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Old 09-04-2013, 04:59 AM
 
Location: Leeds, UK
22,256 posts, read 26,855,002 times
Reputation: 8761

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sadgirl80 View Post
GDP per capita IS the measurement of mean income
No. GDP per capita is gross domestic product per person. It is not a reflection of how much people are earning i.e the pay they receive at the end of every week/month. It is actually self-explanatory. All it shows is that countries like Norway are very productive given their small population, while the UK's economic output per person is not as great as it once was, especially since the massive devaluation of Pound Sterling.

The United States still has a high income, but it also has very large disparities, the highest of any developed nation, with the bottom decile of income earners earning less than the majority of OECD nations.


Last edited by dunno what to put here; 09-04-2013 at 05:08 AM..
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:05 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,257 posts, read 21,936,916 times
Reputation: 11103
Those stats are completely false and inaccurate. The moderators should close this thread as severely misleading.

That guy (and the OP) is using nominal GDP per capita in the US, and GDP (PPP) in Europe. That is like comparing US gross salary with EU net salary. They are also from different years, The US stats are from 2010 and the EU countries stats are from some earlier year, as those figures don't match with the numbers in the link provided. (Ok, the blog post is from 2011, but still.)

Here's the 2009 top list using nominal GDP, EU countries in bold, US states in italics:

District of Columbia124,363

Luxembourg103,125
Norway83,485
Delaware69,288
Iceland64,548
Ireland60,209
Switzerland58,513
Denmark57,137

Connecticut50,332
Sweden49,603
Finland46,856
Netherlands46,774

Massachusetts46,721
New York46,617

United Kingdom46,099
New Jersey44,885
Austria44,852
Alaska43,748
Belgium42,618
France42,034

Colorado41,798
Virginia41,702

California41,663
Minnesota41,295

Germany40,400
Nevada39,813
Washington39,616

...

bottom:
Greece28,152
Montana27,942
Arkansas27,875
West Virginia24,748
Mississippi24,062

The poorest Eurozone country has a higher GDP per capita as four US states. Suck on that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compar...%29_per_capita
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:11 AM
B87
 
Location: Surrey/London
11,786 posts, read 9,164,005 times
Reputation: 3063
Venture into the politics forum...this misleading rubbish is all too common.
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:16 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,257 posts, read 21,936,916 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by B87 View Post
Venture into the politics forum...this misleading rubbish is all too common.
I will never put my foot in that tea party-gunslinger-theocracy forum.
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:21 AM
B87
 
Location: Surrey/London
11,786 posts, read 9,164,005 times
Reputation: 3063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
I will never put my foot in that tea party-gunslinger-theocracy forum.
Going and posting facts in any 'universal health care bashing' threads is entertaining. It's fun to watch them come up with some stupid nonsense to try and discredit information that isn't shown on Faux News.

Anything to do with science in that forum is truly painful to read though. It's like they have been brainwashed so badly that they are no longer capable of thinking unless it involves moaning about 'liberals', 'atheists' or 'socialists'. Obviously they don't offer up any evidence to support their moaning.
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:34 AM
 
282 posts, read 370,509 times
Reputation: 314
And there I was complaining about the preponderance of liberalist sophistry, logical fallacies, scientific illiteracy and general all round ineptitude on PaOC.

There's always two sides to a debate, and if you're resorting to coping behavior to settle your grievances, like above, it usually means you've come out poorly in your polemics or arguments.
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:48 AM
 
Location: Westminster, London
878 posts, read 1,279,220 times
Reputation: 726
Can we stay on-topic please? This is a politically neutral section of the forum, not a liberal enclave where you can mudsling at will against people you disagree with politically. People of all political and religious inclinations post here.
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:51 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,257 posts, read 21,936,916 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissionIMPOSSIBRU View Post
Can we stay on-topic please? This is a politically neutral section of the forum, not a liberal enclave where you can mudsling at will against people you disagree with politically. People of all political and religious inclinations post here.
What is the topic? That communist socialist pacifist atheist Europe is not so bad off after all as the OP thought with her bogus stats?
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:51 AM
 
Location: Leeds, UK
22,256 posts, read 26,855,002 times
Reputation: 8761
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissionIMPOSSIBRU View Post
Can we stay on-topic please? This is a politically neutral section of the forum, not a liberal enclave where you can mudsling at will against people you disagree with politically. People of all political and religious inclinations post here.
This is true, unfortunately.
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Old 09-04-2013, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,257 posts, read 21,936,916 times
Reputation: 11103
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissionIMPOSSIBRU View Post
Question and answer in the same comment.

As a general rule, if I have a problem with someone's stats, then address their stats. If I have a problem with their politics (especially when it is not explicitly alluded to in the OP and thus based solely upon inferences and circumstantial evidence) then I confront their views in the politics forum. Would you say that's unreasonable?
I did provide stats and a link to them.

The total GDP of Finland (5.42 million inhabitants) in 2011 was $258 billion. The total GDP of Minnesota (5.38 million inhabitants) was estimated at $253 billion in 2012. Practically the same in both.
Income per capita (nominal) in Finland was an estimated $47,496 in 2010 and $42,843 for Minnesota.
Minnesota collected $17 billion in taxes, while Finland collected $18 billion in municipal tax.

The most populous county of Minnesota, Hennepin County with a population of 1.2 million has average salary at $42,313, while Finland's most populous region Uusimaa (1.6 million) is at $48,206. Similar, but $6k is a big sum for the average Joe.

BUT, Minnesota's poorest county, Todd County, has a $15,658 average income per person, while Finland's most pi*s-poor muncipality Kivijärvi has an average of $24,332. So even the poorest Finn is richer than the poorest Minnesotan.

In 2008 9.8% of the population in Minnesota lived under the poverty line. In Finland, 13.2%. Wow, this may not sound like a socialist utopia, but the poverty line in the US in 2012 was set at $23,050 (total yearly income) for a family of four. (Single person $11,945 a year).
In Finland the poverty line is set at $18,179 per person, meaning $36,350 a year for a childless couple.

Enough of the stats, I think I've given enough to disprove the OP's claims. Which were GDP per capita:

Minnesota $51,238 <- now when looking at the stats, this must be the median houshold income, or the GDP only of the workforce
Finland $34,585

Sources used except wikipedia and Finnish include:
http://www.twincities.com/ci_2347898...astest-growing
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/graph/?id=MNPCPI
http://www.gfmag.com/gdp-data-countr...#axzz2dvAbx06F
http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/27000.html
http://www.mnbudgetproject.org/resea...rty-guidelines

Last edited by Ariete; 09-04-2013 at 07:10 AM..
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