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Well, when some of the political leaders of the far-right (like here in Austria) were once members of neo-nazi youth groups, this accusation only seems to be natural. Also, you won't be charged with hate speech only for being against immigration.
What WILL get you charged with hate speech? I'm concerned about where "hate speech" will take us in the US.
What WILL get you charged with hate speech? I'm concerned about where "hate speech" will take us in the US.
Swedish politican Michael Hess was sentenced to a fine and probation for hate speech for writing the following comment on his facebook page:
Quote:
When are you journalists going to realize that it is deeply ingrained in Islamic culture to rape and mistreat those women who do not abide by the teachings of Islam? [Data] is widely available showing the connection between the rapes in Sweden and number of migrants from Middle Eastern and North African countries,”
Not that I agree with his politics, but he has a fundamental right to free speech nontheless. But not in this country, and infact not in most of Europe.
Regarding the homosexual at Tehtaanpuisto park I briefly considered getting my gun from the upstairs and shooting him in the head. Would the gratification from it exceed the annoyance of serving time in jail? Violence is these days a very undervalued method of solving problems. - no sanctions
Retroactively opposing the Holocaust is nicer and easier than getting involved in solving present-day problems. It is nice to accuse the Germans because cosi fan tutti. Armenians are irrelevant, because Armenians don’t own Hollywood and the American media.
- no sanctions
The ruling Left milks the working Swedes to maintain a predominantly idle immigrant population, who thankfully vote for the Left. Swedish society has to support two parasites, each living in a symbiotic relationship with the other. That is, in this particular game of thought.
- no sanctions
Regarding the controversial article “Society consists of people”, it is a fact that negroes or negroid, Sub-Saharan persons live in something resembling a western society only in places where order is kept by a white system of violent dominance (police, army and the justice system). It is likewise a fact that the so-called western structures start to crumble and sinking towards the typical African state of being starts immediately as blacks reach a majority or dominant position. Examples of this include post-independence Haiti and post-apartheid South Africa.
- no sanctions
An Afro who gets dragged into Helsinki from an African savannah pollutes no less with his conspicuous consumption than an ethnic Finn. He will probably pollute more because moving from the stone age directly into the modern world deprives him of ecological conscience typical of a western human being.
- no sanctions
Prophet Mohammed was a pedophile and Islam is a religion sanctifying pedophilia, it is indeed a pedophile religion. Pedophilia is the will of Allah.
- charged with hate crime, aquitted in court
Robbing bystanders and living parasitically on tax money is a national, perhaps even genetical special trait of the Somalis.
- charged with hate crime, fined
However, I try not to think that way, because not all the women are like Virtanen, Biaudet and Filatov. Rapes will eventually get more frequent. Because, this being the case, more women will be raped anyway, I sincerely hope that the predators who randomly pick their victims would catch the right women meaning green-left liberals and their voters. It is rather them than someone else. For them nothing else works except if they get to taste their own multicultural medicine.
- charged, aquitted
Though I couldn't be more against Halla-aho, the logic behind the legal system is just... broken.
What WILL get you charged with hate speech? I'm concerned about where "hate speech" will take us in the US.
It depends on the country. Differences are marginal, though, due to the standards set by the ECHR. For Austria:
Verhetzung (incitement to hostile action; § 283 StGB) punishes whoever publicly induces or incites, in a manner likely to endanger public order, the commission of a hostile act against a church or religious community officially existing in the State or against a group determined by appurtenance to such a church, race, nation, ethnic group or state. Furthermore, § 283 prohibits a person from insulting a member of one of such groups in a manner that offends their human dignity.
Now, this may sound extremely harsh, but the words "likely to endanger public order" and "human dignity" are key. It's not very likely that a person with 300 friends on facebook gets charged for posting that religious group "XYZ" is just a bunch of donkey dick sucking ******* and we should all throw a bag of poop on the doors of their church/temple/...
That wouldn't endanger public order and it's unlikely that a no-name from facebook will offend human dignity of a follower of said religion.
Two similar laws explicitly for religious groups (Herabwürdigung religiöser Lehren) and against national socialism (Verbotsgesetz) exist.
Examples:
- The FPÖ issued a comic in which Strache says to a boy that he should hit "Mustafa" with his slingshot, clearly aimed at Muslims in general: Not Verhetzung.
- A politician from Graz (Susanne Winter; FPÖ) said that Mohammed was notorious for abusing children and waging war. Therefor we should kick them out of Europe all together. Also, the city of Graz should buy some sheep, so that Muslims can have fun with those instead with our woman. On a different occasion she proposed to open up animal brothels for Muslim men: Guilty of Verhetzung. Fine of €24.000 and three months on parol.
- A politician (FPÖ) running for mayor of Innsbruck put up signs saying "Heimatliebe statt Marokkaner-Diebe", which translates into "Love your country and not people, who steal Moroccans", but was meant to mean just "criminal Moroccans", implying that every Moroccan is a criminal. Apart from being hilarious, the judge found that that doesn't constitute "Verhetzung".
There are hardly any examples where a regular citizen found guilty of Verhetzung. It's mostly politicians that get sacked for it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusPetersson
Not that I agree with his politics, but he has a fundamental right to free speech nontheless. But not in this country, and infact not in most of Europe.
He has the fundamental right to free speech, but it's not an absolute right. It's getting problematic when the personal rights of others get infringed by people who exercise their rights, as it was the case with the facebook post of that Swedish politician.
Why should Muslims tolerate a politician that's infringing their right to personal freedom by spreading unfounded hatred on his page?
I think you're right in Europeans generally being more xenophobic, and I won't say European are any more or less better when it comes to gay rights. However, I disagree with your statement that Europe is on a similar level to the USA, when it comes to conservatism. Economically, European are far more liberal than Americans; believing in strong government programmes, such as universal healthcare and a decent welfare system etc. Few Europeans, too, are for super lax gun laws. I'm aware that there are parts of the USA, where it's quite liberal like Mass, but even in these places, there are a significant portions of the population that are extremely conservative by European standards. The USA is definitely an outlier.
He has the fundamental right to free speech, but it's not an absolute right. It's getting problematic when the personal rights of others get infringed by people who exercise their rights, as it was the case with the facebook post of that Swedish politician.
Why should Muslims tolerate a politician that's infringing their right to personal freedom by spreading unfounded hatred on his page?
If I am comparing the situation to the USA, it would be seen as extremely infringing to sentence someone for hate speech.
In Sweden there is a law called "Hets mot folkgrupp" which means "hets against group of people", but hets, which kind of means incitement, is a hard word to translate properly, so lets just call it "hate speech". Under "Hets mot folkgrupp 16 kap 8 §", it is illegal to:
"1. On purpose
2. In speech or other type of message
3. Threaten or express disrespect against an ethnic group (folkgrupp) or other such group of persons based on race, skin color, national origin, ethnic origin, religion or sexual orientation.
Penalty is prison up to 2 years, or if the crime is petty, a fine."
A law like this could never be passed in the United States as it would go totally against the first ammendment of freedom of speech. As such, the USA is more free than most or all European countries when it comes to freedom of speech. In Europe freedom of speech is a right, but in the USA its an absolute right. A common saying in the US is that "you don't have a right to not be offended", but in Europe including Sweden you actually have that right to a large extent. Also in the US, words alone would not be considered as infringing on someone elses rights unless the words are taken into action. But in Europe words are by law considered as infringing on others rights.
Still though I prefer Europe over the USA for various, many other reasons.
Michael Hess is a politican who belongs to the Sweden Democrats (Sverigedemokraterna) who are kind of Sweden's own FPÖ. The Sweden Democrats, who other than their immigration politics actually are pretty left wing, have their roots in National Socialism including Waffen SS veterans but today reject any kind of National Socialist (Nazi) influences and references in their politics and has official strict policies against National Socialism as they don't want to be associated with their past. They are the third largest part in Sweden as they got 13% of the votes in the 2014 election, but the other parties still refuse to have anything to do with them.
I think its a despicable, hateful party but they still have their right to existence.
I think you're right in Europeans generally being more xenophobic, and I won't say European are any more or less better when it comes to gay rights. However, I disagree with your statement that Europe is on a similar level to the USA, when it comes to conservatism. Economically, European are far more liberal than Americans; believing in strong government programmes, such as universal healthcare and a decent welfare system etc. Few Europeans, too, are for super lax gun laws. I'm aware that there are parts of the USA, where it's quite liberal like Mass, but even in these places, there are a significant portions of the population that are extremely conservative by European standards. The USA is definitely an outlier.
If was living in Texas then i Would never drive a Chevy pickup but a Tank just to show that I am the coolest one. Handguns are childish, I would carry a machinegun and wear a bazooka on the back.
Read those statements by Jussi Halla-aho and decide which would go to court.
Many of them could potentionally go to court here in Sweden under the HMF (Hets mot folkgrupp) law, in particular the first, second and forth statements. And of course the ones that went to court in Finland.
If I am comparing the situation to the USA, it would be seen as extremely infringing to sentence someone for hate speech.
Yeah, but by allowing hate speech, the personal freedom of others would be infringed. And quite frankly, I value the freedom to live a life without being hassled night and day by certain far-right fringe groups more dearly than being free to insult and wager unreasonable hate against other groups.
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