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Thank you NVdave for those links. Those Pac boots can be rated to sub 100 degrees, impressive! Where can one find some really thick head and neck insulation? The head/neck cover of the Northern Outfitters look so much thinner compared to the body coverings.
Do people wear the kind of pants like in the Northern outfitter's clothing system? I can't imagine that you can just add a layer under your jeans, the pants of NO (like the spaceman's) seem more suitable for the really cold temp.
Without getting overly nosy, what are you planning on doing? One of the reasons why I'll spend money on heavy-duty cold weather gear is that I can be out hunting for a couple days, alone, in winters, at elevation and I need to be prepared for the worst that can come. There is no "plan B" of going into a warm building; if I'm not prepared, it's check-out time.
But if you're just bopping around town in Jackson, then wearing -100F boots is ridiculous overkill, and normal pac's or insulated winter boots will probably do fine. Most people bopping around Jackson probably would not be in anything nearly as heavy-duty as NO's stuff - but if you're hunting in the northern Rockies (not Yellowstone, since there is no hunting there, but in Idaho there's areas where the weather is every bit as cold), the NO stuff isn't a bad idea at all.
If you're skiing or something similar, the NO stuff will be horribly confining. When you're skiing, or hiking or on a snow machine, you're probably not planning on spending the night out in the brush. You're probably planning on coming back into a warm place for the night, so what you need is some stuff that helps block the wind, keeps you warm, doesn't retain a whole lot of moisture and allows you to move a bit more easily than full-on arctic stuff will. A good wool cap and a wool scarf will be more than enough head/neck stuff when you're bopping around town. You'll probably want something more substantial for skiing or snow-machining.
Here's another place where I've shopped for winter gear that helps get prices down by selling "seconds" and discontinued stuff:
Have a look through their winter gear. Most of it would do fine for situations in town, even on really cold days.
The things I've done at -40F probably aren't what you're going to do. Most people don't (willingly) go out camping in sub-zero temps. If you're certain you're going to be able to make it into a warmed building, you don't need to go to extremes, you just need to be smart about it. If you're wanting to sleep comfortably, or sit in a hunting blind for hours without freezing... you have to be suiting up very differently.
Thank you NVdave for those links. Those Pac boots can be rated to sub 100 degrees, impressive! Where can one find some really thick head and neck insulation? The head/neck cover of the Northern Outfitters look so much thinner compared to the body coverings.
Do people wear the kind of pants like in the Northern outfitter's clothing system? I can't imagine that you can just add a layer under your jeans, the pants of NO (like the spaceman's) seem more suitable for the really cold temp.
I wear long johns under my pants/jeans all winter long. As long as your pants aren't skin tight you should be able to wear an additional layer of warmth. Really helps cut out the wind blowing through. And whenever I'm out shoveling I wear my snow pants over top.
There are jeans with an added flannel layer in a lot of catalogs (LL Bean comes to mind) but I've not tried these.
as for the thick head/neck gear.. you could try a fur lined bomber/aviator hat that has the ear flaps that come down and tie under the chin. Depends on if you care if you get "hat hair" or not. That and a nice scarf and you should be able to ward off the cold.
Without getting overly nosy, what are you planning on doing?
This is the crux of the matter.
If you're walking around town, you'll likely be in and out of buildings frequently with Lots of opportunity to warm up if you get chilly. You may want a primary layer of silk/wool/capolene/etc... but jeans, a sweater/sweatshirt and windproof jacket will be enough for trotting around town. Well, with the obvious gloves (don't need to be real insulative if you keep your hands in your pockets) and hat (any kind, but I like my ears covered). You do NOT need super expensive, heavy, extreme gear for most things you do in the winter here. A simple wool knit hat will do, $8. Ditto on gloves, guys in WY tend to favor leather insulated work gloves for most everything outside, $10 a pair. NVDave sounds like a trapper, going out on his own into the mountains and Sleeping outside, where the gear he linked to is important to sustain life. I don't imagine you'll be doing anything of the sort.
Skiing or snowshoing? Then you'll want to avoid the cotton as NVDave mentioned, add a waterproof layer to your legs and thicker gloves/mittens. I actually wear less warm clothes when skiing because the activity makes me hot. Of course, I freeze my bum off if on the chair ride back up if it's windy.
Snowmobiling requires more wind-proof gear, and better insulation all around.
My wife is originally from Atlanta, born and raised before I moved her up here. She was cold for the first winter (though we had a nasty inversion going on and highs were in the -teens), but the 2nd winter had her going out in a basic knit hat, sweatshirt over a t-shirt, jeans and thin stretchy gloves if she was just running around town. Not much time at all to acclimate.
Thank you all for the wonderful help. NVdave, thank you for your very detailed post, now I know something about dealing with cold weather! Now I get a Much more realistic picture of what life is like over there when it gets cold.
Well, life is tough out there. The beautiful mountains come with some really tough reality. I have never been in sub zeros. The northeastern area where I have lived get to at the lowest to around zero and that is already the days when you don't step outside unless absolutely necessary.
For those of you that leave WY during the winter months, is it easy to manage? Do you feel a bit displaced to have to go somewhere else for a few months every year? What do you do about your house/apartment when you are away?
When is the really cold time in Jackson? Jan. or Feb? The data on the city-data weather is not accurate, it says that the lowest temp of Jackson in the year is in the mid-teens and I thought it wasn't that bad, until I saw some daily temp online.
Maybe I should visit in March and plan on visiting Jackson for the summers rather than living in Jackson. It is not the expenses, the cold weather creates so many problems that I am just becoming aware of.
Thank you.
When my husband bought the house in Wyoming it was so he would have a place to stay when he wanted when he got off work there. He works two weeks on and two weeks off. Turned out he would rather live there most of the time! So I have been turning down future commissions for the last two years so I can be available to play during his time off. He likes to snowmobile - hunt - fish - I call it all the guy stuff. I know women enjoy the same activities - just not me. So his buddies get to use the house as a base. I get to spend time at the beach.
You may be right about visiting in March. There will be snow but maybe not as cold. We have gone there on Spring break with the Grandkids. It's now like "sorry Grandma, we will go to the beach with you in July we want to play in the snow with Grand Dad".
When you are there in March you could apply for a summer job and maybe meet some people your age to learn more about living conditions. There were lots of twenty/thirty somethings everywhere we went. They are all living somewhere!
When I was in Jackson in November, I had just got my new Mukluks (they are a snow boot). A couple of other women had on other styles of them and a group of us ended up having a boot conversation. Think about what you are actually going to be doing in Jackson before you buy anything. I got a ballcap with turtle fur that covers my ears and neck that works just fine for short term time outside. Most of the young people wore jeans, boots, and ski jackets. Some of the girls had on hats - others did not. Just hanging around town you are going to want a little more style than if you were going hunting. You can also rent snow suits if you only need it for a few days. Get a pair of gloves. I got a pair of ski gloves but ended up wearing my leather gloves more. You would get a lot of use from a big scarf to wrap around your neck or cover your face.
Thank you all for the wonderful help. I plan on doing the daily couple of hours' outdoor hikes in any kind of temp. I can see it would look too funny in the town to be dressed like a spaceman.
But I read that in Wy you need to have in your car an overall that can keep you warm in the coldest temp., since you never know how quickly it can get cold, or if your car can't start in the middle of nowhere. For that purpose, would the NO clothing that NVdave use be appropriate? maybe add a sub 100 F rated sleeping bag too? All of these go in the car trunk, it is best they are never used but be prepared for the worst. What kind of equipment do you need to have/keep just in case your car wont start in a really cold spell?
When you walk in the snow do you add those spiky snow shoe gears to your boots?
Also, how do you carry your drinking water in the cold? Do you use a thermo? Or do you just do without water? Well, not if you are going to be active outdoors for half a day or a day.
My "emergency kit" (moves to whatever vehicle I'm taking on a longer trip, not worried about trips within my county because the roads are well traveled) is:
gallon of water, some energy bars, candles, wool and thermal/space blanket, gloves, hat, wind up radio/flashlight and I think there's something else in there. Both cars have jumper cables and chains in them full time. When I'm driving my truck, I also pack 5 gallons of extra fuel in the back (when there's space).. but I use the truck for off-road trips where you can REALLY burn a lot of gas getting unstuck, and you may not be found.
I don't have YakTrax (the grip things for footware), but my wife does. She's a klutz though and has been known to fall while walking on the sidewalk in the summer. She likes them for Outdoor use, but as soon as you step inside a building they become worse than any ice you'd find outside. She got them while working in Nome, AK one winter because Nome doesn't do any kind of street/sidewalk maintenance... around Lander (and Jackson), she never uses them. They might come in handy if you're planning on hiking.
My water is normally in a standard 1-liter Nalgene bottle 99% of the time. The times it's not are when I'm skiing, then I use an old bladder that my dad gave me years ago. It emulates the old pigs/sheep stomach bladder used in centuries past, you wear it sling-style (over one shoulder, under the other arm) and it stays inside your gear to stay warm. I know they make insulated hydration packs now for skiiers, that would cover you just fine.
If you're going to be doning some hiking, you'll want well rated and good fitting (not loose and lazy) boots, the much talked about base layer, a wind and water proof outter layer (with whatever you need between those for comfort), wool socks, water-proof mitten shells with a couple wool liners and a good hat (again, wind proof ~ I don't think wind makes it Feel any colder, but it sure does rip the warmth out of you faster). Toss in a scarf if your jacket doesn't cover your face enough. You'll also want to take some sort of a pack where you can store the layers you take off as you get warm.
Best of luck, I hope you enjoy the experience. I love backcountry snowshoing and skiing.
Thank you, Brian, for that helpful post. So I gather that 99% of the time you are out when the tempt is not cold enough to freeze water. I wonder whether people there only go for outdoor activities for a prolonged period when temp is Not subzero F, as there are lots of such days in Jackson, and the sky areas are higher and thus warmer due to inversion.
See this for what happens if one is really in the cold:
Sugarbomb, I am from Dubois Pennsylvania, Moved to Jackson 3 years ago, love it here, Anything lower than 10 is cold. But there is no Humidity here, so in PA it's to cold to ski at 10, here you can still ski at -15 and be warm.
I remember back in 1978 on new years eve it was -62 f I was working at the cowboy bar at that time, I have been gone many years but Im back home now so I have to get used to this all over again, Does it get copld here ? you better believe it. I've seen it so cold that it breaks the bark off the trees. Dress in layers and be sure to cover your head and face. In avg, temps it varies, anywhere from -teens to 20 above durning the winter. Summers are great but short lived. Jackson is not even close to what it was and thats a shame, to over grown now, pay sucks, jobs to few, rich have took over and to many mexicans.
I remember back in 1978 on new years eve it was -62 f I was working at the cowboy bar at that time, I have been gone many years but Im back home now so I have to get used to this all over again, Does it get copld here ? you better believe it. I've seen it so cold that it breaks the bark off the trees. Dress in layers and be sure to cover your head and face. In avg, temps it varies, anywhere from -teens to 20 above durning the winter. Summers are great but short lived. Jackson is not even close to what it was and thats a shame, to over grown now, pay sucks, jobs to few, rich have took over and to many mexicans.
Was in Pindale(Boulder) at what was or use to be girl friends parants house went with them that new years eve to the Dance hall in Boulder. very long night as my GF mother didn't like me when I dropped in to visit on the way home from college. Thing was new years day my truck wouldn't runso spent another very cold night there.
Back home in Star Valley they could get to the feed ground with a new pickup truck and not use the team to feed. Truck boiled over because the radiator was frozen solid. Been warmer feeding cows at home that new years day....
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That and a nice scarf and you should be able to ward off the cold.
