Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Vancouver has a moderate Oceanic Climate that for a few months in the summer borders on a pleasant mediterranean like climate, however the rest of the year it sees a lot of rain, which makes it more oceanic than mediterranean. Oceanic climate generally have cool summers and mild winters, rather than extreme weather and are generally discribed as having comfortable tempretures.
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 1 day ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,163 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Some Mediterranean climates have wetter winters than some Oceanic climates.
I don't see somewhere like Bergen as having comfortable temperatures -it has 7 months colder than my coldest month
Bergen's weather is quite mild.
As for Mediterranean climates they tend to be drier and hotter.
I live in an Oceanic Climate and arriving in the Mediterranean you can usually notice a big difference in climate just as you would expect when arriving in parts of California from Seattle or Vancouver.
There may be a few months when the weather is very pleasant in oceanic climates but generally they are not as pleasant as Mediterranean climates in terms of all year round.
Personsally I like the Oceanic Climate it's very comfortable to live in and generally avoids some of the more extreme weather conditions you get in other countries across the world.
You also find oceanic climates to have a lot of beautiful green countryside.
As for Mediterranean climates they tend to be drier and hotter.
I live in an Oceanic Climate and arriving in the Mediterranean you can usually notice a big difference in climate just as you would expect when arriving in parts of California from Seattle or Vancouver.
There may be a few months when the weather is very pleasant in oceanic climates but generally they are not as pleasant as Mediterranean climates in terms of all year round.
Personsally I like the Oceanic Climate it's very comfortable to live in and generally avoids some of the more extreme weather conditions you get in other countries across the world.
You also find oceanic climates to have a lot of beautiful green countryside.
Bergen might be mild to you, but it isn't to me -imagine a climate that had 7 months colder than the coldest month in your climate, and see if you would consider that mild.
Pleasantness is subjective -Rome is no warmer than here in winter, and I would say less pleasant in summer, but that isn't something that can be shown as an absolute.
Oceanic climates can be dry looking climates, year round.
It only adds confusion, if people don't understand the terminology and the system used.
C groups are already divided into categories based on temperature - dividing only the hot summer climates into a further category based on rainfall pattern, while ignoring the same /factors/division for cooler summer C climates, is bad science.
I totally agree with you, I just think a different name should be used to make a clear distinction, just like there is a clear distinction between humid subtropical, humid oceanic, and humid continental. People get hung up on the term Mediterranean, similar to how people get hung up with the term subtropical, but in this case Mediterranean is being applied to a whole range of climates (Csa, Csb, Csc, Dsa, Dsb, Dsc)
Pacific Madrone (Arbutus Menziesii) is a native broadleaf evergreen that you can find all over in Seattle, Victoria and even certain areas of Metro Vancouver. There are plenty of other broadleaf evergreens that grow in the PNW even ones adapted to warmer climates like Southern Magnolia.
Native vegetation doesn't always correspond with what you might expect from a place. There are many areas with true subtropical climates like in parts of the Southeast US which have native coniferous forests.
I agree that climate often doesn't correlate with vegetation, I just have trouble with a system that lumps the climate of Seattle in with the climate of Santa Barbara.
you are forgetting the distinction between warm summer (Csb) and hot summer (Csa) Mediterranean climates. It would be like claiming that oceanic (Cfb) and subtropical (Cfa) are the same climate.
There are only a few places that have Csb climates, but they have a similar look.
Also I think Trewartha does a pretty bad job, it doesn't differentiate between hot, warm and cool climates. It considers the hot deserts of the SW and the cold deserts of the intermountain west to be the same, it doesn't distinguish between the mild "oceanic" climates of the west and the more continental "oceanic" climates of the east. And it does a bad job distinguishing between rainfall patterns so Mediterranean climates usually end up as either desert, semi arid or subtropical.
The Trewartha map still looks like a much better match for the vegetation/correlated to climate (in North America at least). In North America I consider Csb climates to be coastal California and northern coastal Baja and Csa climates to be the areas directly inland that are too wet to be desert but are still subtropical. There's a big difference between the climate of Santa Barbara which has a warm summer due to proximity to the ocean but a dry summer season that is as long as Fresno (a Csa climate) vs Seattle which has a very short dry summer season with some precipitation during those months (most years). The difference between the coast of WA and Seattle in July is that when the coast is getting rain, Seattle is cool and cloudy and may not be getting more than a bit of drizzle.
I think Koppen is an interesting system but I think the formulas for B and C climates need some adjusting (at least in North America). The Mediterannen issue is one thing, but I also think Koppen misclassifies most of the Great Basin desert as a steppe climate rather than a cold winter desert.
I agree that climate often doesn't correlate with vegetation, I just have trouble with a system that lumps the climate of Seattle in with the climate of Santa Barbara.
According to Trewartha, Virginia Beach and Orlando are in the same climate zone (Cf) yet their winters are quite different with Virginia Beach being much colder. In fact the difference between the coldest month in winter as well as yearly average temperature is greater between Virginia Beach and Orlando than it is between Santa Barbara and Seattle. So why is it ok for Virginia Beach and Orlando to be in the same climate zone and it is not ok for Seattle and Santa Barbara to be in the same zone? One could make the argument that they are at opposite ends of the zone.
Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 1 day ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,163 posts, read 13,455,286 times
Reputation: 19459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Bergen might be mild to you, but it isn't to me -imagine a climate that had 7 months colder than the coldest month in your climate, and see if you would consider that mild.
Pleasantness is subjective -Rome is no warmer than here in winter, and I would say less pleasant in summer, but that isn't something that can be shown as an absolute.
Oceanic climates can be dry looking climates, year round.
A major part of Maritime Climates als known as Oceanic Climates is high rates of participation and four seasons.
If they were Mediteranean Climates then their would be no need for differentiation.
Bergen features a temperate oceanic climate (Köppen: Cfb). Bergen experiences plentiful rainfall in all seasons, with annual precipitation measuring 2,250 mm (89 in) on average. This is because Bergen is surrounded by mountains that cause moist North Atlantic air to undergo orographic lift, yielding abundant rainfall.
Bergen's weather is warmer than the city's latitude (60.4° N) might suggest. Temperatures below -10 degrees Celsius are rare. Summer temperatures sometimes reach the upper 20s, but the city sees temperatures over 30 degrees only a few days each decade.
A major part of Maritime Climates als known as Oceanic Climates is high rates of participation and four seasons.
If they were Mediteranean Climates then their would be no need for differentiation.
Bergen features a temperate oceanic climate (Köppen: Cfb). Bergen experiences plentiful rainfall in all seasons, with annual precipitation measuring 2,250 mm (89 in) on average. This is because Bergen is surrounded by mountains that cause moist North Atlantic air to undergo orographic lift, yielding abundant rainfall.
Bergen's weather is warmer than the city's latitude (60.4° N) might suggest. Temperatures below -10 degrees Celsius are rare. Summer temperatures sometimes reach the upper 20s, but the city sees temperatures over 30 degrees only a few days each decade.
Four seasons is much less a feature of my climate, than it is in most Mediterranean climates. Seasonality of precipitation is the qualifying factor, not high rates - some Maritime climates are drier than many Mediterranean climates.
A high ratio between cool season/warm season precipitation, due to the frequency of high pressure,, and having winters between 0 and 18C average is how Mediterranean C climates are defined.
Mild is a relative term -Bergen's average maximum temperature during the three coldest months, has never been recorded in my climate on even a single day, and summer is colder than both autumn and spring here. It has about 100 additional days of rain than here, and about 1400 less hours of sunshine. the latitude distance is also much greater than the difference between Vancouver and San Diego. They are both Cfb climates though because Koppen correctly identified the prevailing pattern over the year.
Climates do not have to feel similar to be in the same classification -Koppen didn't do a guide to holiday resort westher.
According to Trewartha, Virginia Beach and Orlando are in the same climate zone (Cf) yet their winters are quite different with Virginia Beach being much colder. In fact the difference between the coldest month in winter as well as yearly average temperature is greater between Virginia Beach and Orlando than it is between Santa Barbara and Seattle. So why is it ok for Virginia Beach and Orlando to be in the same climate zone and it is not ok for Seattle and Santa Barbara to be in the same zone? One could make the argument that they are at opposite ends of the zone.
Sure, it's all about how to lump and split and you will get into grey areas as you get into the zone extremes. In the case of Orlando / Virginia Beach the issue is how you quantify what constitutes a continental winter. In the other case it's about how you quantify a dry summer.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
