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Old 05-09-2021, 07:55 PM
 
Location: Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daywalk View Post
The next generation of Chinese immigrants to western countries assimilate and speak English by and large… many of them no longer keep Chinese as their dialect….
Yes of course. My point is many didn't speak Mandarin to being with.
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Old 05-09-2021, 09:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanLuis View Post
Yes of course. My point is many didn't speak Mandarin to being with.
Yeah, quite a bit of immigrants speak Cantonese, including those originally from Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia, Malaysia etc. Mandarin is the official written form, though Cantonese is written in the same way and pronounce in a more colorful way.
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Old 05-09-2021, 09:31 PM
 
Location: Edmonds, WA
8,975 posts, read 10,239,039 times
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I doubt it. English sort of won out and no offense but Mandarin is one of the worst sounding languages I’ve ever heard. Please give me Japanese, Spanish, French, Korean, Tagalog, anything besides Mandarin.
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Old 05-09-2021, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Baltimore, MD
173 posts, read 199,264 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arr430 View Post
So is English. Almost every English verb can be expressed as a two-word verb (look up, come back, put together) based on Germanic roots, or one-word (consult, return, assemble) from Latin roots. One form has become customary in formal context, the other in casual. A great beauty of English is that every speaker knows both languages and can signal formality.
There are a lot of languages that have different ways to say the same thing.

To elaborate on what I was describing with Arabic - if a non native Arabic speaker learns Algerian colloquial arabic, a language barrier will still exist with one who speaks only the Saudi colloquial Arabic, for example, and that person won't necessarily understand much of Modern Standard Arabic (the language of media) either. That's not the case with English - if one learns their English to a proficient level in the UK, for example, that shouldn't cause much of an issue communicating with people in Canada or the US.

My point being, a "language" like Arabic being, not one language, but many languages (even if not recognized as such politically) is one of several factors that, in my opinion, would make it difficult for Arabic to be an ascendant language outside of the Arab world.
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Old 05-10-2021, 04:44 PM
 
5,428 posts, read 3,509,929 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
I doubt it. English sort of won out and no offense but Mandarin is one of the worst sounding languages I’ve ever heard. Please give me Japanese, Spanish, French, Korean, Tagalog, anything besides Mandarin.
I’d have to agree, though the biggest drawback of Mandarin is that it’s too confusing as a language. There are far too many characters, that it becomes difficult to remember a lot of them.
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Old 05-11-2021, 10:57 AM
 
5,214 posts, read 4,034,708 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
I doubt it. English sort of won out and no offense but Mandarin is one of the worst sounding languages I’ve ever heard. Please give me Japanese, Spanish, French, Korean, Tagalog, anything besides Mandarin.

I'd rather see Dogecoin stuck at $666 forever rather than having russian or french as a language spoken in any country, in fact I really hope Doge gets stuck at $666 as of today.
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Old 05-11-2021, 11:36 AM
 
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Do you guys see Mandarin becoming a lingua franca, at least in Korea/Japan and southeast asia?

Do you think Koreans and Japanese will eventually communicate with each other in Chinese instead of English? Same with perhaps Vietnamese and Japanese/Koreans, etc....
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Old 05-11-2021, 12:59 PM
 
14,373 posts, read 11,769,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oistrakh12 View Post
Do you guys see Mandarin becoming a lingua franca, at least in Korea/Japan and southeast asia?

Do you think Koreans and Japanese will eventually communicate with each other in Chinese instead of English? Same with perhaps Vietnamese and Japanese/Koreans, etc....
Why would they do that, when they can speak English with each other AND speak English with the rest of the world? Why have a separate, second common language just for Southeast Asia?

Anyway, I will grant that Vietnamese will have an easier time with Chinese, because they are already familiar with the concept of tones, and the grammar is similar, but knowing Korean or Japanese does not assist a person in learning Chinese very much.

Japanese would have a head start with written Chinese, because they use many of the same characters (but some common Chinese characters aren't used in Japanese and vice versa, plus some characters have diverged in meaning). Koreans haven't used Chinese characters for long enough that most younger people hardly know any.

All three languages have a lot of Chinese loanwords, but the pronunciations are so different now that those words will have to be memorized like any other new vocabulary.

More importantly, in grammar, syntax and pronunciation, Korean and Japanese could hardly be less like Chinese.
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Old 05-11-2021, 03:38 PM
 
504 posts, read 600,782 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saibot View Post
Why would they do that, when they can speak English with each other AND speak English with the rest of the world? Why have a separate, second common language just for Southeast Asia?

Anyway, I will grant that Vietnamese will have an easier time with Chinese, because they are already familiar with the concept of tones, and the grammar is similar, but knowing Korean or Japanese does not assist a person in learning Chinese very much.

Japanese would have a head start with written Chinese, because they use many of the same characters (but some common Chinese characters aren't used in Japanese and vice versa, plus some characters have diverged in meaning). Koreans haven't used Chinese characters for long enough that most younger people hardly know any.

All three languages have a lot of Chinese loanwords, but the pronunciations are so different now that those words will have to be memorized like any other new vocabulary.

More importantly, in grammar, syntax and pronunciation, Korean and Japanese could hardly be less like Chinese.
A lot of workers in Thailand will speak to "chinese-looking" tourists in Chinese instead of English. When you travel to Seoul, most workers in the tourism industry speak Chinese.
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Old 05-11-2021, 07:31 PM
 
14,373 posts, read 11,769,729 times
Reputation: 39295
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oistrakh12 View Post
A lot of workers in Thailand will speak to "chinese-looking" tourists in Chinese instead of English. When you travel to Seoul, most workers in the tourism industry speak Chinese.
Of course, people who speak specific foreign languages are sought out by the tourism industry. Many people who work in the tourism industry in parts of the US including New York City and Los Angeles speak Chinese, too. That's because those are popular spots for Chinese tourists.

But the question is whether Mandarin will replace English as the second language of choice for East Asians in general. And I think not.
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