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Manhattan is 22.96 miles in land area. D.C. is no Manhattan, however, my point was if you are walking north to south or east to west, D.C. is the only city that offers large buildings in more of a square or diamond shape over an extremely large area while the others have tiny footprints that run linear. Center City is the closest thing to a square compared to D.C. of all the contenders, but it's still very small in land area compared to D.C. I was just making the point that when the greater downtown D.C. area gets to a 1:1 residential to office split, it will be pretty far up there in the ranks.
Right, so you want set up as best a criteria as possible that's basically "which city is laid out the most like DC" and Whammmo! We've got a winner!
Right, so you want set up as best a criteria as possible that's basically "which city is laid out the most like DC" and Whammmo! We've got a winner!
Maybe you missed this........
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar
LOL.......
First of all....you may want to look at which market they are talking about. The submarkets are not DC proper. Those units I posted are all in the city center and are still renting out at record rates. D.C. has had some 400+ unit buildings rent out in less than a year. If you know anything about leasing, that is astonishing. You aren't in the construction industry so you don't know what you are talking about. Why do you think developers continue to break ground on new buildings even with so many units coming online? D.C. offers exceptionally high rents which is still profitable for developers thus, they continue to build here. Developers aren't going hungry because they have to drop their studio apartment prices from $2,500 down to $2,450! LOL....amateur....
As for our office market, if we didn't build another office building till year 2150, we would still be fine. Companies along with the federal government are shrinking their office needs. That is the best thing that could possible happen in D.C. proper period. We have so much office space and it's beginning to be converted into residential space right now. That is so long overdue. As you have pointed out, we have way too much office space (142 Million sq. feet) in a city that is 61 square feet with height limits to boot. We have the largest area of large buildings forming our unofficial downtown in the nation. Buildings go for miles here in D.C. north to south and east to west which doesn't exist anywhere. NYC, Chicago, San Fran etc. etc. etc. run linear. We are the only city that is built out for miles in all directions. D.C. has enormous potential for mixed use in it's downtown core and when it reaches office to residential equilibrium downtown, it will push D.C. into a league ahead of San Fran which is still for the most part dominated by a tiny downtown in area squared with most of it being those single family homes.
Take a minute and imagine what D.C.'s downtown is going to be like with a 1:1 residential to office mix. Yeah, be careful what you wish for sir. You can't compete with that. D.C.'s downtown is 4 times the size of San Fran. The Official boundaries you see posted when they measure downtown only includes 1/3 of those large buildings you see in pictures. The downtown area's of Capital Riverfront, SW Waterfront, Golden Triangle, NOMA, and Foggy Bottom are not included even though they too are all high-rises. This game is about to be over my friend.
And, developers worldwide are still breaking ground here going into 2014 because there is money to be made. The alarm is going on deaf ears because it's over hyped. I guess my industry knows something you don't....
Then he posted.......
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summersm343
Since Manhattan is 33 sq miles and has 353 million square feet of office space, I'd hardly call D.C. the largest.
I would also consider Chicago, San Francisco, Philadelphia and Boston as bigger Downtown's than D.C.
So I posted......
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar
Manhattan is 22.96 miles in land area. D.C. is no Manhattan, however, my point was if you are walking north to south or east to west, D.C. is the only city that offers large buildings in more of a square or diamond shape over an extremely large area while the others have tiny footprints that run linear. If you walk the wrong direction in most cities, you leave that development very quickly. Many times, you would walk into a river or the ocean. Center City is the closest thing to a square/rectangle compared to D.C. of all the contenders, but it's still very small in land area compared to D.C. I was just making the point that when the greater downtown D.C. area gets to a 1:1 residential to office split, it will be pretty far up there in the ranks.
What I said is true though. There is no other north-south route or east-west route in any other city that runs longer with large buildings than D.C. I was just pointing out that when these buildings acheive a 50/50 residential to office split, the greater downtown D.C. area will be ranked pretty far up there.
The Baruch Houses aren't the worse, but they aren't great. You ever hang out there?
Meh, you can't even tell projects from private rentals, so I'm going to go ahead and disregard what you think you know about NYC.
Lol. Not that I care to prove to you but my girlfriend goes to school right outside of Manhattan so I'm there at least once a month. And yes... I've walked through the area before. None of the projects are run down.
Manhattan is 22.96 miles in land area. D.C. is no Manhattan, however, my point was if you are walking north to south or east to west, D.C. is the only city that offers large buildings in more of a square or diamond shape over an extremely large area while the others have tiny footprints that run linear. If you walk the wrong direction in most cities, you leave that development very quickly. Many times, you would walk into a river or the ocean. Center City is the closest thing to a square/rectangle compared to D.C. of all the contenders, but it's still very small in land area compared to D.C. I was just making the point that when the greater downtown D.C. area gets to a 1:1 residential to office split, it will be pretty far up there in the ranks.
New York's "Downtown" area, I would argue, is everything south of 110th Street in Manhattan. Highrises galore basically the entire way. Sure, there are areas like Chelsea and the West Village that aren't packed with highrises, but that doesn't make them any less apart of the "Downtown" area. IDK who created this rule that residential can't be a part of Downtown. If that's the case then Philly doesn't have a downtown aside from one Street in Market West. Practically every other part of Center City is a mix of office, residential and hotel.
What I said is true though. There is no other north-south route or east-west route in any other city that runs longer with large buildings than D.C. I was just pointing out that when these buildings acheive a 50/50 residential to office split, the greater downtown D.C. area will be ranked pretty far up there.
You have the weirdest definitions I've ever seen. What is your definition of Downtown D.C. then?
You have the weirdest definitions I've ever seen. What is your definition of Downtown D.C. then?
Have you ever tried to walk east to west in Manhattan? How far did you get before you hit water? That was my only point. I was saying no other city has the land mass in every direction. It means there is more room to improve a much larger area into a mixed use downtown than any other place. Doesn't mean D.C. will be better than Manhattan by any stretch of the imagination. I'm just saying the developable land potential is higher in greater downtown D.C. You don't have to raze neighborhoods to do it either. Just build up.
Keep in mind, I am, and have always been, talking about full build out of greater downtown D.C. which is happening now. Having pockets of a few row houses or brownstones here or there is fine, however, 95% of it should be buildings. Midtown Manhattan up through Central Park to Harlem is probably the best comparison to greater downtown D.C. from a land perspective. Downtown Manhattan is too small. D.C. has a few tiny pockets of row house’s just like Manhattan and Center City. I was never saying you can't have any of those. I was just saying they should be minimal. Center City has more of them than any of the other's but I don't think that makes it any less urban. It's a nice mix.
Lol. Not that I care to prove to you but my girlfriend goes to school right outside of Manhattan so I'm there at least once a month. And yes... I've walked through the area before. None of the projects are run down.
Yeah, I still can't believe how embarrassing that stat is.
DC Metro office space per employee: 141 sq ft SF Bay office space per employee: 66 sq ft
How so?
It's a very interesting and quite telling stat that I never gave much thought to before.
As MDAllstar pointed out:
D.C. Metro Area: 426,392,853 square feet of office space
San Francisco & San Jose Combined MSAs: 203,602,718 square feet of office space
So if we take these 2 figures from Collier's and divide them by the number of employed persons there are according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the results are as follows:
Sq ft of office Space Per Employee
Washington DC 141 sq ft
San Francisco & San Jose MSAs Combined: 66 sq ft
The average employee in DC needs more than twice the office space to do their job as an employee in SF/SJ? That's really strange.
Just looking at Boston, its around 76 sq ft of office space per employed person.
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