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Old 03-11-2019, 07:38 AM
 
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Ive been reading on this, but have seen a few different definitions and theories.


The best I can tell, it is some kind of barrier in the sky or in space..?
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Old 03-11-2019, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Free State of Texas
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Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Ive been reading on this, but have seen a few different definitions and theories.


The best I can tell, it is some kind of barrier in the sky or in space..?
from the Latin firmamentum, meaning “sky” or “expanse”

https://www.gotquestions.org/firmament-Bible.html
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Old 03-11-2019, 09:23 AM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Ive been reading on this, but have seen a few different definitions and theories.


The best I can tell, it is some kind of barrier in the sky or in space..?
The word 'firmament' is used in the King James translation for the Hebrew word 'raqia' in Genesis 1:6-8. More modern English translations use the word 'expanse,' 'vault,' or 'canopy.' At issue is what the word 'raqia' meant to the Biblical writers.

In ancient Near East (ANE) cosmology the sky was thought to be a solid dome which covered the earth which is what it looks like. This solid dome structure separated the waters which were above it from the waters which were below it. The raqia - firmament had windows or flood gates which could open to allow it to rain. In Genesis 7:11 the flood gates were opened to allow the waters above the firmament to contribute to 'Noah's flood' (there was no global flood).

1.) In Job 37:18, the skies (using the word shachaq rather than raqia) is said to be cast-metal.
Job 37:18 Can you, like him, spread out the skies, hard as a cast metal mirror?
2.) In the 2nd temple period work 3 BARUCH the desire is to know whether the sky is made of clay, brass, or iron.
3 BARUCH 3.1-8

And I asked 5 the angel: I pray thee, Lord, say to me who are these. And he said, These are they who gave counsel to build the tower, for they whom thou seest drove forth multitudes of both men and women, to make bricks; among whom, a woman making bricks was not allowed to be released in the hour of child-birth, but brought forth while she was making bricks, and carried her child in her apron, and 6 continued to make bricks. And the Lord appeared to them and confused their speech, when they 7 had built the tower to the height of four hundred and sixty-three cubits. And they took a gimlet, and sought to pierce the heaven, saying, Let us see (whether) the heaven is made of clay, or of 8 brass, or of iron. When God saw this He did not permit them, but smote them with blindness and confusion of speech, and rendered them as thou seest. [Bolding mine]

3 Baruch: Greek Apocalypse
3.) In Josephus' Antiquities of the Jews, book 1, chapter 1, 'From the Creation to the Death of Isaac', Josephus writes that the heaven is separated from the world by a crystalline firmament.
After this, on the second day, he placed the heaven over the whole world, and separated it from the other parts; and he determined it should stand by itself. He also placed a crystalline [firmament] round it, and put together in a manner agreeable to the earth, and fitted it for giving moisture and rain, and for affording the advantage of dews. [Bolding mine]

Here is an article from Biologos, written by scholar Peter Enns, concerning the Firmament of Genesis 1.
''Genesis 1 and 2 tell the story of creation, and it says things that are at odds with what modern people know to be true of the world and universe around us.

One of those issue concerns the second day of creation (Genesis 1:6-8), where God made the “expanse” or the “firmament.” The Hebrew word for this is raqia (pronounced ra-KEE-ah). Biblical scholars understand the raqia to be a solid dome-like structure.''

Read more: https://biologos.org/articles/the-fi...-not-the-point

The following is a paper by Paul Seely on the Meaning of raqiac in Gen 1:6-8
THE FIRMAMENT AND THE WATER ABOVE
Part I: The Meaning of raqiac
in Gen 1:6-8
PAUL H. SEELY
''STANDARD Hebrew lexica and a number of modern biblical scholars have defined the raqiac (fyqr, "firmament") of Gen 1:6-8 as a solid dome over the earth.''

''The historical evidence, however, which we will set forth in concrete detail, shows that the raqiac was originally conceived of as being solid and not a merely atmospheric expanse''.

Read more: https://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/ted...mament-wtj.pdf
The peoples of the ancient Near East had a different cosmology than we do, and the Bible must be understood within the framework of their cosmology rather than ours. While the Bible is the word of God, God interacted with the Biblical writers according to their worldview. He met them where they were at in terms of their understanding of the world. He didn't find it necessary to correct their understanding of the cosmos in order to communicate to them who He is, and what He expected of them. And so, the Bible presents a flat earth resting on pillars, and covered by a solid dome.

Click on link below for a visual depiction of the world according to the cosmology of the ANE. Due to copyright issues I didn't embed the picture itself, so you'll have to click on it.

https://wp.biologos.org/wp-content/u...-enns-post.jpg

https://biologos.org/articles/the-fi...-not-the-point


Here's a visual depiction from Wikipedia. No copyright issues.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firmament

Last edited by Michael Way; 03-11-2019 at 09:43 AM..
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Old 03-11-2019, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Arizona
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A picture is worth a thousand words.
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Old 03-11-2019, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Arizona
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It could mean the air or clouds that surrounded the earth (planet).
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Old 03-11-2019, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Ive been reading on this, but have seen a few different definitions and theories.


The best I can tell, it is some kind of barrier in the sky or in space..?
It is a word used in the cosmology or understanding of the structure and nature of the universe at the time it was written. Don’t try to have it make sense in what we now know about that. The Bible is not science.
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Old 03-11-2019, 02:43 PM
 
18,976 posts, read 7,030,705 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555 View Post
The peoples of the ancient Near East had a different cosmology than we do, and the Bible must be understood within the framework of their cosmology rather than ours. While the Bible is the word of God, God interacted with the Biblical writers according to their worldview. He met them where they were at in terms of their understanding of the world. He didn't find it necessary to correct their understanding of the cosmos in order to communicate to them who He is, and what He expected of them. And so, the Bible presents a flat earth resting on pillars, and covered by a solid dome.
What verse is that?
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Old 03-11-2019, 03:43 PM
 
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If the people back then were able to pierce the firmament at 463 cubits, thats around 700ft, could the sky/space have been different in those times?
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Old 03-11-2019, 04:37 PM
 
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It's a very stale Altoid described by someone who stutters.
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Old 03-11-2019, 04:54 PM
 
Location: Middle America
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If God felt we really needed to understand that word clearly, he would have included an exhaustive description. That it's just put out there with nothing further, it's either a fancy name for something simple (maybe even poetic), or something beyond our understanding.

There are a lot of things that God leaves undefined and unclarified. I have no issue with that.
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