Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Aviation
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 11-02-2015, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma USA
1,194 posts, read 1,099,627 times
Reputation: 4419

Advertisements

Jerusalem Post going with "external force"

The Jerusalem Post
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 11-02-2015, 03:26 PM
 
13,811 posts, read 27,440,930 times
Reputation: 14250
It's actually fairly easy to hit the tail on a 321. >7.5* of pitch in the flare will do it. Which sounds high but is easy to do if you are landing on a higher elevation airport, it's hot out, and the aircraft is heavy. The same technique to land at a lower elevation will generally cause you to need to flare right at that 7.5* mark in order to avoid completely planting it on the runway. Most operators suggest landing at Flaps 3 vs. full as to my knowledge, at least with my company (largest operator of narrowbody Airbus in the world) there has never been a tail strike with a flaps 3 landing.

A bomb would've most likely been in the cargo hold. MAYBE the pax compartment. But having the tail section separate like it did? My uneducated but logical guess is the tail section detached in flight. Glad they have the boxes already, we'll know soon.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 03:30 PM
 
4,685 posts, read 6,135,229 times
Reputation: 3988
Starting to wonder if someone did successfully get a underwear/shoe/any other type of bomb on board and set it off.

Planes dont just fall apart and even if the tail fell off, the rest of the plane more than likely would have fell in 1 piece.

You never know if ground crew or anyone else could have smuggled something onto the plane or under it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 05:01 PM
 
Location: Free From The Oppressive State
30,254 posts, read 23,725,162 times
Reputation: 38629
No matter what happened, I feel bad for those people. Just trying to have a little holiday...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 05:19 PM
 
13,811 posts, read 27,440,930 times
Reputation: 14250
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAAN View Post
Starting to wonder if someone did successfully get a underwear/shoe/any other type of bomb on board and set it off.

Planes dont just fall apart and even if the tail fell off, the rest of the plane more than likely would have fell in 1 piece.

You never know if ground crew or anyone else could have smuggled something onto the plane or under it.
Seven years later a botched tail strike repair brought down a JAL flight seven years after the event.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Airlines_Flight_123

Another one, China Airlines, botched tail strike repair done 22 years prior.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Airlines_Flight_611

It happens.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Elysium
12,384 posts, read 8,141,466 times
Reputation: 9194
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup View Post
Seven years later a botched tail strike repair brought down a JAL flight seven years after the event.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Airlines_Flight_123

Another one, China Airlines, botched tail strike repair done 22 years prior.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Airlines_Flight_611

It happens.
That begs the question how many planes are in service which have had a tail strike? Is there an outside agency which can pull an aircraft from service permanently?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 07:52 PM
 
19,015 posts, read 27,574,271 times
Reputation: 20265
Ok, so recorders cannot be opened until ALL of the parties involved are present. Irish rep arrived today. Plane was registered in Ireland.
NO SIGNS of any explosives so far were found outside or inside the plane debris. No signs of fire too.
Company plane owner claims there was "catastrophic dehermetization" of the plane, resulting in 300 km/h speed reduction in matter of 1 minute and fall. Same rendered crew inoperable.
That is Kalgymair version. They keep pressing towards foul play.
Now experts start talking about accident plane had in 2001(?) when tail hit runway at take off. They even showed 3D computer graphic of hypothetical tail section separating from fuselage during assent. Word is, such accident would have required full blown repair.
As I said before, allegedly that repair was done.

Once again, until registrators are not opened, it's everyone's guess.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 08:17 PM
 
569 posts, read 551,937 times
Reputation: 286
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyAMG View Post
Wow, tail fell off in flight... that is tragic. Now people know why tail strikes are so serious and require immediate return.

Echos of JAL 123 and China Air Lines 611.

The Russians are not to blame they did not do the maintenance after the tail strike.

The tail strike was in 2001 in Cairo. By all accounts a very serious hard landing with excessive nose up. It dropped like a rock from 50 feet up 700/ft min. most normal landings are about 100-300 ft/ min at touch down. When the tail strike occurred the jet flew for MEA which is based in Beirut Lebanon. No one knows who did the repairs but rumor is Airbus itself did the repairs as the damage was deemed too bad to be carried out by local repair facilities.

I had had no idea that another passengeraircraft crashed in the last Sunday. Did anybody have any idea why they’d fallen from the skies more frequent these modern days? I didn’t think the WWII military crafts falling in the rates liken these past two years.

So anyway, I had no idea what happened. And I did not read thatnews. Therefore, if it wasn’t a terrorist attack, I did have a bit of aviation accident history inputting for this discussion. That you might say an air plane dissolving like the papers shreds in the middle of the skies would be a joke. But that specific joke did happen on a turbulence passenger carrier in an Asian country. There was a door in that plane somehow blew open in the skies, then the whole aircraft literary dissolved. And that plane was used in the somewhat international flight – Taiwan to Mainland.

Therefore, I was just letting you knew – sheet happens.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 10:11 PM
 
4,345 posts, read 2,163,137 times
Reputation: 3398
This was a severely damaged bird and my guess is the repair slowly developed cracks and finally separated..........95% the tail strike is the cause..........the A300 series were known to be a little delicate in the tail section anyway........AA lost one out of NYC years ago when the co-pilot punched the rudder too hard and the tail snapped off.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 11-02-2015, 11:06 PM
 
9,408 posts, read 11,927,798 times
Reputation: 12440
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
That begs the question how many planes are in service which have had a tail strike? Is there an outside agency which can pull an aircraft from service permanently?
Lots and lots out there. Tail strikes aren't all that uncommon.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Aviation
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top