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I don't think anything is hopeless, but maybe you'd better come and see and make connections because a lot of stuff works like that in Italy. I don't think the language is an issue, it is a rather easy language to learn and anyway it's great to communicate with the people in general, it's the better way to understand a country and its culture.
It's interesting because I am also interested in working in the environment (geography major) but I'm just getting started and trying to understand how things work in this country.
I would say the weather is fine, even in the north in the end there's just about 3 months of coat weather really, half of the year is really quite warm. We do have snow most winters, but it never gets much below freezing (unless you go really uphill). A normal winter day in the south would 8-12c with chances of rain, in the north it's more like 0-5c, but then it is often milder than that. Right now it's already close to 20c in the afternoons most days. Houses are generally well made and actually many people tend to overheat in my opinion.
Yeah people love football, I just think in terms of "outdoor culture" Italy is not the most obvious country compared to say, Germany or Switzerland, which does not mean that you can't do it ! Of course there are very nice areas to visit, it's just that, if you plan on visiting the south with a tent and try to rockclimb or go on a mountain bike trip, there's not much in terms of organized stuff to do so, I think Italy is very much "urbanized" compared to a "new world" country. If you go to the Alps the outdoor culture tends to be closer to German countries, I think the more you have to go through the winter cold, the more you crave for outdoor summer activities.
Yes, I have a little knowledge of the language and I am sure that a few months in Italy would solve that issue. As a migrant, I do not have connections anywhere. So, I guess I would have to spend some time in the country for that. It’s interesting when it comes to “outdoor culture” or “sports culture”. Australia is known to have such a culture, and they do go to the gym a lot.
But, they also take their cars everywhere, which to me is not “sporty” or “healthy”. Whereas people of southern Europe might not be as active in sports, but they do walk a lot and spend time outdoors. Germany is wet and cold and a lot of the time is spend indoors, just like in Sweden.
Quote:
Originally Posted by adrianf91
Neither Italy nor Australia
Go to Spain my friend!
Why would you say Spain? Is not Spain also going through a economic (and political) crisis of its own? I am tempted to go down to Andalucía and try my luck there. A lot of international health clinics for my girlfriend to work at. But, I don’t know what I could do there as I suspect they don’t have a lot of environmental work. Also, Spanish is much more difficult than Italian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World
Australia like the US was built on immgration, so lots of people have started a new life there.
If you have any skills or are qualified in anything, it improves your chances as Australia has a points based immigration system.
In terms of Italy, it was the opposite, Italians left to go to the US and established communities in many cities across the world.
The Italian impact in the US has been substantial in terms of food and culture.
Yes, lot of Europeans in the US. But, those were other times. Both me and my girlfriend have Science bachelors from one of the top universities in Europe. Both our occupation/skillsets are on the Australian list of “desired occupations”. Still, without years of work experience (which we do not have) there is no chance of us getting a visa. And, because of the government change in a few weeks, it is a bad time to try getting a visa now as the rules likely will change soon.
Is Spanish really much more difficult than Italian? There probably isn't much difference between the two countries in terms of getting a job, the Spanish economy is growing much quicker than the Italian economy but parts of Spain do still have high unemployment.
Yes, I have a little knowledge of the language and I am sure that a few months in Italy would solve that issue. As a migrant, I do not have connections anywhere. So, I guess I would have to spend some time in the country for that. It’s interesting when it comes to “outdoor culture” or “sports culture”. Australia is known to have such a culture, and they do go to the gym a lot.
But, they also take their cars everywhere, which to me is not “sporty” or “healthy”. Whereas people of southern Europe might not be as active in sports, but they do walk a lot and spend time outdoors. Germany is wet and cold and a lot of the time is spend indoors, just like in Sweden.
I think it's easy to meet italian people, they're usually open and curious to speak to foreigners. Which is a different thing to, "make connections easily", but I am still trying to understand some aspects of the culture. Like I said, the language is rather easy.
Italy is similar to Australia in that being fit is seen as a good thing, at least in the north, and people tend to go to the gym, but Italy is .also the #1 country in Europe for car ownership, and it's overcrowded with cars, with a lot of air pollution
One funny example: I do pilates once a week in my neighborhood, and the gym is like 900 m away from home. I go there by bike, because it's fast and efficient. I could walk, but it would take longer, and I just like to hop on the bike, get there and start the lesson. Well most people use their cars to go there, including many people who live in the neighborhood (which is mostly residential with lots of small stores, not really the suburbia). Sometimes I get the "oh you come by bike ? you're a really sporty person !" comment. I find it weird because I see all those young fit people doing really intense activities and I'm just like doing one hour a pilates a week, which is sporty but hardly very intense. I just have an average body and I do it for curing my back issues. And yet, people see the fact that I use a bike as a very sporty thing..... so yeah that's also why I consider Italy to be rather behind when it comes to the outdoors. I am originally from france and biking is a lot more common there, not just for sports but for getting around. Here people regularly use their cars to cover very short distances.
I also like camping with a tent. It's seen as a very weird thing here. People just do not see the appeal. They think it's a pain to have to use a tent, cook with a gas thingy and would rather stay in a hotel or at least use a camping car (or whatever it's called). They like comfort. They do not like to make efforts. It's seen as backwards and something for people with no money. No real interest in getting closer to nature. This includes my friends who really like to bike on vacation. I think it's a roman / mediterranean thing, being in concrete houses, sheds from the strong sunshine (at least in the center / south). In the german countries, in England, and to a lesser extent in France, people enjoy the outdoors more, precisely because they get to enjoy fewer days of nice weather a year. The best tent brands are all british. These guys know how to handle the rain. Down here people do not use their bikes if there's 30% chance of rain. And as soon as the highs drop below 20c, many people just pull out their winter coats.
I would say that where I live, in Northern Italy, we're halfway between the mediterranean and German culture. People bike more, walk more than in the south, but also use their cars a lot and are not much into camping outdoors, and like to have lots of infrastructures when it comes to tourism, like for instance beaches which are not natural and which are all private with showers and stuff.
Australia like the US was built on immgration, so lots of people have started a new life there.
If you have any skills or are qualified in anything, it improves your chances as Australia has a points based immigration system.
In terms of Italy, it was the opposite, Italians left to go to the US and established communities in many cities across the world.
As a result, Italians are clannish and even more so the further south you go.
In Italy, you will have to live there for five years before you are able to purchase their state health insurance. In the meantime, you are required to have private insurance which is costly.
I can't imagine that it is easy to get a working visa there. The economy isn't great. BTW, Italy has a completely different legal system with different individual rights.
I'm an American guy living in Spain (Madrid) and currently in Australia for 3 months (mainly in Brisbane). Have not lived in Italy, but I've been there several times, and for all intents and purposes is quite comparable to Spain. Australia and Southern Europe are different worlds and kind of hard to compare, but I'll take a stab.
Spain/ Italy, and most of Europe for that matter, was developed long before cars were even a thought. As a result, cities and urban areas are much more compressed. Instead of separating zoning as in the USA or Australia, the ground floor of most buildings in city centers in Southern Europe will be a commercial space, with the upper floors being residential. This, in combination with more accessible and comprehensive public transport, make life, in my opinion, much more convenient in a large European city. I don't live in a particularly busy neighborhood of Madrid, but I have 2 grocery stores, 2 butcher shops, a fruit shop, 2 convenience stores, a few hair salons/ barber shops, and a bakery all within 2 blocks of my apartment. This also promotes people being out and about, especially when the weather is nice, which it is most of the year in Southern Europe. In Australia, if I want to go to any of these places, I've got to jump in the car, drive a few minutes (at best), park, shop, load up my car, and drive home.
People in southern Europe also generally seem to be happier with stability and prioritize family life. They are content to get a stable job with a good wage, eat lunch at their parents house every Sunday with all 28 members of their extended family, and once they have that, seem to settle down quicker. Australians seem to be more like Americans in that they strive to climb the corporate ladder, base their weekly life around work, willing to take more risks in business, move out of their parents house etc. Australians have an incredibly driven society business and career wise, where as Southern Europeans seem to focus more on their personal and family life. This not to say Spaniards don't care about their careers and Aussies don't spend time with their families, i'm just generalizing here.
I will say, that Australians still seem to have a much better work-life balance than most Americans, and this probably comes down to their better working rights, higher wages, and more holiday days per year. Australians certainly enjoy themselves on the weekends - plenty of beach time and bbqs here. It just seems that, during the week especially, Australians have a very rigid schedule entirely based around work. Whereas Spaniards and Italians have 0 issue staying up 'til midnight drinking wine after a long dinner on a Tuesday.
I think in Southern Europe, the compressed infrastructure and convenience of grabbing a quick glass of wine with your friend, along with the stronger emphasis on personal and family time really puts a casual spin on society. Australia is a get-up early, grind your day out, go home and cook dinner at 6pm kind of place. Spain is a wake up late, saunter into the office at 9, long lunch, eat dinner with a few glasses of wine kinda place. I spent some years on the Big Island of Hawaii prior to moving to Spain, which, by American standards, is slooooww. But that's nothing compared to even the biggest cities in Southern Europe. I can walk down Gran Via before 8:30am and it's a ghost town. Nothing opens in Spain before 9am, whereas nothing in Australia is open after 9pm.
In general, I find myself feeling much more productive in Australia, but much more relaxed in Spain. I'll say this: If you want to focus on your career and make a lot of money, Australia is probably the place for you. If you want to focus on personal life and enjoying yourself, Southern Europe is probably more your speed.
i'm just generalizing here. People in southern Europe also generally seem to be happier with stability and prioritize family life. They are content to get a stable job with a good wage, eat lunch at their parents house every Sunday with all 28 members of their extended family, and once they have that, seem to settle down quicker.
Very accurate.
Even if they move out of their village/comune for Milan or Rome, every holiday (including their town's Patron Saint Day) they return to see the extended family.
Would agree with most of the couple of posts above. However there are parts of some Australian cities, in the inner rings, which are more compact and pedestrian friendly. However they are the most expensive parts of the cities. Perth was settled later and is very spread out. There is an almighty amount of land around it to spread into so not that surprising.
Italians, and I know some very well indeed, can be quite dull in their lifeplans. Keep in mind that the unemployment rate is still over 10% and if one can manage to obtain a secure permanent position, then there is a lot of pressure from the family to keep it. In Australia people move around more in their jobs and the area of Sydney where I live currently has an unemployment rate of about 2.6%.
I agree Australia is very much a day culture. It is much more so these days than when I was young. My favourite local coffee shop opens at 4 30 am. I remember being in a town in Sicily on a Sunday night. I was shocked that they had a concert where all the families, including young children, were up and around the piazza at 10pm and later. I kept wondering why they were not all home preparing for school and work for the week ahead.
Australian culture is quite different to Italian. Italy's culture is what is called enmeshed whereas Australia's is more individualistic. However, Australian families tend to be close but this only sometimes applies to extended families. I do not feel any obligation to keep in contact with cousins, for example, unless I have a lot in common with them.
We would be able to live in Italy but have no desire to do so even though we love visiting. DH is an avid golfer and it is little played there. Italians apparently watch more television than any other country in Europe (and DH watches a lot here) but it is pretty pathetic over there. Italians our age tend to do precisely what we do ie help their adult kids with childcare and we could not do that if we took off for Europe.
I wonder what the OP has decided to do? He has had a lot of threads where he is considering different options.
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