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Old 06-12-2012, 09:14 PM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
10,564 posts, read 12,833,503 times
Reputation: 9400

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I have yet another perspective on the issue. I've fired guns at the shooting range, and am not against guns for sporting purposes. Anyway I used to live in the country, and it was commonplace for ten year old kids to use high-powered rifles (in fact one 11 year old boy was telling me how he used to take out kangaroos with high powered rifles). Anyway, there was a certain 'madman' in town who kept a huge arsenal of guns. He was causing problems for the neighbours (encroachment and things like that) but we couldn't do anything for fear of what he would do. Even the locals cops were reluctant to confront him for fear of what he could do with his arsenal. That's one thing you generally do not have to worry about in the city.
For a Canadian dad..I was rare- I took my two young daughters and sons out of a many outings and taught them how to shoot...gun safety...simple stuff about awareness - were to stand - keeping the end of the fire arm under constant control...always being mindful that what comes out the end kills..

The girls were knocking off tin cans at 75 yards and they were all but 7 years old- the smallest son took a crack at it and his fingers were so small he pinched his trigger finger between the trigger and the guard...

If those liberals full of fear knew that I had trained my kids in the safe and skillful use of fire arms they would have sent the child protection people to take them away.


As for the guy with the arsenal who intimidates fellow citizens and even police - that he may harm others and then himself in the process is troublesome- people like this are nasty- armed or not- They should be barred from having weapons- to get fixated on firearms to the point you have dozens of weapons is a sickness...To put all your self worth and identity in guns is a weakness- The way I look at it - is a real man with real intelligence and faith- does not need a damned gun...and I am not anti-gun- I am anti-weakling with a gun.


Freedom does not come from the barrel of a gun- it comes from the mind and spirit. In the meantime if you are a naturally confident person...having a weapon is not a bad thing...as for armed resistance of a corrupt government....Which the AMERICAN RIGHT to bare arms is based on...You should not let it get to that- the mind is the most powerful weapon.
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Old 06-12-2012, 10:14 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,544 posts, read 56,112,318 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oleg Bach View Post
For a Canadian dad..I was rare- I took my two young daughters and sons out of a many outings and taught them how to shoot...gun safety...simple stuff about awareness - were to stand - keeping the end of the fire arm under constant control...always being mindful that what comes out the end kills..

The girls were knocking off tin cans at 75 yards and they were all but 7 years old- the smallest son took a crack at it and his fingers were so small he pinched his trigger finger between the trigger and the guard...

If those liberals full of fear knew that I had trained my kids in the safe and skillful use of fire arms they would have sent the child protection people to take them away.


As for the guy with the arsenal who intimidates fellow citizens and even police - that he may harm others and then himself in the process is troublesome- people like this are nasty- armed or not- They should be barred from having weapons- to get fixated on firearms to the point you have dozens of weapons is a sickness...To put all your self worth and identity in guns is a weakness- The way I look at it - is a real man with real intelligence and faith- does not need a damned gun...and I am not anti-gun- I am anti-weakling with a gun.


Freedom does not come from the barrel of a gun- it comes from the mind and spirit. In the meantime if you are a naturally confident person...having a weapon is not a bad thing...as for armed resistance of a corrupt government....Which the AMERICAN RIGHT to bare arms is based on...You should not let it get to that- the mind is the most powerful weapon.
I get that, and I don't think you did wrong by your kids. I'm sure you just wanted them to be able to protect themselves.

My beef is with the whole thought process behind it: people feel the need to keep a piece to protect themselves against criminals, but of course the wider availability of guns means even petty crooks can much more easily obtain a firearm. It's just the same policy of nuclear armament from the Cold War on a more domestic scale.
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Old 06-13-2012, 09:49 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,286 posts, read 87,497,027 times
Reputation: 55564
let me put it this way, the 10,000 bodies that were fished up in New Orleans were written off by the authorities as Katrina hurricane fatalities" but many of them had stab wounds or bullet holes in them. hurricanes don't do that.
if you think the cops will protect you, you had better talk to the people that were locked up in the superdome in New Orleans.
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Old 06-13-2012, 10:19 PM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
10,564 posts, read 12,833,503 times
Reputation: 9400
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
OK, let's analyze your presumptions.

1. You're implying that when America rounds up farm boys and sends them to Vietnam or Iraq (or even Panama or Grenada) with orders to shoot people to kill, most of them refuse to go and we have a hard time mustering up a few companies of trained killers. It's absurd to think they would act in lock step.

2. You're implying that the majority of people in Iran do not want nuclear technology, nor the capacity to defend themselves from foreign devils who call them the axis of evil. It's absurd to think they want that, but they have it forced upon them.

I'm sorry, I disagree with you.
Having socialized with Persians (Iranians)- I found them to be attractive intelligent sophisticated people..Just like the average American - They are wonderful and reasonable - just like us...The problem we have that is mutual is that both of our cultures are victims of this strange phenomena ...of horrible representation in the form of inept leadership...Some how the most stupid - hence the most dangerous have managed to take public office---It's totally weird that the worst have risen to the top- How did this happen?....It is like some sort of social mutation that is like an international disease these days.
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Old 06-13-2012, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Knoxville Tenn
170 posts, read 347,881 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotslass View Post
Don´t worry, I don´t think your trying to be argumentative. I feel much safer in Scotland and in Spain than I did in the US as a whole. Your chances of being shot in these countries are much slimmer than in the US. I tried to live the life I did in Scotland and the life I live now and it was difficult because of the fear of someone carjacking me or someone going to rob me at gunpoint, here people don´t seem to have that worry. It´s just very very different. I felt like I couldn´t relax and let my hair down like I can here.

You should visit Scotland it´s a beautiful country and has everything apart from heat Spain, well theres lots of beautiful places and your guaranteed sunshine.
I'm sorry, but you seem to contradict yourself. You keep speaking of how bad it is in America, yet you don't see the reason to have a gun? Personally I have several guns. I'm no criminal but I do feel the need to defend myself if necessary. I keep one in my car and NEVER show it or pull it, but I would. I've been approached by crack heads with my wife and kids in the car. As he bent down towards my window and he saw my hand on a glock, he appologized and moved on. There have also been home invasions in my city where people have been killed. I think if it were to happen at my home, I should have the right to protect my family. Perhaps that sounds harsh. I don't carry them into public places or sit around with one tucked in my pants. That's what's bothersome. I'm getting the idea that some have that picture of American gun owners in their heads. I keep one hidden in my car and in various spots in my house. I hope I NEVER have to use one. But you die, then you're dead. And those saying you can talk your way out of a home invasion or robbery are full of it. What are you talking about to them? Sports, weather, a picnic at the park? When it's on it's on.

Another point some are missing....MANY, MANY murders in America are drug or gang related. If you are not mingling with the wrong folks the chances of you being a victim are slim. Again, I don't carry to feel "bad", and most people don't know I have them. I also don't carry them to "feel safe". But the harsh reality is that stuff happens to people. If it happens to me, I'm gonna be prepared.
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Old 06-13-2012, 10:29 PM
 
Location: Knoxville Tenn
170 posts, read 347,881 times
Reputation: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stubblejumper View Post
It's not that hard, really. I had one for a while, though I eventually sold it as I never really shot it. The perception of the process is harder than the actual process (though that tends to be long, confusing and redundant as well).

I agree wholeheartedly on the second point, however. Most people in Canada don't have any experience with guns, generally.




That's a good point as well - there are a few "hotspots" for violent crime in the US, while much of the rest is below average in terms of violent crime.

New Orleans' homicide rate, for example, was somewhere around 49/100,000
at one point, while El Paso, TX (itself a major metropolitan area, and hardly a gun shy one, at that) has a homicide rate of only 0.8/100,000.

That difference alone would suggest that guns are not a major deciding factor in violent crime levels.

To take it a step further however, Glasgow has a homicide rate of 3.3, which is noticeably higher than quite a few US cities (El Paso, San Diego, Honolulu, etc)

It would seem that there are larger forces than gun ownership at play in determining violent crime rates, as there appears to be no correlation between violent crime rates and gun ownership rates, within and outside of the US.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd also genuinely like to hear thoughts about the first question I posted in this thread, regarding sentiments of gun ownership not being necessary in Europe while simultaneously having armed police officers on patrol.
Good post. What's insane is that El Paso is one of the safest cities you will find. The US/Mexico border is all that lies between El Paso and Juarez Mexico...which is arguably the most violent place on earth. That's just crazy!
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Old 10-15-2012, 09:26 PM
 
Location: Lower east side of Toronto
10,564 posts, read 12,833,503 times
Reputation: 9400
YOU should have the freedom when some one insults you- steals from you - bothers a family member...undermines you or is a general crack head type so proud of their own evil.. The right not to complain to the authorities...not to take them into court- but the old fashioned quick tried and true solution - The right to PUNCH THEM IN THE FACE - ONCE AND REAL HARD TO SET THEM STRAIGHT.

I miss the old days when systems did not protect evil people..when you could make short work of them and make life better- without resorting to guns and law..the good old fashioned sucker shot solution.
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Old 10-15-2012, 09:59 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,773 posts, read 21,523,365 times
Reputation: 9263
Yes, i love guns. but we shouldn't give them to crazy people.
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 87,069,036 times
Reputation: 36644
Would the opening premise imply that Freedom would have been impossible before guns were invented?
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Old 10-15-2012, 10:52 PM
 
Location: Scotland
7,956 posts, read 11,855,808 times
Reputation: 4167
How can anyone love guns, they are for nothing else but to kill and maim people. Even if I had one for protection, I'd prey I'd never use it. America has enough LEGAL guns to arm every man, woman and child in their country never mind illegal ones, I just find it bonkers. I wonder how many Americans would love guns if they stayed in the worst, mainly black, ghettos where the real victims of America's gun obsession reside.
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