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I'm a recent college grad from a UC in Northern California w/ a B.S. Computer Science.
I have a chance to work for a very small software startup in San Francisco that develops mobile games. They're doing pretty well as a startup even they only have 7 employees (one of their apps has over 1,000,000+ downloads on the Android market and high ratings = 4.7)
However, I'm also debating accepting an internship at Delta Airlines in Atlanta doing Java development. This internship is paid (about 2.5k a month, whereas the SF one is not), and involves working with an already highly established company since Delta is the world's biggest airlines.
Working for the startup:
Pros:
-It's in silicon valley and that's where I want to establish my career as a software engineer
-Would be working in a strong entrepreneurial environment/could possibly watch the company grow and have higher shares if I stick around
Cons:
-Unpaid/would also have to pay for an apartment to rent
-Not sure if it's as good experience as working for Delta since it's only a startup
-Could end up being a long daily commute to work
What do you guys think about the pros of working for a software startup in Silicon Valley? Should I stick with the Delta internship?
The startup of course. Plus - gaming software development is on fire right now. In a big company like Delta you'd probably be given some Mickey Mouse project to do - larger corporations generally don't do a good job developing in-house applications, and there is a lot of politicking going on in their IT departments.
Wait... if the internship at the startup is unpaid, how do you intend to pay for the apartment? California is not cheap at all...
If you can handle that without destroying yourself financially, the startup would probably be more fun and certainly more interesting, IMHO. However, if working there is basically open-ended without pay, that would present some obvious financial problems long-term.
I have personal experience interning at a very large established company as a software engineer. Experiences can truly vary even with large companies.
At the large company, I thought they gave me great work to do overall as they had me do actual programming in Java, C, and C++. It was a paid internship too.
If I were you (I'm assuming you got the offer from Delta already) I'd call your prospective manager at Delta and ask what you would be doing day to day. Like I know it's Java but ask what role would you play on whatever project you are on (actual programming vs running test scripts all day).
In full agreement with NJBest. If you don't have an immediate need for money, pick the opportunity which will teach you the craft of software development while nourturing your interest in it.
As an intern at delta (or any large corporation), you most likely wouldn't be involved in any meaty/meaningfull project.
Even if you were, your role will be severely limited ( documentation or small bug fixes ).
Most start-up environments are very conducive to learning.
You will write/design stuff from scratch whereas in big corporations, you will mostly "assemble" projects ( either from 3rd party libraries or in-house stuff that has been previously written ).
As as aspiring developer, your aim should be to learn as much as you can. Once you have done so, money will surely follow.
(** To mention again, all this is only applicable if you don't have a need for money. If you do, delta it is ).
Last edited by CaptainHastings; 07-31-2012 at 10:41 AM..
Under normal circumstances, I would say go with the biggest name possible when it comes to internships. It opens up way more doors later on. But in your case, you are choosing between two different industry.
You need to ask yourself what is your ultimate goal. Do you want to work as a software developer in the tech industry or do you want to do software development for another industry (i.e. finance, airline, etc.).
Do you know of other people who did internship at Delta or the startup? You should talk to them to see what their experience was like.
In my experience, the bigger company tend to have better programs/infrastructure in place to train interns. The bigger company also need to worry about long term maintenance of their code, so they tend to have better coding "best practices" in place, which is a good thing for new software engineers to learn. Startups go at a much faster speed, they might or not have the bandwidth to give you the guidance you might need. The ad hoc nature of a lot startups makes for some bad coding habits. But you will probably get experience in a lot more areas in a startup, then being silo to a particular thing in a big company.
I actually find it a bit unusual that your "internship" is done after you graduated. Most in the industry is done while the student is still enrolled. And in California, it might actually be illegal for the internship to be unpaid (they did change the law in 2010), it depends on the responsibility they ask you to take on. Most internships (in the tech industry) here are paid. This startup might not know (or are deliberately) ignoring the law.
If money is not an issue for you, I would go with the start-up. Remember, the Bay area cost-of-living (COL) is nearly twice that of Atlanta. You have 2 great choices either way, good luck.
Delta is a very large company to work for and very mature and possibly regimented from your point of view. Atlanta is a great place to start your career but if you don't have a lot of personal financial obligations, go with the unpaid internship. The Atlanta market is not a bad place to start for someone like you, just it doesn't have the high tech lure that Silicon Valley has by any means.
Delta without a doubt. Fortune 500 experience on a resume is excellent.
I think Java is more common than gaming as far as software development jobs. I think they are both great but Java is used in many industries where gaming is more specialized. but mobile app development might be some good experience to take forward as it will continue to grow. This could pigeon hole you into a unique specialty where maybe there are fewer opportunies in the future due to the unique specialization. Or you could be in a fast growing specialty that will balloon. But there is a risk. Java is already here and very common and does not appear to be on the way out any time soon.
Where do you want to go with your specialties?
At Delta, with the Java, you are likely going to be getting database experience as well...Oracle, SQL and other stuff which are very important on you resume. This is because Java apps usually interface with a database. I am not sure how much the gaming apps deal with a database, maybe for storing the points total and other stuff.
You goal is to get as many bullet points of experience as possible. Because future jobs want you to have lots of bullet points.
Also, since Delta is a paid job, it is real life work experience on your resume. An unpaid internship wont' be taken as seriously on your resume.
Once you are in at Delta, it will be a ton easier to get offered a good salaried position at Delta if this is what you want. I think you will gain a much better resume from Delta.
Also at the startup you might be working 70 hour weeks. At Delta you most likely will be working a 40 hour a week.
My biggest issue is whether the potential unique experience of a startup would make up for it being unpaid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsuric
I have personal experience interning at a very large established company as a software engineer. Experiences can truly vary even with large companies.
At the large company, I thought they gave me great work to do overall as they had me do actual programming in Java, C, and C++. It was a paid internship too.
Do you think I would learn better coding practices and even be a more skilled programmer if I interned at a larger company like Delta instead of a startup?
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainHastings
As an intern at delta (or any large corporation), you most likely wouldn't be involved in any meaty/meaningfull project.
Even if you were, your role will be severely limited ( documentation or small bug fixes ).
Most start-up environments are very conducive to learning.
You will write/design stuff from scratch whereas in big corporations, you will mostly "assemble" projects ( either from 3rd party libraries or in-house stuff that has been previously written ).
From what I've heard, most startups don't assign you with a large responsibility right away. At this internship, I'd like just be refilling coffee occasionally, responding to customer complaints via email, and maybe a bit of coding. Do you really feel that I'd get a better programming experience working for a startup as opposed to at large company?
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnomatic
In my experience, the bigger company tend to have better programs/infrastructure in place to train interns. The bigger company also need to worry about long term maintenance of their code, so they tend to have better coding "best practices" in place, which is a good thing for new software engineers to learn. Startups go at a much faster speed, they might or not have the bandwidth to give you the guidance you might need. The ad hoc nature of a lot startups makes for some bad coding habits. But you will probably get experience in a lot more areas in a startup, then being silo to a particular thing in a big company.
Do you think interning at a Fortune 500 vs a startup will limit my options later? I've heard that startups have a certain disdain towards large corporations, and I'm sort of worried that interning at Delta could be a hindrance toward working with startups later
Quote:
Originally Posted by sware2cod
Delta without a doubt. Fortune 500 experience on a resume is excellent.
Where do you want to go with your specialties?
Also, since Delta is a paid job, it is real life work experience on your resume. An unpaid internship wont' be taken as seriously on your resume.
Once you are in at Delta, it will be a ton easier to get offered a good salaried position at Delta if this is what you want. I think you will gain a much better resume from Delta.
I'm pretty young (22 yrs), so I'm not sure where I'd like to start in the field, but I'd much prefer having a good and stable salary working for an established company like Google or Facebook, build some capital, and then maybe fund my own startup a few years down the road.
Also, why do you feel that an internship at Delta would be taken more seriously than one at a startup? I would've thought working for a startup conveys a true passion for coding and a greater sense of responsibility and initiative.
Do you think if I wanted to work for a large company like Google, then interning at a large company like Delta would be a bonus over a smaller startup?
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