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Old 06-25-2012, 07:59 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
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The view that Europe is a continent is changing, though I don't know what they're teaching in schools. The term "Eurasia" is being used more often, though among Russia specialists it's sometimes used as a synonym for "Russia".

India's called a "subcontinent" possibly because geologically, it's not part of Europe, it actually was a separate continent at one time. I'm agreeable to demoting Europe to a "subcontinent", though, or a peninsula of Eurasia.
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Old 06-25-2012, 08:55 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,544 posts, read 56,121,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
The view that Europe is a continent is changing, though I don't know what they're teaching in schools. The term "Eurasia" is being used more often, though among Russia specialists it's sometimes used as a synonym for "Russia".

India's called a "subcontinent" possibly because geologically, it's not part of Europe, it actually was a separate continent at one time. I'm agreeable to demoting Europe to a "subcontinent", though, or a peninsula of Eurasia.
No kidding? lol
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Old 06-25-2012, 10:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
The definition of 'West' doesn't seem to be set in stone.

If by 'West' you mean largely Europoid physical appearance and Christian, then yes, of course...

Russia has 'oriental' influence through Central Asian civilisation and some rather cursory indigenous influence, but overall if West = European then Russia is a 'Western' society.
Not, not really, unless we are talking about the upper class in pre-revolutionary Russia. There you wouldn't really know much difference between Paris, Berlin or St. Petersburg. As for the rest of the society - there Russia was closer in many ways to third world country; poverty, illiteracy, lawlessness. After all, out of all European countries Russia was the only one that had slavery up until 1825. ( Slavery - meaning the landlords still could sell or kill their peasants - they were their property.
Even today's Russia, in spite of all the glitz and glamor of Moscow in many ways is akin to third world countries, as rich in natural resources as it is. The corruption is at the African level, so this should tell a thing or two right there.
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Old 06-25-2012, 11:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
What a great discussion! Nice to see you, Grey, I haven't seen you on the forum for awhile.


As for Russian culture being "very patriarchal", it has always seemed to me to be much less so than "Western" culture. Russian tradition is closer to its matriarchal roots than Western culture (with the possible exception of parts of Scandinavia). You can see this in some of the folklore. It shows up in subtle ways, for example, how girls and boys in school are given equal importance, whereas in American schools the boys have always been given more attention by teachers. This would be considered scandalous, and evidence of poor teaching skills in Russia. Girls are raised in the family with the same career expectations as boys (or used to be. I don't know how it is now). There's no bias in favor of the boys, no assumption that their careers will be more important.
These are the leftovers of Soviet culture. Soviet system abolished Christianity, obviously, and with it the traditional role of woman in the society changed. Besides, the country was undergoing the industrialization, so with a lot of educated people from the old upper class gone, Soviets were desperate to get the new generation of educated people, men or women alike. That's why they've set the kind of education ( available in tzarist times for the upper class only) that was thoroughly screening all capable children, boys and girls alike from the early age on, particularly when it was coming to math and science.
So although on a surface things changed, in the reality deep down the culture still remained as patriarchal as ever, when we are talking "family values." However if women were choosing the divorce or what's not, the Soviet system was quite supportive of women's independence, because when it was coming to raising young, it was in many ways the welfare system - the state was sponsoring a lot of it, since Soviet government was interested in higher birth rates.

Quote:
But maybe this has all changed now. Maybe women now are raised mainly to be goddesses for worship.
Don't know about "goddesses," but back in Soviet times even dating in schools was discouraged, as much as wearing make-up (all that had to wait until graduation, 8th or 10th grade) and women's objectification was really not there. Needless to say personalities like Paris Hilton were unheard of, but in post-Soviet society they are there just fine, as much as complaints about gender inequality and what's not)))
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Old 06-26-2012, 07:29 AM
 
Location: Manila
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Russia was never fully accepted and embraced by the West, nor do they see themselves as Easterners either... They are simply their own entity as far as I can tell...
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Old 06-26-2012, 07:53 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Neutre View Post
Compared to other real mountain ranges Ural is just a a range of hills.
I am not getting why you keep emphasizing that the Urals are not "real" mountains, in relation to setting a boundary. Are you saying that a boundary can be set only along "really" high mountains? The height of the Urals is completely irrelevant. The boundary may be set in the steppe, if they choose so.

Besides, the northern part of the range is quite high (maybe you only know the middle part where the most population is).

Quote:
Highest point Mount Narodnaya - elevation 1,895 m (6,217 ft)
6,000 feet, I think, qualifies it as a good size range.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ural_Mountains
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:00 AM
 
4,253 posts, read 9,461,426 times
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Originally Posted by nimchimpsky View Post
I think the fact Russia is ethnically diverse makes answering the OP question impossible. Russia isn't Eastern or Western. It's a blend of Eastern and Western people.
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Originally Posted by mrconfusion87 View Post
Russia was never fully accepted and embraced by the West, nor do they see themselves as Easterners either... They are simply their own entity as far as I can tell...
This is the truth in the nutshell. The Russians, with all their social changes, think that the West is following. I tell my Russian friends that they are still, as they were, a dark horse for the West.
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:53 AM
 
26,832 posts, read 22,619,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrconfusion87 View Post
Russia was never fully accepted and embraced by the West, nor do they see themselves as Easterners either... They are simply their own entity as far as I can tell...
Can you tell me please who was ever "fully accepted and embraced by the West?"
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Old 06-26-2012, 08:57 AM
 
26,832 posts, read 22,619,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimchimpsky View Post
I think the fact Russia is ethnically diverse makes answering the OP question impossible. Russia isn't Eastern or Western. It's a blend of Eastern and Western people.
However if you consider ethnic Russians as "Western people" they are clearly in the lead ( so is their culture comparably to "Eastern people" - i.e. ethnic minorities.)
Sort of like Anglo-Saxon culture is in the lead in the US, the country with ethnic diversity.
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:22 AM
 
983 posts, read 3,600,785 times
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Originally Posted by nuala View Post
I am not getting why you keep emphasizing that the Urals are not "real" mountains, in relation to setting a boundary. Are you saying that a boundary can be set only along "really" high mountains? The height of the Urals is completely irrelevant. The boundary may be set in the steppe, if they choose so.

Besides, the northern part of the range is quite high (maybe you only know the middle part where the most population is).



6,000 feet, I think, qualifies it as a good size range.

Ural Mountains - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Exactly. 1895 m is the highest point. The most populated areas in the Central Ural are so low that even the highest "peak" is less than 1000 m. They qualify more as highlands.

I'm emphasizing this because as mentioned before, there is no real boundary between Asia (Eastern) and Europe (Western). Even the Ural which is the most widely taught nowadays doesn't really present a proper divide.
Russians who live there know at firsthand that there is no sound separation and most don't see any reason to define themselves as either Asian/Eastern or European/Western.

Now between the Indian "subcontinent" and the rest of Eurasia there are obvious topographical, geographical, geological, and even cultural boundaries. But this thread is about Russia instead of India.
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