Which countries have very strong state/provincial identities? (buy, area)

[AnnieA]

Originally Posted by Acajack

The only time Montreal has ever had more English speakers than French speakers was for about 10 or 20 years in the mid 1800s. What was true up until the mid 1970s was that English speakers and their language dominated many spheres of life in the city. They were a dominant minority, even though they were not the biggest group in the city.

French speakers have been the largest group in the city of Montreal for roughly 350 of the city's 370 years of history.

Gad, it's good to see a post where someone knows what they are talking about.......

[Trimac20]

Originally Posted by

I also forgot to mention the UK and thought I had it on the list for this topic. I was going to edit my recent post and include the UK but it is too late to edit that post.

Yeah, other than Scotland state/provincial identity and idea of independence movement, there is also a similar situation with Wales, even though that is less distinguished and popular by the locals compared to Scotland. Also, there is the England and Ireland conflict that was related to Northern Ireland.

The England part of UK itself seems to have a South vs. North state/provincial identity.

Do you agree with all of those other countries I mentioned?

I was wondering whether to include 'regional identity' in my OP but decided against it because many countries have regional identities which do not necessarily correspond to political administrative boundaries.

Belgium or Switzerland are bound to have regional diversity because of language and cultural regions.

There is a North/South divide in England. The accents between the two differ markedly. More than between a Southern US accent and the rest, imo. I think regional identity (Yorkie, Geordie, Scouse) is still a big identifier in the UK.

I think Canada isn't diverse for it' size...the only thing that really sticks out is Quebec and Newfoundland. Compared to Indonesia, with it's dozens of languages and ethnic/tribal groups, Canada is culturally homogeneous but diverse in terms of multiculturalism. So a different type of diversity.

Originally Posted by Trimac20

I was wondering whether to include 'regional identity' in my OP but decided against it because many countries have regional identities which do not necessarily correspond to political administrative boundaries.

Belgium or Switzerland are bound to have regional diversity because of language and cultural regions.

There is a North/South divide in England. The accents between the two differ markedly. More than between a Southern US accent and the rest, imo. I think regional identity (Yorkie, Geordie, Scouse) is still a big identifier in the UK.

I think Canada isn't diverse for it' size...the only thing that really sticks out is Quebec and Newfoundland. Compared to Indonesia, with it's dozens of languages and ethnic/tribal groups, Canada is culturally homogeneous but diverse in terms of multiculturalism. So a different type of diversity.

Yeah, I agree that the choice of wording was better with “state/provincial” identity compared to “regional identity.” The exact wording can make such a significant difference.

I noticed the countries than can make the list for this topic can vary a lot in geographic size.

Belgium and Switzerland are impressive for them to be included in this list for their relatively small geographic size and some other examples similar to that too.

Also, there are plenty of countries with a relatively big geographic size that still do not make this list.

I think Canada still has plenty of strong state/provincial identity such as Ontario vs. Quebec vs. British Columbia vs. Alberta vs. Manitoba vs. Saskatchewan.

I didn't think Australia has that much state/provincial identity for its size. Or is there?

I think that if a place is multicultural, it is less likely to be culturally homogenous.

Yeah, Indonesia is noteworthy enough to qualify for the list. It is quite underrated for that. For some examples, Indonesia has thousands of different islands (17,508 to 18,306 islands total, 8,444 named islands, and up to 922 islands permanently inhabited.) Also, Indonesia has up to 738 different languages. That makes very strong provincial/state identity guaranteed to happen.

All British England people sound very similar to me, regardless of region. Lol The North vs. South regional divide comes more from other things.

[Trimac20]

Originally Posted by

Yeah, I agree that the choice of wording was better with “state/provincial” identity compared to “regional identity.” The exact wording can make such a significant difference.

I noticed the countries than can make the list for this topic can vary a lot in geographic size.

Belgium and Switzerland are impressive for them to be included in this list for their relatively small geographic size and some other examples similar to that too.

Also, there are plenty of countries with a relatively big geographic size that still do not make this list.

I think Canada still has plenty of strong state/provincial identity such as Ontario vs. Quebec vs. British Columbia vs. Alberta vs. Manitoba vs. Saskatchewan.

I didn't think Australia has that much state/provincial identity for its size. Or is there?

I think that if a place is multicultural, it is less likely to be culturally homogenous.

Yeah, Indonesia is noteworthy enough to qualify for the list. It is quite underrated for that. For some examples, Indonesia has thousands of different islands (17,508 to 18,306 islands total, 8,444 named islands, and up to 922 islands permanently inhabited.) Also, Indonesia has up to 738 different languages. That makes very strong provincial/state identity guaranteed to happen.

All British England people sound very similar to me, regardless of region. Lol The North vs. South regional divide comes more from other things.

All the Brits sound the same? Watch Eastenders vs Coronation Street for a start.


EastEnders: Sonia Has a 'Surprise' Baby - YouTube


2012-02-10: Coronation Street - Episode 1 - YouTube

No Australian states are not very different to each other, although we like to play up the differences.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by

I think Canada still has plenty of strong state/provincial identity such as Ontario vs. Quebec vs. British Columbia vs. Alberta vs. Manitoba vs. Saskatchewan.

Ontario vs. Alberta vs. Nova Scotia = Texas vs. New York vs. California

Quebec vs. the rest of Canada = Geneva vs. Zurich vs. Lugano, Flanders vs. Wallonia

Originally Posted by Acajack

Ontario vs. Alberta vs. Nova Scotia = Texas vs. New York vs. California

Quebec vs. the rest of Canada = Geneva vs. Zurich vs. Lugano, Flanders vs. Wallonia

Yeah. There is much more to Canada's very strong provincial/state identity other than Quebec.

What about British Columbia, Manitoba, and Saskatchewan vs. the other provinces?


The most conspicuous for very strong state/provincial identity in Canada seems to be British Columbia vs. Ontario vs. Quebec. After that, there are still other noticeable examples too that we both mentioned.

I didn’t know that about Nova Scotia. I thought that was one of the places with the least amount of state/provincial identity in Canada.

Yes, there is the regionalist vs. separatist type of identity for this such as what you mentioned for Canada. The regionalist non-separatist example: Ontario vs. Alberta vs. British Columbia= New York vs. Texas vs. California

The much more separatist example: Quebec vs. the rest of Canada =Flanders vs. Wallonia areas of Belgium.


Personally, I think it is much better for Canada to keep Quebec and also better for Quebec too. However, it should be an important priority for Quebec to maintain its French language culture. Do you and most Canadians agree currently?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by

What about British Columbia, Manitoba, and Saskatchewan vs. the other provinces?

The most conspicuous for very strong state/provincial identity in Canada seems to be British Columbia vs. Ontario vs. Quebec. After that, there are still other noticeable examples too that we both mentioned.

I didn’t know that about Nova Scotia. I thought that was one of the places with the least amount of state/provincial identity in Canada.

Yes, there is the regionalist vs. separatist type of identity for this such as what you mentioned for Canada. The regionalist non-separatist type: Ontario vs. Alberta vs. British Columbia= New York vs. Texas vs. California

The much more separatist type: Quebec vs. the rest of Canada =Flanders vs. Wallonia areas of Belgium.

Actually, I didn't split up my examples in separatism vs. non-separatism terms, nor in linguistic vs. non-linguistic terms. They just came off the top of my head as examples of the two types of regional differences. Regardless, the Quebec-in-Canada, Belgian and Swiss examples are examples of places that have a "foreignness" to each other. Not to everyone, but let's be honest to most people when you move between these areas it sort of feels like going to a different country. Sure, some people say that Texas feels like a foreign country to a New Englander, but you can't have travelled much if you think this.

As for the various provinces of Canada, yes some people seem to think that there are deep differences between them. Even between each of the mainly English-speaking ones, and some people say that they every bit as different between each other as Quebec is from the rest.

There are also differences within the provinces themselves: southern vs. central Alberta, Cape Breton vs. the rest of Nova Scotia, etc.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by

Personally, I think it is much better for Canada to keep Quebec and also better for Quebec too. However, it should be an important priority for Quebec to maintain its French language culture. Do you and most Canadians agree currently?

Opinions vary widely.

As you probably know, a good chunk of the population in Quebec wants to separate and form its own country. The percentage varies by 10% or so either way but generally it has remained in the 40% range (plus or minus 10%) for the past 30-35 years.

The Canadian population outside of Quebec tends to be quite predominantly opposed to Quebec separation, but there is a 10-20% chunk that is fed up and has the attitude of "let them go!".

Also, and oddly enough, a decent percentage of the English-speaking population in Canada is opposed to Quebec separation primarily for territorial and symbolic reasons, and aren't particularly fond of the people living in the province.

Finally, with respect to language, most Canadians outside Quebec could be said to be indifferent to French (don't care about learning it, don't care if people in Quebec speak it either). However, a significant minority does think Quebec should get with the program and move towards English so that it can finally become a "normal" (sic) part of Canada like the other provinces.

There is also outside of Quebec a decent-sized minority of people who think that French is an important part of Canada's heritage and that it should be preserved and who are supporting of efforts in that direction. Some of these people have learned French as a second language, although some people are supportive of the "French fact" in spite of the fact they speak only English.

[minibrings]

Originally Posted by Chava61

Israel is a very small country and doesn't have separate states/provinces. So yes I did read your question.

You read it but didnot understnd it. He was looking for sttes/provinces WITHIN a country. Not a country in its entirety. But you could hve discerned tht from his description of Australian states, a country you comment on.

[Trimac20]

^ For it's size I don't feel the Canadian provinces are diverse outside Quebec. How is BC different from Alberta? They both cover such few areas. Landscape of course but I'm talking culture and people. For their sizes Canada and Australia aren't diverse, their regional identity is a result of sheer distance. There's nothing really distinct about WA or NSW. If anything Queensland and Tasmania probably have the most distinctive character.