U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > World
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 04-24-2018, 03:05 AM
 
Location: Australia
2,878 posts, read 1,343,902 times
Reputation: 5464

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
What's fair is either a) every religious group can get the funding or b) no religious groups gets funding.


The situation in Ontario though is neither a) nor b). No one is eligible for funding except Catholics.
We have Christian schools, Muslim schools, Jewish schools, secular private schools and I am sure others. It is in a way strange that as so many people are educated in at least nominally religious schools but he country is increasingly secular.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-24-2018, 05:45 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Ontario has been able to hide behind the Constitution (even though it is totally changeable as Quebec and Newfoundland have shown) on the question of Catholic schools probably because the non-Catholics in the province have mostly been passive or lapsed Protestants.

But due to immigration you have a growing share of the population that is less zen about religion and my sense is that this obvious double standard will be increasingly questioned and called out.

I don't have any skin in this game as I don't live in Ontario, but I did go to Ontario Catholic schools for a time in my youth.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-24-2018, 05:51 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarisaMay View Post
We have Christian schools, Muslim schools, Jewish schools, secular private schools and I am sure others. It is in a way strange that as so many people are educated in at least nominally religious schools but he country is increasingly secular.
Most of the families in Ontario Catholic schools are not particularly devout either and many aren't even Catholic. (Anyone can send their kids there.)

In many parts of the province there is a widespread perception that the Catholic schools are better than the public ones, due to smaller class sizes and fewer ESL kids - immigrants today are massively non-Catholic and while some send their kids to Catholic school, the vast majority do not.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-24-2018, 07:21 PM
 
Location: Vancouver
16,318 posts, read 11,813,213 times
Reputation: 10051
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielsa1775 View Post
Well we will just have to agree to disagree then.
.
I don't think we are disagreeing on much
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-24-2018, 09:56 PM
 
Location: Australia
2,878 posts, read 1,343,902 times
Reputation: 5464
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Most of the families in Ontario Catholic schools are not particularly devout either and many aren't even Catholic. (Anyone can send their kids there.)

In many parts of the province there is a widespread perception that the Catholic schools are better than the public ones, due to smaller class sizes and fewer ESL kids - immigrants today are massively non-Catholic and while some send their kids to Catholic school, the vast majority do not.
In Sydney some parents avoid the strongly ESL schools because in some the standard it too high and they worry about too much academic pressure. I think we are one of the few places where the ESL kids often outperform the non ESL. This is because of the nature of our immigration program, not that the rest of us are really dumb!!
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-25-2018, 06:14 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarisaMay View Post
In Sydney some parents avoid the strongly ESL schools because in some the standard it too high and they worry about too much academic pressure. I think we are one of the few places where the ESL kids often outperform the non ESL. This is because of the nature of our immigration program, not that the rest of us are really dumb!!
Kids of certain origins (I think you can guess which ones) are also stereotyped as being high academic and piano achievers in Canada too.

But I've never heard of non-immigrant parents not wanting their kids to be around them in school due to too much pressure. Perhaps it could be that they aren't that concentrated in certain areas or schools?

BTW a lot of the kids from the stereotyped achiever nations are often in the Catholic schools I was talking about, even though their families are almost never Catholic.

Some of these immigrant parents even put their kids in "French first" Catholic schools which do exist in small numbers in English-speaking parts of Canada. For an even greater challenge.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-25-2018, 02:59 PM
 
21,967 posts, read 13,088,162 times
Reputation: 16234
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Ontario has been able to hide behind the Constitution (even though it is totally changeable as Quebec and Newfoundland have shown) on the question of Catholic schools probably because the non-Catholics in the province have mostly been passive or lapsed Protestants.

But due to immigration you have a growing share of the population that is less zen about religion and my sense is that this obvious double standard will be increasingly questioned and called out.

I don't have any skin in this game as I don't live in Ontario, but I did go to Ontario Catholic schools for a time in my youth.

You are right on the money with this one and your later posts regarding Catholic schools.

As long time Ontarian, I've often questioned the wisdom of having "public" schools demarked by any religion.

It's plain nuts and was when it was started.

The prejudicial aspect notwithstanding, one can only wonder at what new immigrants think upon having it explained to them.

I've often thought the reasoning behind parents choosing to enroll children in the Catholic system while having no religion to speak of themselves would be that of the perception of better discipline and less free-for-all environment. Perhaps the additional aspect of many of the Catholic schools using a school uniform might have something to do with it.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-25-2018, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post

I've often thought the reasoning behind parents choosing to enroll children in the Catholic system while having no religion to speak of themselves would be that of the perception of better discipline and less free-for-all environment. Perhaps the additional aspect of many of the Catholic schools using a school uniform might have something to do with it.
It's seen by many as the closest thing you get to private school for your kids without having to pay for private school.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-25-2018, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post

It's plain nuts and was when it was started.

.

Things were a lot simpler then, I guess. The population wasn't as diverse and when you sent Protestants on one side and Catholics on other, you pretty much covered off everyone.


And of course neither side wanted much anything to do with the other, so everyone was happy to have thier own schools.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-25-2018, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
25,227 posts, read 32,625,694 times
Reputation: 10404
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
You are right on the money with this one and your later posts regarding Catholic schools.

As long time Ontarian, I've often questioned the wisdom of having "public" schools demarked by any religion.
.

I've still got a lot of friends and relatives in Ontario, and most of them either send their kids to Catholic schools or teach in that system.


They'll defend - even if it's undefendable, really - the system tooth and nail if ever the government tried to change it. And only a small minority I would call religious, with almost none of them going to mass on Sundays.


They know they've got a good thing going.


Anyway, in response to the incongruity of it all there are politicians in Ontario (Conservatives I am pretty sure) who have said that the solution is to offer any decent-sized religious group their own publicly-funded schools. As a neighbour and a friend of Ontario I would not recommend this approach but, hey, it's your province!
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > World Forums > World

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2022, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top