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Old 09-15-2014, 06:21 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,891,130 times
Reputation: 11103

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The possible independence of the Åland Islands has been living for long, but hasn't ever gotten anywhere. The party which strives for independence has gotten 4-10% of the votes in regional elections, and the vast majority don't support independence.
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Old 09-15-2014, 09:37 AM
 
Location: San Diego, California Republic
16,588 posts, read 27,462,760 times
Reputation: 9059
Quote:
Originally Posted by SthrnCarolinaGrl View Post
Obama turned down the last petition for secession, as did Bush. So they will never allow it. Any American who thinks different is just fooling theirself. They'll never let us go....
You do realize that this isn't true right? The presidents didn't turn down anything because the president does not have the authority to grant nor deny secession. Those Americans who petitioned the president have no idea how their country works and that's why they won't be successful.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:52 PM
 
1,721 posts, read 1,525,388 times
Reputation: 1133
In America most likely none wants to break apart from the main country. Everyone seems really happy with being together.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:04 PM
 
Location: 'Back in the midst of a world gone mad'
165 posts, read 190,302 times
Reputation: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
You do realize that this isn't true right? The presidents didn't turn down anything because the president does not have the authority to grant nor deny secession. Those Americans who petitioned the president have no idea how their country works and that's why they won't be successful.
Actually there are reasons why they did it the way they did. I can assure you, Southerner's have a full understanding of secession. We also have a full understanding of how our gov't can work for you, and also against you.

A lot of people that wanted to, wouldn't even sign the petitions. People were talking it about it everywhere. They didn't want to put their names on something like that. That should speak volumes in itself.

The fed gov't has stated their position, that there is no right to secession. They mean it. Over the years several politicians have made comments, that talk about secession is nothing short of treason. No threats, but you got the point.

The Supreme Court hearing in 1869, backed the gov't up in saying that states did not have the right to secede. I have full confidence they will always back the gov't up.

There are quite a few American citizens that also feel that talk of secession is an act of treason. I heard quite a few people say that those who signed the petitions should be tried for treason.

NC, SC, TN, Texas, Florida, Georgia, Alabama, and Louisianna all submitted a We the People, to Obama. He had up to one month to give an answer by law. He said no.

This was a gaging of where the American public, as well as those state's politicians stood on the issue. That pretty well stopped it, again. The truth is, the Supreme Court will NEVER side against Washington on this. To think it ever will is to believe in fairy tales.

Not all Southerners want secession, there are a lot that don't. There are a lot that still try to have faith in the country, that we will all find a common ground. Unfortunately fighting and name calling takes the place of any serious discussions, and the gov't and media push the division like there's no tmr.

Too many people don't want to hear certain subjects disected, broken down, and truly discussed. You cannot have a country that will not discuss some of it's biggest issues.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:09 PM
 
Location: San Francisco
8,982 posts, read 10,488,511 times
Reputation: 5752
You do realize that those petitions on the whitehouse.gov site are for entertainment value only, right? They carry absolutely no legal weight whatsoever, so "Obama's decision" to "turn them down" (as if he personally were sitting there watching the signature counters, yeah right!) is of no consequence whatsoever.

They're just a way for people to disseminate silly ideas, along with the occasional serious one, and ask for input from the White House. There's no "law" saying that Obama or anyone else has to react to them. Where did you ever get that idea?

Also: contrary to your implication that those petitions were submitted by state governments -- they weren't. They were just created by citizens. Most of them bore "signatures" from people who weren't even from the states involved.

And finally, that petition system has only existed since 2011, so there's no way it could have been used to ask Bush about secession. The secession mania didn't really get going until the day after Obama's re-election in 2012.
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Colorado
1,523 posts, read 2,872,239 times
Reputation: 2220
Quote:
Originally Posted by SthrnCarolinaGrl View Post
Actually there are reasons why they did it the way they did. I can assure you, Southerner's have a full understanding of secession. We also have a full understanding of how our gov't can work for you, and also against you.

A lot of people that wanted to, wouldn't even sign the petitions. People were talking it about it everywhere. They didn't want to put their names on something like that. That should speak volumes in itself.

The fed gov't has stated their position, that there is no right to secession. They mean it. Over the years several politicians have made comments, that talk about secession is nothing short of treason. No threats, but you got the point.

The Supreme Court hearing in 1869, backed the gov't up in saying that states did not have the right to secede. I have full confidence they will always back the gov't up.

There are quite a few American citizens that also feel that talk of secession is an act of treason. I heard quite a few people say that those who signed the petitions should be tried for treason.

NC, SC, TN, Texas, Florida, Georgia, Alabama, and Louisianna all submitted a We the People, to Obama. He had up to one month to give an answer by law. He said no.

This was a gaging of where the American public, as well as those state's politicians stood on the issue. That pretty well stopped it, again. The truth is, the Supreme Court will NEVER side against Washington on this. To think it ever will is to believe in fairy tales.

Not all Southerners want secession, there are a lot that don't. There are a lot that still try to have faith in the country, that we will all find a common ground. Unfortunately fighting and name calling takes the place of any serious discussions, and the gov't and media push the division like there's no tmr.

Too many people don't want to hear certain subjects disected, broken down, and truly discussed. You cannot have a country that will not discuss some of it's biggest issues.
What are you smoking?

Only a tiny fringe minority of southerners consider independence. Half of the population which is black want nothing to do with it. The only ones who ever talk about it are ultra-conservative radical butthurt bumpkins who are so wrapped up in their delusions of grandeur that they still dream of resurrecting the Confederacy. Generally southerners are among the most patriotic Americans. You present it as if 10,000 lunatics out of 100+ million people are somehow the true representatives of the state governments or the southern populace.
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Old 09-15-2014, 02:05 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,773 posts, read 21,560,199 times
Reputation: 9263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gentoo View Post
Texas may get all the attention, probably due to it's past but the sentiment in the Pacific Northwest is strong and if you ever spend any time there, you will get a definite feel for that region being disconnected from the rest of the country. It certainly feels different too.
How so? It looks unique with the mountains, weather, more trees, less farmland but it sure still feels like you are in North America culturally... (architecture, set up of the cities, stores, sports, holidays, politics, pop culture, etc...)
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Old 09-15-2014, 03:21 PM
 
Location: 'Back in the midst of a world gone mad'
165 posts, read 190,302 times
Reputation: 245
Quote:
Originally Posted by pch1013 View Post
You do realize that those petitions on the whitehouse.gov site are for entertainment value only, right? They carry absolutely no legal weight whatsoever, so "Obama's decision" to "turn them down" (as if he personally were sitting there watching the signature counters, yeah right!) is of no consequence whatsoever.

They're just a way for people to disseminate silly ideas, along with the occasional serious one, and ask for input from the White House. There's no "law" saying that Obama or anyone else has to react to them. Where did you ever get that idea?

Also: contrary to your implication that those petitions were submitted by state governments -- they weren't. They were just created by citizens. Most of them bore "signatures" from people who weren't even from the states involved.

And finally, that petition system has only existed since 2011, so there's no way it could have been used to ask Bush about secession. The secession mania didn't really get going until the day after Obama's re-election in 2012.
Long before that site even existed, people have signed petitions for secession. That is nothing new and will continue. Signing petitions and talking about secession is only new in other parts of the country. Definitely not new in the South. It won't get a national spotlight again once Obama is gone, but it will still continue.

I never said our gov's submitted the petitions. I think everyone knows that with the amount of coverage it got. Obama did respond to them though, and made it known it wasn't going to happen. Nobody expects anything to come of the petitions. Everyone already knows the answer they will get about secession. There is no sense in pouring money, time, and effort into something that will not happen. So petitions are as far as they ever take it. Very few people sign them, knowing that they are just putting their names on something that will not make any difference. So being told no, or getting no response is no big deal. It is what it is. It is what is expected.

Petitions are talked about in those states though and it's a good way to gage where the other citizens stand, as well as state and local politicians. It also keeps discussions going about major issues. This time it got national coverage and a lot of people weighed in about it. Next time it won't. Not unless they can make political fodder out of it, or you have someone from a NE state or Pacicific state bring the issue up.

As far as Obama having to respond by law, I may have just misunderstood or been mis-informed about that. The whole thing was well televised, so I would definitely never try to make it something it wasn't on purpose.
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Old 09-15-2014, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Mid Atlantic USA
12,622 posts, read 13,979,353 times
Reputation: 5895
Personally I think the US is next after Scotland. Everyone region in this country hates the other regions. Zero national unity. A recipe for failure and disaster.
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Old 09-15-2014, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Vernon, British Columbia
3,026 posts, read 3,660,815 times
Reputation: 2196
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thirty All View Post
With all the talk of Scotland and Catalonia, which parts of your country want to secede?
Belgium wants to divide into two, do the Quebecois still want independence? Is there a strong movement in Sicily? Western China and Tibet? Anything else?

Which is the most likely to succeed in seceding?
Support for Kwebec separating is not as high as it was in the past. Same goes for western separation, which was quite a going concern until the Conservatives formed the government.

We sometimes even hear talk about dividing provinces in half. For example, where in BC, the north east (the BC oil patch) threatens to join Alberta every once in a while as they are seen as sending all their money down south, and seeing little in return.
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