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Old 03-17-2012, 11:11 PM
 
647 posts, read 1,420,030 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunnnee View Post
I just went through this mess and it wasn't easy. I was laid off of my job after 7 years and I had to start all over again at the age of 40. I was competing with kids with Degrees, although the job stated they wanted someone with experience. Not knocking anyone with a degree (good for you), but it was frustrating because I knew I had the skills to do the same job. What they don't tell you is that "piece of paper" is what they want or prefer, so when you get that email stating why you didn't get the job, they state someone else has qualifications more than you. Whatever...if you are faced with this, KEEP APPLYING anyway if they say they want one or not.

Another note: Your resume has to be spot on and you need to clearly state your accomplishments and not what software programs you know. That helps, but employers want to know what you can do for them. When I re-did my resume I got some valuable tips from Blue Sky resumes (Google them) and it was the difference from no interviews to my phone ringing off the hook. After a month off of work, I got an offer for $26k more than my last job and it's better than the last.

Note: one interview I was on, the CEO stated he made the mistake of hiring someone fresh out of college because they had a degree and they turned out to be a total idiot and he had to hold her hands the entire time. Lesson-learned as he stated, and now was on the hunt for someone with experience.

Keep applying and never give up because the right job will come along. For one company that doesn't hire you, there is another company out there that will.
You have to remember that the person with the Degree isn't always fresh out of college with no experience. This is the problem that you could have been running into.
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Old 03-18-2012, 12:12 AM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,697 posts, read 24,776,639 times
Reputation: 28382
Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
With the exception of certain jobs (engineer or jobs requiring certification under Federal law) we look for experience over education any day. It's too bad more employers don't do the same. Glad you found one of the smart ones.
I have plenty of friends with college degrees who I would never hire if I owned my own business. I think employers are finding a glut of college educated young people, with less resources available to determine who will be a good worker and who won't be. Many younger folks with degrees are complaining that it requires experience, or other somethings they don't have, to find any decent jobs...

The governments push to get everyone in college accomplished just that... Unfortunately, getting a college degree does not magically create the demand for a college educated worker. This was all a last ditch effort by a blunderous government trying to convince the masses that things would be all right if you just based your next 4-5 years of decision making on their breath. Now we a have a lot of young people starting behind in life, who will not be buying homes in the next 5 years, who can not finance a new car, and who probably wouldn't last long doing manual labor after all that college desk work. What the heck did we expect to happen to our young folks? They aren't even good with a shovel anymore... Where did you parents expect them to land besides your couch?
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Old 03-18-2012, 04:27 AM
 
24,488 posts, read 41,059,670 times
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I've hired people solely on the college degree even when I know they weren't the best performer. It makes sense sometimes.
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Old 03-18-2012, 05:37 AM
 
5,904 posts, read 4,408,293 times
Reputation: 13437
Quote:
What they don't tell you is that "piece of paper" is what they want or prefer
I really have come to resent this idea that a lot of people trot out that a degree is just a piece of paper. This is not so much me venting at you, but this idea in general.

The difference between me as an 18 year old coming out of high school and what I am now at 23 coming out of a 5 year accounting program to sit for the CPA exam is substantial. My communication skills are excellent--both written and spoken...my attitude is different, the workload I can handle is 100X what it was, my ability think about things, the professional contacts I've met. The idea that it's just a piece of paper is absurd. I am an entirely different person. I went from a kid to a professional.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:17 AM
 
4,307 posts, read 6,251,774 times
Reputation: 6102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thatsright19 View Post
I really have come to resent this idea that a lot of people trot out that a degree is just a piece of paper. This is not so much me venting at you, but this idea in general.

The difference between me as an 18 year old coming out of high school and what I am now at 23 coming out of a 5 year accounting program to sit for the CPA exam is substantial. My communication skills are excellent--both written and spoken...my attitude is different, the workload I can handle is 100X what it was, my ability think about things, the professional contacts I've met. The idea that it's just a piece of paper is absurd. I am an entirely different person. I went from a kid to a professional.
Yes, but you have to realize that there are 1000's of you for every few jobs. At my company, we do have entry-level business analysts that we hire every year. However, I'd say that most of them were rock stars while in school (super high grades, multiple relevant internships, extra-curriculars where they exhibited their leadership skills, etc). The few others that weren't stars probably had connections at the Senior Leadership levels to get the job.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,697 posts, read 24,776,639 times
Reputation: 28382
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thatsright19 View Post
I really have come to resent this idea that a lot of people trot out that a degree is just a piece of paper. This is not so much me venting at you, but this idea in general.

The difference between me as an 18 year old coming out of high school and what I am now at 23 coming out of a 5 year accounting program to sit for the CPA exam is substantial. My communication skills are excellent--both written and spoken...my attitude is different, the workload I can handle is 100X what it was, my ability think about things, the professional contacts I've met. The idea that it's just a piece of paper is absurd. I am an entirely different person. I went from a kid to a professional.
There is a stark contrast between the young person capable of completing a 5 year accounting program and passing the CPA exam, and the typical HS grad that cannot. The paper is more a way filter and determine who is who... Sure, they teach you some neat tricks in college... The real learning takes place on the job though in most professions. That's where you earn your stripes.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:16 AM
 
750 posts, read 1,444,306 times
Reputation: 1165
People just do not get this is the new reality. Permanent good paying jobs are being replaced. Temp work part time unpaid interns contract work ect. Technology has eliminated tons of entry level jobs. Add in the fact many of these jobs were sent overseas. Why pay someone 25k to 35k and full benefits. Hire someone in India for 3 to 5 bucks an hour to do your back office jobs. Every year you have an over supply of college grads. To be used as free interns and temps year in year out. I worked as a unpaid intern for 9 months then as a temp for 7 and a half months. When full time workers retired where I worked they were not replaced. The work was chopped up given to others. What was left was given to the interns and temps. People had been temps for years 10 bucks an hour no benefits. I actually did more higher end work as a unpaid intern then as a temp. Technology allows more work to be done with less workers. Which is driving a major paradigm shift in the economy.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:31 AM
 
5,652 posts, read 19,317,100 times
Reputation: 4106
"There are few real entry level jobs left in America in any field. I graduated college two years ago with a degree in graphic design." UMM how old is this thread as i cannot tell... BUT if you expect to find a job in graphic design now, you have picked just about the worst field possible. Hate to say it, but unless you have talents in web design and or interactive, you are mostly only going to be working freelance or temp jobs that are maybe part time.

I see cr*p like this a lot, temporary for a three month assignment. Temporary for 3 days a week.... print is dying and all the designers with print skills are starting to phase into web design OR get out of the field completely (me). I know many award winning designers who got laid off when I did in 2008 and are still freelancing. Unless you are looking to freelance, forget about getting a full time gig. Personally I found the field highly age-ist and yes they want 2-5 years experience, but no more than that as they pay sux. Administrative assistants who require almost no experience and have only to learn microsoft word programs which largely do not change hardly ever make almost the same money. As a designer in an ad agency, you will be working salary and working lots of overtime and weekends. IF you are lucky enough to get into a corporation and into their art or marketing department is it great, but those jobs are almost impossible to get as people stay in them for a long time and do not leave unless absolutely necessary.

I would start at temp agencies and work your way and possibly into a company... 7 interviews in 2 years is not entirely unbelievable as this is how dismal graphic design is. ALL the companies that a few years ago were perfectly OK with just an associates and a good portfolio all of a sudden want a bachelors degree. There is a definite disconnect in what HR is interviewing for and what skills the company actually needs as graphic design is a very specific field that a lot of people do not really understand. So you will have issues there. MANY of the jobs in the field are foudn through networking, in fact MOST of them. So unless you know someone, you may not even get a job as they are already filled and will not hit any websites.

To get around this, you can try to join a trade association, this will also show you are serious.

If I were you, I would work to get yourself a killer portfolio, make sure it is online as that is the only way people will see it nowadays. Call up the temp agencies and ask them what skills they are looking for, you will see that some of the positions they want to be cheap and get a web developer as well as a graphic designer - the old 2-for-1 b.s.... and then study those skills. You will notice that since web design and development is such a new field that the requirements for what people are looking for change about every other year. REALLY annoying... the field is like the IT field now you have to keep up with the latest and greatest or hit the road.

You might also consider going back to school to get web development certificates or a degree in marketing. I know of what I speak as I was a designer for 28 years until 2008 when the financial armageddon happened and I sucessfully segued into marketing.

Go into web design/development, or get excellent photoshop skills to do retouching, there is always someone looking for a really good photoshop expert. Again - start with the temp agencies! GOOD luck!!

Last edited by gardener34; 03-18-2012 at 11:40 AM..
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Old 03-18-2012, 01:22 PM
 
750 posts, read 1,444,306 times
Reputation: 1165
The thing people do not get is it structural unemployment. You can send overseas or eliminate many jobs by the use of technology. This goes for high end middle and low end work. More fields are going to freelance and contractors. No benefits or long term cost. Add in your temps your part timers your interns. I think your going to see less and less full time jobs overall. It will take some years but we are moving that way. We have a surplus of almost every type of worker in the US. Yes their are some niche fields and skill set were we need people. But we have 30 million people unemployed and underemployed in the US. The whole thing now is do more with less. I see no reason for that to change. So now you see 3 jobs in 1 that is the deal. I saw an article a few years back saying how the unpaid internship was the new entry level job. You see alot of ads that say entry level but it is not. They want 3 to 7 years experience in some specialized skill sets. The pay is entry is level the skills are not. There are very few entry level jobs these days.
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
29,697 posts, read 24,776,639 times
Reputation: 28382
Quote:
Originally Posted by collegeguy35 View Post
Why pay someone 25k to 35k and full benefits.
Umm, you don't seriously believe 25K-35K is enough to live on, do you?
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