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Old 04-26-2012, 08:35 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Australia has an evangelical element too, even a politic party that is based on Christian values.
its not remotley influential on a broad scale
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:39 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Well, not everything people do abroad in the name of protestantism actually is protestant. Most Germans and Scandinavians of any church affiliation have no understanding whatsoever for Northern Ireland or the bible belt in the US.
i thought the point of protestantism was that no one person or body gets to decide whats right , who are you to say that jerry falwell was wrong and the present archbishop of canterbury ( seen as a liberal ) is right ?

serious protestantism in the usa strives to infuse faith into politics and the state , much more so than catholicism or devout catholics try to infuse religon into politics in italy , spain or ireland , i accept that lutherans in germany and scandanavia keep thier nose out of politics too but thats only because northern europe is a post religon place , protestantism is about evangelising the word of god everywhere you go
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:45 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Originally Posted by irish_bob View Post
australia doesnt really fit the mould , its an irreligous country , i dont think politics is informed by religon on any level
It's not the US, no, and most big issues aren't relatively trivial but controversial things like gay marriage, rather things like the carbon tax or the policies on refugees, for instance.

Yet there still is, I think, a preference among some of the religious for certain politics who espouse 'conservative' values. The leader of the opposition, a Catholic, is seem as conservative and right-wing by many 'liberal' people here, while the current PM, an atheist, isn't seen well by a lot of religious people (and heck, by most people in general). I don't think many fervent Christians would vote for the Greens (who for instance are for legalizing marijuana and gay rights).

There is some of that American style polarization that you might not find in Europe, but no, the 'evangelical' vote isn't as important in politics here.
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:48 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
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Originally Posted by irish_bob View Post
i thought the point of protestantism was that no one person or body gets to decide whats right , who are you to say that jerry falwell was wrong and the present archbishop of canterbury ( seen as a liberal ) is right ?
I am not saying what is right, only that from a German perspective - regardless of church affiliation - Falwell, Graham etc. are ridiculous and dangerous extremists...
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:53 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I am not saying what is right, only that from a German perspective - regardless of church affiliation - Falwell, Graham etc. are ridiculous and dangerous extremists...
Maybe Falwell, but although he's been friendly with presidents both Republican and Democratic, Graham is pretty apolitical and I don't really see how he's an 'extremist' either.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:06 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Maybe Falwell, but although he's been friendly with presidents both Republican and Democratic, Graham is pretty apolitical and I don't really see how he's an 'extremist' either.
Germans tend to be rather relaxed about religion. To us anyone proselytizing and preaching fairy tale content is a religious extremist
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:12 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
It's not the US, no, and most big issues aren't relatively trivial but controversial things like gay marriage, rather things like the carbon tax or the policies on refugees, for instance.

Yet there still is, I think, a preference among some of the religious for certain politics who espouse 'conservative' values. The leader of the opposition, a Catholic, is seem as conservative and right-wing by many 'liberal' people here, while the current PM, an atheist, isn't seen well by a lot of religious people (and heck, by most people in general). I don't think many fervent Christians would vote for the Greens (who for instance are for legalizing marijuana and gay rights).

There is some of that American style polarization that you might not find in Europe, but no, the 'evangelical' vote isn't as important in politics here.
the most conservative australian prime minister of the past several decades was john howard , an anglican , thier is no correlation between catholicism and conservatism in politics
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:15 AM
 
7,855 posts, read 10,295,464 times
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I am not saying what is right, only that from a German perspective - regardless of church affiliation - Falwell, Graham etc. are ridiculous and dangerous extremists...
thier is a wide spectrum of protestant thought and opinion which is why i said protestants tend to often lie on either end of the spectrum which is why its inaccurate to more associate catholicism with conservativism or the right , the catholic church is certainly authoritarian and hierarchical but that doesnt make it conservative through and through , cuba is an authoritarian state yet few conservatives would label it conservative
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:20 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Germans tend to be rather relaxed about religion. To us anyone proselytizing and preaching fairy tale content is a religious extremist
believe it or not , nowadays , most catholics in ireland are relaxed about religon , this despite the fact that church attendance is high by european standards , a lot of irish people go to church for social reason , fundamentalism of the kind you see in the southern states of the usa is exceptionally rare , religon is rarely fused with politics in ireland , you would never get a prime minister refering to god in a speech like in the usa
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:22 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,544 posts, read 56,087,446 times
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Originally Posted by irish_bob View Post
the most conservative australian prime minister of the past several decades was john howard , an anglican , thier is no correlation between catholicism and conservatism in politics
There certainly is some connection here. Obviously not being Australian or living here you wouldn't know.
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