APS valedictorian loses scholarships because he is an illegal immigrant (loan, school district)

[CCATL]

Originally Posted by bu2

Since you do educational research I can see why you can't differentiate between facts and your opinions. Most educational research would get laughed out of any other areas of research. Its hard to understand how the stuff you see from colleges of education gets passed by the rest of universities as serious research. And many universities with their PC don't like challenges to the dominant way of thinking. You exemplify that with your charges of bigotry and fear for anyone who doesn't buy your opinions which you confuse with facts. Those charges are an attempt to discredit and silence those who don't agree with your opinions. Its a common tactic of the left. Ah, and the Fox news comment as if everyone who disagrees with you only watches Fox News. I'd be surprised if more than 10% of the people who make those comments have ever seen Fox News. They aren't using critical thinking, just parroting the PC line of the progressives.

Wow, glad to see you take EXPERTS in education seriously. You know, those people who devote their lives to working with students - your kids - to make sure that they receive the best possible education. Why listen to people who dedicate themselves to research that benefits society as a whole when we can listen to people like you, who have absolutely 0 credentials or expertise in the area? We're all parrots, and peer reviewed research just parrots the prior research - there is no scientific method at all in educational research, no experimental studies, nothing that controls for confounding variables or creates inferential research *Sarcasm, in case you couldn't comprehend* . Proven qualitative methodologies also hold no ground, because you know, it's just people talking about their experiences, but they're all wrong. It's hard for you to understand how it is serious research because you don't understand the research - that's no fault of your own, I don't understand quantum physics. That doesn't mean it's bad research, it just means I'm not an expert in it. Good education research informs good policy. When you have policy makers who don't listen to what the research shows and care more about corporations making money than the students, you get what we have now. One of the WORST performing developed nations in the world in terms of educational attainment. So, let's keep doing in your way, it obviously works.

Your ignorance on the topic shows where you are coming from - let's harm students and destroy lives because it has no effect on your own. Peer reviewed research produces facts, opinions are held by the media. I gave you a number of sources that provide facts - peer reviewed SCIENTIFIC research - feel free to take a look, or continue to relish in your ignorance.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by CCATL

Wow, glad to see you take EXPERTS in education seriously. You know, those people who devote their lives to working with students - your kids - to make sure that they receive the best possible education. Why listen to people who dedicate themselves to research that benefits society as a whole when we can listen to people like you, who have absolutely 0 credentials or expertise in the area? We're all parrots, and peer reviewed research just parrots the prior research - there is no scientific method at all in educational research, no experimental studies, nothing that controls for confounding variables or creates inferential research *Sarcasm, in case you couldn't comprehend* . Proven qualitative methodologies also hold no ground, because you know, it's just people talking about their experiences, but they're all wrong. It's hard for you to understand how it is serious research because you don't understand the research - that's no fault of your own, I don't understand quantum physics. That doesn't mean it's bad research, it just means I'm not an expert in it. Good education research informs good policy. When you have policy makers who don't listen to what the research shows and care more about corporations making money than the students, you get what we have now. One of the WORST performing developed nations in the world in terms of educational attainment. So, let's keep doing in your way, it obviously works.

Your ignorance on the topic shows where you are coming from - let's harm students and destroy lives because it has no effect on your own. Peer reviewed research produces facts, opinions are held by the media. I gave you a number of sources that provide facts - peer reviewed SCIENTIFIC research - feel free to take a look, or continue to relish in your ignorance.

Good comments.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by bu2

Since you do educational research I can see why you can't differentiate between facts and your opinions. Most educational research would get laughed out of any other areas of research. Its hard to understand how the stuff you see from colleges of education gets passed by the rest of universities as serious research. And many universities with their PC don't like challenges to the dominant way of thinking. You exemplify that with your charges of bigotry and fear for anyone who doesn't buy your opinions which you confuse with facts. Those charges are an attempt to discredit and silence those who don't agree with your opinions. Its a common tactic of the left. Ah, and the Fox news comment as if everyone who disagrees with you only watches Fox News. I'd be surprised if more than 10% of the people who make those comments have ever seen Fox News. They aren't using critical thinking, just parroting the PC line of the progressives.

I definitely wouldn't discount the popularity of Fox News among conservatives. It has a huge audience -I believe larger than any of the other 24-hour news stations.

[JoeTarheel]

Originally Posted by suzy_q2010

No, the alternative is to remove the incentive to come here.

E-verify. Penalize employers who use illegal labor.

Create a guest worker system that allows people to work here but does not include access to social programs.

Require that at least one parent be a citizen in order for a child born here to be a citizen.

No more amnesties.

Great idea! Make the quality of life so poor in the U.S. that no one in his right mind would want to live here. That'll show 'em!

[suzy_q2010]

Originally Posted by CCATL

Read the whole thread, it has already been determined that your assumption is false. HOPE scholarship has no limit, therefore everybody with the academic qualifications receives it. And yes, it is intended for people of his "status" - people who worked hard in school, earned a scholarship, and are likely to be contributing members of society in the future. Isn't that what conservatives want? Less welfare, more people who can make their own living, regardless of the barriers placed in their way? Again, funny when people with no clue argue like they are experts.

As long as any legal resident has to borrow money to go to college, HOPE funds should not be spent on anyone who is here illegally.

Originally Posted by lvoc

Oh My...The Wonderland strategy. Click your heels twice and all the illegal aliens will go home.

If they cannot work and if their children will no longer have benefits of legal residency, what is the motivation to come?

[CCATL]

Originally Posted by suzy_q2010

As long as any legal resident has to borrow money to go to college, HOPE funds should not be spent on anyone who is here illegally.

But if those kids didn't receive the scholarship because they didn't earn it, then why shouldn't those who did earn it receive it? I'm confused by this logic. If a legal resident didn't receive it, they didn't get good enough grades - it's not because an undocumented student took it. Please elaborate?

[lvoc]

Originally Posted by suzy_q2010

If they cannot work and if their children will no longer have benefits of legal residency, what is the motivation to come?

Click your heels six times My-lady...Takes a bigger south witch to grant those Constitutional Amendment Requests.

What you are really doing is suggesting we should drive the low end of our socioeconomic system to the dark side...cash jobs and no taxes. You think Greece is a good idea.

[AnsleyPark]

Originally Posted by lvoc

Click your heels six times My-lady...Takes a bigger south witch to grant those Constitutional Amendment Requests.

What you are really doing is suggesting we should drive the low end of our socioeconomic system to the dark side...cash jobs and no taxes. You think Greece is a good idea.

The Greek economy and the American economy are driven by such different industries that it is not a comparison to make.

[lvoc]

Originally Posted by AnsleyPark

The Greek economy and the American economy are driven by such different industries that it is not a comparison to make.

Actually that was the point you apparently missed.

[suzy_q2010]

Originally Posted by CCATL

But if those kids didn't receive the scholarship because they didn't earn it, then why shouldn't those who did earn it receive it? I'm confused by this logic. If a legal resident didn't receive it, they didn't get good enough grades - it's not because an undocumented student took it. Please elaborate?

The HOPE scholarship does not cover all the expenses of attending college. There are students who will still need loans. If there is surplus HOPE money either increase the awards to cover more of the expense or expand the program to cover more students. Ther are awards for people attending technical schools, too, not just those going to college. Should we pay for illegal immigrants to learn trades and take those jobs from legal residents? If there is extra money, another alternative is to fund graduate degrees.

Originally Posted by lvoc

Click your heels six times My-lady...Takes a bigger south witch to grant those Constitutional Amendment Requests.

What you are really doing is suggesting we should drive the low end of our socioeconomic system to the dark side...cash jobs and no taxes. You think Greece is a good idea.

I did not say ending birthright citizenship would be easy, only that it needs to be done.

How is giving money to illegal immigrants rather than legal residents helping disadvantaged legal residents?

Should we give HOPE scholarships to residents of other states? Why should someone who is here illegally get a HOPE scholarship but not someone from Alabama with a 3.99 GPA who wants to go to GT or UGA?