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What's surprising is that a lot of people who live in the Atlanta area will think that they are so much more advanced towards stop lights but in the suburbs, I get a strong feeling that they change lights based off sensing a car's presence (which is a positive thing). I have been to certain Atlanta areas where I have waited many many minutes in the dead of night and I had to wonder if something was wrong with the light...nothing wrong just backwards design.
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Originally Posted by ATLTJL
I just had the same exact problem on Buford Highway in Brookhaven/Chamblee. I had to stop SO MANY TIMES and wait full cycles when there was absolutely nobody on those side streets.
As much fun as it is to sit there and watch people come and go from Follies, it's still annoying when there's nobody around!
Didn't really have the problem on Peachtree Industrial (I switched from Buford to PIB at I-285). The lights there didn't seem to turn red unless someone was actually waiting on a side street.
Interesting, I wonder who controls that, the county? I haven't noticed the same problem up in North Fulton.
One thing I have noticed, and you can pay attention to this to but what I have noticed is that, the traffic lights are generally on a timed schedule during commute hours and then (some of them) go into an open state where they generally just respond to incoming traffic whilest keeping the street with the highest priority green until another car approaches, while others still remain on timers..
..Here is exactly what I have noticed actually and watch out for this and let me know what you think...
Pay attention to the walk signals during a green light phase with no pedestrians in path and no left turn arrows activated in the direction of the crosswalk. During commute hours when the traffic lights are operating on a timed schedule, they generally already have a pre-determined green light length, even if there IS someone waiting at the intersection. If this is the case, the right-of-way will be activated for the walk sign as it knows how long its going to take before it changes red. If however the traffic light is in an open sensor mode, of which it may change at any given moment if another car approaches, the right of way for pedestrian traffic will NOT be permited EVEN IF the light is green. At first I thought this was only because pedestrians were not around but it looks like this was purposefully programmed as to prevent pedestrians from entering the intersection if a stale green light should change due to an approaching vehicle.
As for the traffic lights that are on a set timed schedule, what will happen is this usually .. If the walk sign starts flashing and eventually becomes solid, the minimum time for the green light phase has expired. If there is noone waiting to cross the intersection, the light will remain green and continue to permit traffic to pass and will likely skip the cross traffic phase, if not however; and there are people waiting to cross, the light will change red (and this sequence is generally programmed to act sequentially to every traffic light down a corridor usually within reasonable sync of the speed limit of that road.)
-- Another thing that will happen though, especially at night.. is I think sometimes DOT purposefully sets some lights to be RED, in order to slow traffic down or to keep them from speeding through empty corridors.. usually they will be the most meaningless lights, like to a closed shopping center or a gas station, ect.. That and also I think sometimes a light will remain red when noone is coming because that light may be in some sequence tied to another light where there IS traffic passing through and its predicting that traffic to pass through its intersection, thus staying green according to its programming as to not clog up the previous intersection by changing red.
At this point, I can only surmise that Atlanta traffic lights are purposefully timed to stop as much movement as possible. I can't count the number of intersections in this city which are essentially two-light intersections (two lights within 200' of each other) and they are timed opposite of each other so you get the green at the first one, then get stopped at the second one. Northside at North Ave. is the worst. Whoever designed the timing of that signal must have been high.
I also can't count the number of locations in which an almost entirely unused two-lane local road gets a ridiculously long phase, while the 4-6 lane arterial it intersects with gets about the same, or even shorter.
I drive Mountain Industrial/North Hairston to work and the lights are timed horribly. I often wonder if the traffic engineers even pay attention to the traffic data when they collect it. Between Lawrenceville Highway and 78, the timing of the lights are off for the morning and evening rush. It causes traffic to jam for no reason southbound because they cut off too quickly. Lawrenceville and Hugh Howell has some problem with the timing on the weekend as well. The light will stay on for 10 secs, if that at times.
The biggest annoyance to me is when you have to cross over a highway intersection. Who decided that the light should change for you then immediately change as soon as you cross the intersection to let traffic off the highway? It's so annoying every morning to get stuck at the first or second light and it causes problems during rush hour because the main road can't clear the intersection so it causes traffic to jam up in either direction.
I wish, our lights were set up like NYC or Baltimore..constant green/red or built in ground sensors that can account for traffic.
Too advance thinking for GA. These are the same people that question if heavy rail is important
I've been doing a lot of driving downtown during late night hours lately. And these lights are still on TIMERS! You can be sitting at red lights for minutes where there is ABSOLUTELY NOT A SOUL on the road the light is green for!!!!
In most cities, late at night, traffic lights stay green on major thoroughfares, only turning red when a car on a cross-street approaches. When it does, the light turns red right away to let that car go.
Not here. It's like living in the stone ages.
I call those "Virginia lights" because it seemed like all the lights in the Norfolk/VA Beach were like that, having to stop at every single light and wait forever for nothing.
What I noticed is I don't think there are any horizontally mounted lights in Georgia. It seem to be the standard to be vertical with red on top, green on the bottom. Many lights in Florida are horizontal, so that's one thing that makes it little Japan, lol. Speaking of which, the Tokyo area as advanced as it is, does not have lights properly synced. I remember one light in particular that is only one car length after a railroad crossing, so that would back up traffic. You can see their technology priority is with rail as trains came first and everything was built around them.
I call those "Virginia lights" because it seemed like all the lights in the Norfolk/VA Beach were like that, having to stop at every single light and wait forever for nothing.
What I noticed is I don't think there are any horizontally mounted lights in Georgia. It seem to be the standard to be vertical with red on top, green on the bottom. Many lights in Florida are horizontal, so that's one thing that makes it little Japan, lol. Speaking of which, the Tokyo area as advanced as it is, does not have lights properly synced. I remember one light in particular that is only one car length after a railroad crossing, so that would back up traffic. You can see their technology priority is with rail as trains came first and everything was built around them.
There are a few but they're VERY far in between. The intersection of Salem Rd and Old Salem Rd has a set, there's a few near Downtown Decatur too. Usually the only time they're used in GA is if the intersection is literally RIGHT after a large overpass. Sydney Marcus and GA-400's NB onramp also has one.
Alot but not all of Florida's traffic lights are Horizontal and Florida uses a mix of cable suspended and mast mounted traffic lights... Almost ALL of Texas's traffic lights are Horizontal with a few being vertical (especially in FortWorth) - From my understanding, the reason they are mounted Horizontally in America is to make them more tollerant to high winds like both Florida and Texas receive during Hurricanes.
I've been doing a lot of driving downtown during late night hours lately. And these lights are still on TIMERS! You can be sitting at red lights for minutes where there is ABSOLUTELY NOT A SOUL on the road the light is green for!!!!
In most cities, late at night, traffic lights stay green on major thoroughfares, only turning red when a car on a cross-street approaches. When it does, the light turns red right away to let that car go.
Not here. It's like living in the stone ages.
Atlanta's intersections have sensors in the pavement which detect "a large metal object through induction" not by weight, at 60-70% of intersections. You can see the rubber lines crudely cut into rectangles in the pavement.
Granted, California has electronic eyes mounted on their mast-arm poles which are very good at quickly switching to whomever needs to go.
You think Atlanta is bad, Raleigh's signals only use timers with long phases of several minutes which is great in heavy, weekday traffic but awful at 2am when you're the only car at an intersection.
Atlanta's wire-hung signals do look awful, but it's the long-standing practice of the East Coast and Midwest since original electrification of cities and towns.
Atlanta is replacing many with metal poles, like up Northside Dr. and Memorial Drive, etc.
I hate that they're all different styles also, but anything's better than wires.
West Coast states probably had to use metal poles because trees aren't plentiful enough for wood utility poles (to hang wires from historically) and the wind is much fiercer out there.
And of all of the Western states that use the mast-arm metal poles, no one comes close to California's perfection in creating elegant poles lunging over every size of road.
Florida, Virginia and most of East Coast states are replacing with metal poles except for North Carolina which deems them a low priority.
I have tried to get Atlanta and Modera Morningside to replace the hideous, sagging wire signals at their entrance to no avail.
You spend close to $100 million on beautiful new complex and hang these uneven, sagging wires right at the entrance. People here tolerate the crappiest streets/ infrastructure of any U.S. city.
At this point, I can only surmise that Atlanta traffic lights are purposefully timed to stop as much movement as possible. I can't count the number of intersections in this city which are essentially two-light intersections (two lights within 200' of each other) and they are timed opposite of each other so you get the green at the first one, then get stopped at the second one. Northside at North Ave. is the worst. Whoever designed the timing of that signal must have been high.
I also can't count the number of locations in which an almost entirely unused two-lane local road gets a ridiculously long phase, while the 4-6 lane arterial it intersects with gets about the same, or even shorter.
CITY OF ATLANTA TRAFFIC ENGINEERS WILL COME AND ADJUST ANY SIGNAL/INTERSECTION THAT YOU ASK THEM TO!
They do not want these timing mistakes, it's just that in Atlanta there is no oversight of anything. Public Works admits that no one assesses the conditions of the roads.
I got Peachtree St. at Baker St. and Ralph McGill downtown retimed after noticing they were never green at the same time.
I submitted request and an engineer called me and then went out and changed the timing.
I improved the lives of thousands of people (and gave them 5 minutes of their lives back every day) by taking the initiative and it feels good!
SO EVERYONE PLEASE REPORT BAD TIMINGS to APPROPRIATE MUNICIPALITY!!!!!
That can be your community service holiday gift!
Last edited by architect77; 11-19-2017 at 02:45 AM..
At this point, I can only surmise that Atlanta traffic lights are purposefully timed to stop as much movement as possible. I can't count the number of intersections in this city which are essentially two-light intersections (two lights within 200' of each other) and they are timed opposite of each other so you get the green at the first one, then get stopped at the second one. Northside at North Ave. is the worst. Whoever designed the timing of that signal must have been high.
I also can't count the number of locations in which an almost entirely unused two-lane local road gets a ridiculously long phase, while the 4-6 lane arterial it intersects with gets about the same, or even shorter.
REPORT THE WORST OFFENDERS!
If 2 lights are never green with enough overlap to allow a car to get through both...
that is a HUGE problem affecting thousands of people's lives, Atlanta's productivity, etc.
Be the hero and remove this kink from our circulatory system!!!
CITY OF ATLANTA TRAFFIC ENGINEERS WILL COME AND ADJUST ANY SIGNAL/INTERSECTION THAT YOU ASK THEM TO!
They do not want these timing mistakes, it's just that in Atlanta there is no oversight of anything. Public Works admits that no one assesses the conditions of the roads.
I got Peachtree St. at Baker St. and Ralph McGill downtown retimed after noticing they were never green at the same time.
I submitted request and an engineer called me and then went out and changed the timing.
I improved the lives of thousands of people (and gave them 5 minutes of their lives back every day) by taking the initiative and it feels good!
SO EVERYONE PLEASE REPORT BAD TIMINGS to APPROPRIATE MUNICIPALITY!!!!!
That can be your community service holiday gift!
I need to look up that contact info from a past thread at some point when I have a minute of my life back from work!
Atlanta's intersections have sensors in the pavement which detect "a large metal object through induction" not by weight, at 60-70% of intersections. You can see the rubber lines crudely cut into rectangles in the pavement.
Granted, California has electronic eyes mounted on their mast-arm poles which are very good at quickly switching to whomever needs to go.
Atlanta, DeKalb, and Fulton use majority induction loop, which can easily become damaged. The signal will then default to timed setting. Cobb County is using SPLOST money to replace wire hung signals with mast arms and induction loops with camera controlled signals.
Atlanta is using ReNew Bond to upgrade it's signal timing, which is some places date to the 50's.
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