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Old 12-18-2013, 07:08 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
20,784 posts, read 18,328,607 times
Reputation: 21177

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Seriously, for all the complaining... It's like everyone thinks the grass is greener on the other side! I promise you, it is not... For 6 years, I have avoided hiring anyone for the various projects I have undertook. If it meant I had to work 16 hours a day for a week, I'd gladly take that over dealing with the incompetence of others. I know the way I like things done. They are not the easy way, but they are the right way, and they net the results I seek. That is usually a labor of love more than a way to bring in money.

I sleep much better at night knowing I put in a genuine effort in what I set out to do. Unfortunately, I rarely deal with "wage slaves" who feel the same way about work. What they fail to realize... Profit margins are slim for average quality anything. If you're capable of offering exceptional quality in any product or service you offer, you can charge more. People also call back when they need more work done, or they refer you to others. How can I pay someone more if they are only willing to be "average"?

I have attempted to hire in the past. I even paid decent for the work. Often times, a "helper" stood to do better than I hourly, since much of my time was spent actually securing the work. While I might make $20/hr on the project, when factoring in the time scouting out the work, it may have been closer to $16/hr... And I have even offered up to $18/hr for good help.

Here's what happens when I find "good help"... One guy pukes after 20 minutes of working. Says he doesn't like the smell of oil and is going home. I clearly stated the job would involve (protected) contact with oil and various forms of sludge prior to bringing the guy on... Left high and dry, I'm stuck working 14 hours a day in order to meet the quoted timeline.

Another guy started, and worked ok for a couple hours... Than he started whining about supposed breaks that were required by federal law. According to this work horse, workers are required breaks every 2 hours, paid by the employer. Apparently, he was a laid off auto workers and that's how things ran in the plant. Ya... He didn't last long.

Brought one guy on who tried to tell me what tasks should be assigned to him. Naturally, he wanted the easy stuff... Ya, that didn't work out. Had one guy that wanted to hit the bathroom every hour and half. Being that he was "suited up", that meant he had to remove his protective boot covers, protective suit, gloves, etc... A single bathroom break could easily run 20 minutes.

I have done an awful lot of off the beaten path work in the past. Never have I found any incentive to seek help. It's just not available in the form that I seek... Competent and without tons of baggage. Since I refuse to hire illegals, who many employers seem to prefer, I guess I'll be working in solitude should I continue down this path. From the perspective of a full time employed "wage slave"... I value the security that a steady paycheck offers, without all the hassle of jumping hurdles (finding decent employees).
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:16 PM
 
3,083 posts, read 5,112,978 times
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I thought you were a machinist. Now you've taken on the role of business owner/hiring manager? Interesting.

Did this happen recently? Was this before or after your attended "U of M"?
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
20,784 posts, read 18,328,607 times
Reputation: 21177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tekkie View Post
I thought you were a machinist. Now you've taken on the role of business owner/hiring manager? Interesting.
I have worked in many roles. Industrial maintenance (where I have tried to hire the most), in home care while in nursing school, private cleaning for banquet halls, churches, etc, on call contractor of sorts for jobs within my current occupation. Jack of all trades perhaps? My current goal is to begin making my own products on a small scale. I have the inventory, but I don't know the proper channels to connect it with the consumer.

Much of this work I don't mess with anymore because there is not enough available time to devote to it. I prefer projects that I can do at my own pace, which is a rarity. I would love to start my own business, and be able to devote a full time schedule to it, but it's not practical at this point. Worse yet, it's barely profitable in the current environment.

There's tons of work available that people need done. The usual problem is finding someone who can do it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tekkie View Post
Did this happen recently? Was this before or after your attended "U of M"?
I've been working since I was 15. When I worked full time, I would secure small projects. When I went to college, I rarely worked as an employee. It was easier to find projects and contract gigs. Paid better and I didn't have to go home smelling like french fries.
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:29 PM
 
3,083 posts, read 5,112,978 times
Reputation: 3524
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
I have worked in many roles. Industrial maintenance (where I have tried to hire the most), in home care while in nursing school, private cleaning for banquet halls, churches, etc, on call contractor of sorts for jobs within my current occupation. Jack of all trades perhaps?

Much of this work I don't mess with anymore because there is not enough available time to devote to it. I prefer projects that I can do at my own pace, which is a rarity. I would love to start my own business, and be able to devote a full time schedule to it, but it's not practical at this point. Worse yet, it's barely profitable in the current environment.

There's tons of work available that people need done. The usual problem is finding someone who can do it.
Well, I've "hired" many other businesses to provide products or services for me. Sometimes they suck, sometimes they are great. That's why we have rating sites like Yelp.

Can't you take your current skill set and start a business with minimal start up cost and overhead? For example, I suggested that my mechanically-inclined brother start up a traveling car repair business where he'd come to you to perform the services. That way he doesn't have the expense of a garage to worry about. I've thought about opening up a travelling bicycle repair shop myself. As far as finding good help, it's a process just like finding a good restaurant.
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:40 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
20,784 posts, read 18,328,607 times
Reputation: 21177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tekkie View Post
Well, I've "hired" many other businesses to provide products or services for me. Sometimes they suck, sometimes they are great. That's why we have rating sites like Yelp.

Can't you take your current skill set and start a business with minimal start up cost and overhead? For example, I suggested that my mechanically-inclined brother start up a traveling car repair business where he'd come to you to perform the services. That way he doesn't have the expense of a garage to worry about. I've thought about opening up a travelling bicycle repair shop myself. As far as finding good help, it's a process just like finding a good restaurant.
That depends what type of work it would be. I could very easily restart my industrial maintenance gig. It's more like contract work, but anyways... The work is hard on the body for one thing. That's the main reason I left. I could easily make $30/hr on a lot of that work, but the more you do it, the more you feel it, and the more it slows you down. Pretty soon, a job you've quoted to pay you $30/hr is now paying $20/hr because it's physically taking you longer to perform the work. Towards the end, I was having issues with hypotension from all the bending, stooping, and then standing. My body was telling me it was time to find something else to do...

The natural progression for a machinist looking to start a business is to open a machine shop. Judging by the average shop rates, we have enough already. Profitability depends entirely on finding competent, intelligent and creative workers. Good luck in that pursuit... All the good ones are working. You can try to pay more, but then you can't compete on the price point, and corporations are all about finding the cheapest outfit to widdle their widgets... Even if the company is cutting corners and sending out occasional garbage work. There are simply too many reasons not to go down that path.

If I had my druthers, I would get a captains license and do what my uncle does... Delivers boats. Every job is an adventure, and an opportunity to drink in new and exciting dives.
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:52 PM
 
3,083 posts, read 5,112,978 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post

If I had my druthers, I would get a captains license and do what my uncle does... Delivers boats. Every job is an adventure, and an opportunity to drink in new and exciting dives.
Why don't you do this? Why not find another field where you can apply your current experience and skill set and make more money?
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Old 12-18-2013, 07:54 PM
 
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
40,011 posts, read 31,617,054 times
Reputation: 37629
So you're not a good judge of potential employees. Got it. Lots of people aren't.
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Old 12-18-2013, 08:12 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
20,784 posts, read 18,328,607 times
Reputation: 21177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tekkie View Post
Why don't you do this? Why not find another field where you can apply your current experience and skill set and make more money?
Because I have a comfortable job that pays a secure paycheck. After my 40 hours, I have an entire shop to myself where I can build my inventory of products I sell. The next step will be to find new channels to sell my products, and farming out more work to local business (who are better at finding decent workers I would imagine).

I also get a discount through my employer for the basic materials. I'm too small to order through the big suppliers, but when the boss orders material, I can order with him, getting a quantity discount along with business discount. I also get free heat treating when I send my parts with the owners work, since they pay by for the oven space, and not by the quantity. I get discounts for other secondary work like electro polish, anodizing, etc. That greatly expands the possibilities regarding what I can make and sell, along with the profit per unit.

If I were to do this on my own, I would be working for peanuts. The downside is I do not have an abundance of time to devote to this type of venture.
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Old 12-18-2013, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
6,426 posts, read 8,427,938 times
Reputation: 9598
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
One guy pukes after 20 minutes of working. Says he doesn't like the smell of oil and is going home. I clearly stated the job would involve (protected) contact with oil and various forms of sludge prior to bringing the guy on...
Your goal is to find and keep an employee who vomits on exposure to the work environment?
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Old 12-18-2013, 08:54 PM
 
Location: Metro Detroit, Michigan
20,784 posts, read 18,328,607 times
Reputation: 21177
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moby Hick View Post
Your goal is to find and keep an employee who vomits on exposure to the work environment?
Absolutely not. Just highlighting the difficulty of actually finding decent help. I'm inclined to believe that much of the "good help" is already working. What remains is often times the not so good help... Exceptions always exist, but sifting through the mess is a job in of itself.
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