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Old 06-11-2012, 01:16 AM
 
1,733 posts, read 1,823,288 times
Reputation: 1135

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrconfusion87 View Post
Agreed... I know most countries with higher homicide rates than the USA have much tighter gun laws than it... While the USA may have higher homicide rates than much of the OECD, it's rates for many other crimes are in line with other countries or even lower (particularly in areas outside inner city ghettos)...
Possibly. It is worth noting that asides from homicide, registered crime rates depend more on what citizens feel is worth reporting than actual incidence of crime.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:25 AM
 
Location: US
9 posts, read 16,336 times
Reputation: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
This is actually a very easy question to answer. No, gun ownership is not necessary for freedom.

That being said, the united states is so absolutely filled with guns, theyve become so intertwined in political speech, and the drug violence, drug culture, gun culture, runs so deep...that it's completely irrelevant and pointless to convince the people who are convinced they need to protect themselves and their own from it, otherwise.

Wow. You make it sound like us "yanks" are tripping over AK's, druggies and shoot-outs as we walk down the street. Sorry, but it's not the wild west here

There's a big misconception that our 2nd Ammendment, the Right to Bear Arms, was included in our Bill of Rights for self-defense, or even more laughable, "shooting sports". While those are legitimate reasons for gun ownership, the reason our founding fathers included that personal liberty as a guarantee, was for American citizens to ward off tyranny. Having just concluded a bloody revolution against English tyranny, they knew, as all of history's horrible dictators, from Stalin to Hitler, that allowing an armed populace is the biggest deterrent to government tyranny.

Do you need a gun to feel free? Of course not. But you need the guarnateed right to own a gun to be free.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:41 AM
 
Location: In a Galaxy far, far away called Germany
4,301 posts, read 4,411,375 times
Reputation: 2396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freedom by the way View Post
Wow. You make it sound like us "yanks" are tripping over AK's, druggies and shoot-outs as we walk down the street. Sorry, but it's not the wild west here

There's a big misconception that our 2nd Ammendment, the Right to Bear Arms, was included in our Bill of Rights for self-defense, or even more laughable, "shooting sports". While those are legitimate reasons for gun ownership, the reason our founding fathers included that personal liberty as a guarantee, was for American citizens to ward off tyranny. Having just concluded a bloody revolution against English tyranny, they knew, as all of history's horrible dictators, from Stalin to Hitler, that allowing an armed populace is the biggest deterrent to government tyranny.

Do you need a gun to feel free? Of course not. But you need the guarnateed right to own a gun to be free.
I agree with you 100%.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:42 AM
 
Location: US
9 posts, read 16,336 times
Reputation: 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I don't believe it's a resounding "yes". The gun owners are more vocal. It's only a small minority of the population that owns guns. Most people aren't interested, at the very least, and many oppose lax gun laws, especially after those shooting incidents.

You should post on this in the Politics section when the subject comes up.

The latest best "guestimates" are that app. 45% of American household have at least one gun. Not a majority, perhaps, but certainly not a "small minority" either. Interestingly, gun ownership is on the rise. Despite a poor economy in many sectors in the US, the firearms industry just came off a blockbuster year for sales and employment figures.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:57 AM
 
Location: Tuscaloosa, AL
121 posts, read 133,707 times
Reputation: 118
This discussion is totally pointless without context. People love to cite crime statistics without any attempt to understand the sociological factors involved. The majority of homicides in the US are directly tied to the illegal drug trade and gang violence. The average American is no more at risk to be murdered than someone in the UK, and in many cases is at less risk.

And as Freedom by the way points out, the "gun culture" of the US is directly tied to our origins as a nation.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:04 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,544 posts, read 56,087,446 times
Reputation: 11862
^ School shootings are way more common in the US than other countries. How do you explain that, aside from the wider availability of guns?
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Tuscaloosa, AL
121 posts, read 133,707 times
Reputation: 118
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
^ School shootings are way more common in the US than other countries. How do you explain that, aside from the wider availability of guns?
No explanation is needed. That is absolutely a reason there are more school shootings in the US. But they are still an outlier.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Strathclyde & Málaga
2,975 posts, read 8,118,273 times
Reputation: 1867
It´s something you don´t hear much of in Europe, perhaps it´s a different culture or attitude (of the crimes) in the US it seems to be a regular thing. I remember hearing about a shoot out a couple of weeks ago from the news in Spain. The question is why is it such a regular thing, gun crime that is.

Also when I lived in the US, hearing about a shooting every week on the news wasn´t a rarity. Something I never heard of in Scotland and here, even murders aren´t an every day thing here let alone a shooting.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:27 AM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
10,564 posts, read 12,827,353 times
Reputation: 9400
In Canada it is almost impossible for a common citizen to have a hand gun in the house- The only people who have hand guns are hooligans and cops. Growing up in the country I understand what a fire arm is- Today the average urbanite does not- They either are afraid of guns and oppress ownership or they are lugans that think guns grant manhood.

Recently a jerk came into our down town core to Canada's central shopping mall. This little creep who was under house arrest...and employed by the city as a youth worker...Starts to shoot the place up- firing of shots in a crowed mall- hitting a child in the head and killing a couple of other people.....a few days later there is some stupid protest demanding more strict gun control- WHEN THEY SHOULD BE PROTESTING THE FACT THAT IDIOTS FROM OUR GHETTOS are mindless barbarians and the issue has nothing to do with guns.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
10,564 posts, read 12,827,353 times
Reputation: 9400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oleg Bach View Post
In Canada it is almost impossible for a common citizen to have a hand gun in the house- The only people who have hand guns are hooligans and cops. Growing up in the country I understand what a fire arm is- Today the average urbanite does not- They either are afraid of guns and oppress ownership or they are lugans that think guns grant manhood.

Recently a jerk came into our down town core to Canada's central shopping mall. This little creep who was under house arrest...and employed by the city as a youth worker...Starts to shoot the place up- firing of shots in a crowed mall- hitting a child in the head and killing a couple of other people.....a few days later there is some stupid protest demanding more strict gun control- WHEN THEY SHOULD BE PROTESTING THE FACT THAT IDIOTS FROM OUR GHETTOS are mindless barbarians and the issue has nothing to do with guns.


What I honestly like to say is going to offend some liberals- There should not be a protest regarding guns- They should ban any black punk wearing a hoodie in the summer heat from ever entering the down town core- who potentially endanger and INSULT civil citizens. Yah- I am pissed off- put a fence around the projects until these coddled little monsters figure out how to behave like MEN - instead of little cowardly rats.
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