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Please make some sense before crying for a mythical kindergarden Russians so valiantly tried to defend. Russia, 1996, nobody invaded Russia but the Russians wiped out Grozny anyway. Please count kindergardens here in this image.
Another curious fact, despite tens of thousands of the killed ethnic Russians in Chechnya (on top of Chechen civilians) Russian nazis and common citizenry largerly ignored that war, no volunteers, just green Russian troops and militarized police doing the killings and commiting crimes, no outpour of support for the cause. In Ukraine, it is different, despite that "brotherhood" bs tens of thousands of the Russian nazis went to Ukraine to kill Ukrainians in order to grab some more land for wannabe Empire. Now you come up with some outrageous bs to justify that.
Interesting, I asked this thing to name some verifiable facts. Some evidence maybe. I got Grozny and Russian nazies in response.
Why whitewash Stalin ?
During his time we would put a bullet between your eyes Something I would gladly do right now
Who is bellingcat.com ? i never heard of them ? How credible is that source ?
RT.COM is paid for Russian government. This is a know facts. What ever is on it is what Russian government is saying. Official position.
Does that mean that RT.com has more transparency then CNN?
Now. Based on reports published by different governments. All reports agree that:
1. Modern Russian Missile system was in the area, old Soviet Missile system (used by Ukrainian army was in the area.) Both sides had those in the area.
2. It was shot by an older soviet era system.
how far do you need your head in your rear to blame Moscow for a plane that was shot down over Ukraine ? Proshenko side was the one to benefit from this.
Poroshenko Side had the legal responsibility for the plane's safety
Poroshenko Side had the control over plane's routing
what are you talking about ?
You make up bs again, read billingscat report, names, weapon system, unit number and rank of those who pushed the button are available. It is a miracle if they are alive. There is a small death epidemic among top Russian military officials involved in agression against Georgia and Ukraine. I wouldnt bet a broken cent on the lives of that Russian BUK crew. The name of #1 criminal is well known, and he hopes to live and rule forever.
Interesting, I asked this thing to name some verifiable facts. Some evidence maybe. I got Grozny and Russian nazies in response.
Why whitewash Stalin ?
During his time we would put a bullet between your eyes Something I would gladly do right now
What facts are you capable of verifying while typing bs in your underwear? Belingscat report is full of facts. How many more facts do you want to dismiss?
What facts are you capable of verifying while typing bs in your underwear? Belingscat report is full of facts. How many more facts do you want to dismiss?
I never heard of Belingscat. I asked you to explain why you think it's a credible source of information and not propaganda ?
I am wearing black cargo pants right now.
I named facts and told you the sources. None of those sources were RT. Sources are European and American
You hate Russians. that's pretty much the summation of everything you said.
You make up bs again, read billingscat report, names, weapon system, unit number and rank of those who pushed the button are available. It is a miracle if they are alive. There is a small death epidemic among top Russian military officials involved in agression against Georgia and Ukraine. I wouldnt bet a broken cent on the lives of that Russian BUK crew. The name of #1 criminal is well known, and he hopes to live and rule forever.
There is a report by German government. There is a report by Russian Government and there is a report by From Netherlands. Who cares about your cat? Both Russian and German government findings were that it was hit by an older system not currently used by Russian federation but used by Ukraine.
Now, Donetsk stated "Do not fly our skies" and for the next 2-3 weeks Ukrainian military planes were being shot down, there.
About 1-3 plains a day.
Then MH17 got shot.
That benefited Ukrainian government and harmed Russian cause.
Ukraine was in charge of that plane's safety and routing (based on international laws and interpretations).
I hate Putin with all my heart. I hate the vertical of power they have built on the mix of criminality and corruption. I hate that Russians at the bottom of the pyramid have never known a democracy and don't even know where to start. I hate seeing threads on Russian forums with hundreds of replies to questions like "What is the coolest manicure?" and " What can I wear with these boots?" and "Can one wear shorts after 30?". But own politics? Either nothing or black submissive humor, or West-blaming. Those bubbles of discontent that do appear, come out as general complaining but rarely connected with Crimea or Donetsk or Sochi Olympics or other state robberies. It's as if, collectively, cause-effect and logic escapes them. People exchange advises on how to economize on food, how to make 100 dishes out of one single chicken. Proverbial belt-tightening, proverbial submission to fate, proverbial belief that they are Nothing in the big picture, but The Boss is their father. I hate this grey mousy person who got at the very top by chance and thinks an Emperor of himself now. I can hardly watch him talk - all his body language gives out that he is a meany, a liar, an infantile, and he's got either Aspergers and/or sociopathy. No offense to people with Aspergers. It is a shame that this thug was able to quarrel with the whole world and successfully cut his country off the civilization. In his weird twisted mind he finds it OK to demonstratively bulldozer food, - with wide TV coverage - ostensibly as a response to the Western sanctions, but gloating on TV in front of his already poverty-stricken people ?? Resignedly, the people call it "In response to Western sanctions, we'll bomb Voronezh". His friends-billionaires never have to plan oatmeal for a week, thank you very much.
There is a report by German government. There is a report by Russian Government and there is a report by From Netherlands. Who cares about your cat? Both Russian and German government findings were that it was hit by an older system not currently used by Russian federation but used by Ukraine.
Now, Donetsk stated "Do not fly our skies" and for the next 2-3 weeks Ukrainian military planes were being shot down, there.
About 1-3 plains a day.
Then MH17 got shot.
That benefited Ukrainian government and harmed Russian cause.
Ukraine was in charge of that plane's safety and routing (based on international laws and interpretations).
Who would expect anything but denial from the Russian government? As for Dutch and Germans reports- you pull it from your arse, i.e..lie in vernacular. Billingscat is a respected team of the social media researchers. Here is an article in Russian.
Radio Svoboda is a US funded radio station, so State Department approves that message. As for the blame, why dont you try to blame plane' captain too, he had a choice of the routes and he should have anticipated Russia escallating conflict using poorly trained BUK crews. The bulk of blame is on the muederous Russian regime. I could not have anticipated Russian eagerness to kill Ukrainians in the name of nothing 2 years ago myself. Lack of anticipation on Ukrainian side doesnt diminish severity of Russian crimes.
Russian invadors fought Ukrainian troops. Donetsk region is heavily urbanized, there is no way to fight there without hitting one civilian structure or another. Ukrainians didnt bomb Donbass cities just for the heck of it, they didnt bomb cities, period, turn off RT. They fought Russian invadors and their collaborants in the heavily urbanized environment. Yet, compare destruction of Grozny and Donetsk, Russians wiped out Grozny during WW2 like frontal attack, Donetsk is largerly intact, except the airport area. Russian occupation forces supervise dismantling of Donetsk region industries. They move newer plants to Russia, and scrap older ones for metal. So much for producing of capital you allude to. Donetsk region industries are direct competitors to the Russian industries, metallurgy, mining, heavy machine building, Chemicals, Donetsk and Russia are competitors.
Do you live in NYC? Do you have more rights for NYC than say a PA dweller? Show me your papers saying that. NYC is an American city, just like Donetsk is an Ukrainian city. The fact that Russian occupiers and their collaborants ethnically and politically cleansed the occupied Donetsk gives them no right of possession. Using your rationale why would Ukrainians destroy Ukrainian cities Russia plunders as I type this?
Let me try to explain again. There is a civil war in Ukraine, you have pro Ukrainians outside of donbass and pro Russians within the borders controlled by the Donetsk people's republic and the Lugansk people's republic. Nobody accepts them as sovereign nations, not even Russia, but they are de facto independent states and are enemies of Ukraine. As such Ukraine is fighting them to retake their land. To fight in large urban areas is a very hard and dangerous thing to as proven in the battle for Stalin grad, so instead of sending their army to a slaughterhouse they bomb the cities and hope that the separatists will abandon the city, and they retake it. Just like what the US did to the south during the American civil war. The separatists have no reason to bomb their own de facto capital that they are currently occupying, there aren't even any Ukrainian troops within the city of Donetsk and any pro Ukrainians have probably been deported and maybe even shot. It doesn't matter who's side you are on but those are the facts. Personally I'm embarrassed of both and many pointless mistakes are being made, and nobody seems to want to learn. As an analogy Donetsk = Chechnya, Kiev/Ukraine = Moscow/Russia, people involved in this are just way to nationalistic and can't look at it objectively.
Let me try to explain again. There is a civil war in Ukraine, you have pro Ukrainians outside of donbass and pro Russians within the borders controlled by the Donetsk people's
If USA would be weak enough as to allow a foreign entity to send in (with impunity) troops, volunteers, arms, supplies and even nominal leadership of new "republics", there would be a "civil" war and 5 republics in NYC alone. Civil war comes within, it doesnt require a foreign agression to jump start and fuel itself.
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One republic and the Lugansk people's republic. Nobody accepts them as sovereign nations, not even Russia, but they are de facto independent states and are enemies of Ukraine.
They have as much independence as a dog's tail. Russians had to ship even nominal frontmen for the "republics" from Moscow before they found suitable local collaborants. To even imply that DNR and LNR are for real is an insult to human intellifence. Putin just copied favorite Stalin' trick with fake "people' republics" as a vehicle for the Soviet aggression.
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As such Ukraine is fighting them to retake their land.
Their land? Says who? Collaborants assisting a foreign aggression have no legal land claims anywhere in the world, they dont even have claims to their lives as traitors, until foreign aggression is successful that is.
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To fight in large urban areas is a very hard and dangerous thing to as proven in the battle for Stalin grad, so instead of sending their army to a slaughterhouse they bomb the cities and hope that the separatists will abandon the city, and they retake it. Just like what the US did to the south during the American civil war.
That is your RT induced fantasies. As I said Russians bombed hell out of Grozny, and the only large scale damage in Donbas are in the areas of large Russian offensives, everything else is more or less intact, as much as a depressive industrial region, abandoned and looted, can be intact. Ukrainian didnt bomb Donbass Russian style, not even close.
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The separatists have no reason to bomb their own de facto capital that they are currently occupying, there aren't even any Ukrainian troops within the city of Donetsk and any pro Ukrainians have probably been deported and maybe even shot.
Russians have plenty of reasons to shell Ukrainian troops while using urban areas as a cover. Occasionaly, Ukrainian troops returned fire, they are not samaritans to take shelling, after all, still Donetsk is largerly intact (except looting) much unlike Grozny or Donbas cities Russians actually captured from Ukrainian troops. Why would Russians, Buryats, etc. give a dime about Donetsk not to use is as a cover? They shelled other Donetsk cities with high powered rocket missile launchers and artillery, killing hundreds, without excessive soul searching. Their job is not done yet, and they are very vocal about it.
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It doesn't matter who's side you are on but those are the facts.
I have seen just your conjectures not facts. It is just too bad you used solely Russian propaganda to fuel your imagination.
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Personally I'm embarrassed of both and many pointless mistakes are being made, and nobody seems to want to learn. As an analogy Donetsk = Chechnya, Kiev/Ukraine = Moscow/Russia, people involved in this are just way to nationalistic and can't look at it objectively.
I am embarassed too. Previous Ukrainian regimes weakened the army to the point where good chunk of the army just betrayed the oath, the loyal troops were too inept and illequipped to contain rag tag Russian nazi invasion of Girkin that set Donbas fire. Inept Soviet like Ukrainian generals could not anticipate regular Russian battle groups invading Ukrainian territory to strike Ukrainian troops in the back, that stupidity cost lives of hundreds of the most driven Ukrainian soldiers and volunteers. And there is Western powers (especially Euros) refusing to call spade a spade, and seeking ways to pacify Putin at Ukraine' expense.
I hate Putin with all my heart. I hate the vertical of power they have built on the mix of criminality and corruption. I hate that Russians at the bottom of the pyramid have never known a democracy and don't even know where to start. I hate seeing threads on Russian forums with hundreds of replies to questions like "What is the coolest manicure?" and " What can I wear with these boots?" and "Can one wear shorts after 30?". But own politics? Either nothing or black submissive humor, or West-blaming. Those bubbles of discontent that do appear, come out as general complaining but rarely connected with Crimea or Donetsk or Sochi Olympics or other state robberies. It's as if, collectively, cause-effect and logic escapes them. People exchange advises on how to economize on food, how to make 100 dishes out of one single chicken. Proverbial belt-tightening, proverbial submission to fate, proverbial belief that they are Nothing in the big picture, but The Boss is their father. I hate this grey mousy person who got at the very top by chance and thinks an Emperor of himself now. I can hardly watch him talk - all his body language gives out that he is a meany, a liar, an infantile, and he's got either Aspergers and/or sociopathy. No offense to people with Aspergers. It is a shame that this thug was able to quarrel with the whole world and successfully cut his country off the civilization. In his weird twisted mind he finds it OK to demonstratively bulldozer food, - with wide TV coverage - ostensibly as a response to the Western sanctions, but gloating on TV in front of his already poverty-stricken people ?? Resignedly, the people call it "In response to Western sanctions, we'll bomb Voronezh". His friends-billionaires never have to plan oatmeal for a week, thank you very much.
You live in Canada. Don't touch the Russians. It's none of your damn business.
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Something I would gladly do right now 
