 times
Reputation: 2204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rynldsbr View Post
I lived in Milwaukee metro area for 12 years. My wife is a Milwaukee native, from near 85th and Capital. I lived in St Francis (right next to Bay View) for two years, south side near St Luke's for two years and my first house was west - near State Fair Park - for 7 years. Yes, thank you, I know the city well.


Bay View may be the best option on your list, but hardly crime free and easy for a teenage daughter to be turned loose to walk on her own.
City-data.com crime index for city (zip code 53207) in 2014 (higher means more crime):
City: 677.5 U.S. average:235.9

East side, no chance the teen daughter goes out alone and the gay scene there is not particularly fond of transgender looking to avoid making waves. I have personal friends with experience in that area.
Wauwatosa is not affordable in areas that are still nice enough to want to live, sorry. Median home price is now $220k in Tosa.
Downtown meets zero of the criteria stated by OP.
Brookfield and Pewaukee are in the most highly concentrated conservative county in the state - you must have been joking, right?


I love Milwaukee. We love to take the kids to visit grandma, who still lives in Greenfield. I enjoy going and getting lunch at the Brat House, catching a Brewers or Admirals game (not into NBA or the Bucks - sorry), and Milwaukee mile is a great place to see the Indy Car series up close and personal (longest operational race track in the world!). I cannot tell the OP, based on their criteria that I already outlined and highlighted in a previous response, that they should do more than visit.


I recommend Gille's for the best custard, Barbierre's on Bluemound for great lasagna and incredible garlic bread, good Greek food at Zeb's on 27th and Morgan, and the best deal on breakfast is a hole-in-the-wall little joint on 84th and Clevaland that I can't remember the name of. Anniversary dinner I suggest Caterina's off 92nd and Oklahoma.


Then leave. Get out of the city and go home. Don't live there. It doesn't hit the criteria OP is looking for. Might be great for you or someone else, but not for OP.
This post screams "I haven't lived in MKE in the past decade". Keep in mind visiting grandma and living in a city are two very different experiences.

To follow up on your post directly:
  • The East Side is beautiful, much of it affluent and quite progressive. I lived there 2007-2011.
  • Not sure how one could deem $220k for a SFR in 'Tosa as unaffordable. Still quite the value.
  • Downtown is incredible these days. I lived there for the 5 years leading up to last May.
  • Even if Brookfield/Peawaukee were actually conservative areas, conservative does not automatically equal anti-LGBT. Welcome to the 2000's. You may be thinking Waukesha which is MKE's conservative haven.

I do agree that MKE still isn't a fit for the OP's situation. Although it is the most fitting city in WI...if they must be in WI.
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Old 01-12-2017, 03:36 PM
 
Location: East TX
2,111 posts, read 2,157,330 times
Reputation: 3275
OP, can you help out a little bit and give an idea of the housing budget you are looking for?
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Old 01-14-2017, 03:09 PM
 
Location: Johnson city, ny
90 posts, read 37,457 times
Reputation: 287
Rynldsbr, budget is the issue. My husband is from Italy. We met 10 yrs ago, visits on visas during breaks back and forth between countries (both of us) first 2 yrs. Married-finished school year. I took early retirement and we all moved as a family to Italy. I had health issues and couldn't drive for schools anymore; the school board was wonderful with that and my pension. My husband's family is old small village Italian and he had been the family head since his father passed when he was 16 so the choice was for many reasons.

My son transitioned in Italy at the age of 12. We had a lot to learn, worked with that and had no problems with any issues; schools included. We were there some years but felt the kids (and myself) would still have a better future here in America for employment and college. We honestly had no clue we would meet so many problems. As I was out of the country so long, we had to re-establish domicile. I had to have a residence before arriving back here and starting the process for my husband and Fl was the place that we chose for many reasons. We had a healthy savings but the separation between the countries for the 18 months during the process drained us a lot. We pay for taxes on two countries, have had the house up for sale for some years there outside Rome. My husband was a computer programmer in Rome but after a year of having to take time off for steps in the process there in Italy, he had to explain to the company he worked for (he was sent to clients under the company throughout the city) that he was waiting to leave and eventually, after a year, they cut his hours and clients to almost nothing (work days are shorter there and employment is difficult for that and the economy).

We had to liquidate what we could per immigration guidelines and approval to get an interview. It cost a lot. With the problems here we had after arrival, the costs we had then and keep up for my son's shots, dr's, counseling, out of pocket costs for medical, etc we have only the home we recently sold. We had to pay for two households for over a year, airline tickets, lawyers, etc. There are other expenses in Italy for my mother-in-law that is drawn by the cousins through a stipend that we also add to as well. The home we sold recently (finally) was the one in Italy that we had been paying close to 3400 euros per year for in taxes and another 1200 euro for other fees outside this country. We still have some left from when we left to come back here but it's come down to pretty much only the other 97,000 euro we are expecting at closing (25,000 euro was already paid out to us a few months ago as the first negotiation to the notary and kept in our UK moneycorp account). We also are waiting for the euro to stabilize a bit more with some other concerns we have for the closing being outside the US but the buyers are excited for the home and willing to keep the closing another maximum 6 months (shooting for March).

We get rent until the year 2020 (owner finance deal) from the house here in Fl we left after the first year but wanted that to be one less thing to think about. That is something we don't add to the budget coming in but it's there. We wanted to purchase a home outright for around 60K (didn't want to push more) and keep the rest aside for anything in the future. We want to be sure everything is secure now. Our cars are good and paid for but the surgeries for our son will cut into that right off the bat as well. His school is close to 10k and is out of pocket. We don't qualify and never needed help for anything else but we also have to keep out of pocket money aside for our daughter's college (she wants to be a vet now but still not sure).

My husband is our son's step father and I can't say I respect or have found a truly better person more then him anywhere. He is the quiet support to our family and the only father my kids ever knew. Everything they know of family and good people comes from him. He sacrificed his family, career and life for us without a complaint and with unending love. He defends my son without many words but with a lot of hugs, listening, rationalization of what is happening and has been there for us as a family in the hatred my son's own father and grandfather showed after years of absence. There are no words for this man and no matter everything; we were given him as a gift. He misses his life, he loves Italy and I know he worries about his mother there. He sacrificed everything for us and he only says to our kids that he loves us and it was no sacrifice. My son chose his name to change after him and his father and it touched my husband greatly. I don't know another person alive like him.

I wanted to add that because we have a unique past years but I just have a hope of a really normal life for us. We gave up too much to go back to Italy for anything other then to check on his mother and family when needed but we have really talked about it as a family and just my husband and myself privately.

We are employable anywhere and hope only to make enough to pay normal living expenses and property taxes while keeping our savings intact. We need to always be prepared for the kids anytime in the future. We work two jobs now, I take my medication and work through it on days that are a little more difficult for my health. My husband and I work together at one job so we always can back each other up and we are both employable. He can't get the work he had in Italy-he worked there for over ten years but even the schools were confused by the transcripts translated while they don't take his reference and resume too seriously for what he did. He can become a citizen in only another 6 months due to our being married so long before entering here permanently and we have hope he may be able to do more after full citizenship but has his driver's license and other documents here for work.
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Old 01-14-2017, 05:45 PM
 
Location: IN
21,234 posts, read 36,875,259 times
Reputation: 13767
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandy2 View Post
I don't think Two Rivers is a good idea. Have you been there OP? I have and I'm quite familiar with the Manitowoc area. I wouldn't recommend it for anyone who is LGBTQ person. While there are some nice people there....it's small and full of people that have lived there forever. It wouldn't take long for everyone to know about your son and be whispering behind your backs.

If you really want to live in Wisconsin but a smaller town feel, Appleton is probably a better choice. It's a smaller population area than Milwaukee or Madison but fairly progressive for an area that small.
I would also say Stevens Point isn't a bad pick either if you're mentioning Appleton.
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Old 01-28-2017, 04:23 AM
 
279 posts, read 656,512 times
Reputation: 281
Madison or thereabouts is really the only place in wisconsin worth considering in my opinion. I really cannot say anything good about tolerance in communities in the conservative eastern part of the state, and even milwaukee. The city of milwaukee is democratic but the suburbs are far far right and very intolerant. African Americans in Milwaukee are not particularly tolerant of LGBT either.

The good news is that Madison is about as good as you will find in that respect, and I think you would find the small towns in Dane County around Madison to have similar views.

Another consideration would be Minneapolis-St Paul and inner ring suburbs, but it is going to be a bit more urban than what you may prefer. When you get out into the sticks it is Michele Bachmann territory. Probably around Woodbury or Maple Grove could work.

After the Trump election, I would say that your situation demands that you live in a comfortably "blue" area and Manitowoc/Two Rivers ain't it, nor is Green Bay, Appleton, Sheboygan, or any other town in that area.
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