RTA: What's good, bad, and improvable (Columbus, Cleveland: subsidized, groceries, delivery)

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by TheProf

RTA seems to be making minimal cuts compared to other transit systems (in Philadelphia, more than have the regional rail system has been shut down completely). I see zero reason why the Green Line and Waterfront Line are running now. We only need a skeleton rail service -- just the Blue Line to TC and the Red Line at light intervals since both do serve areas with people without cars.

I'm uncomfortable with furloughs for a public service agency. While RTA employee salary/benefit packages likely are hefty, the expense of running buses and trains at the relatively high frequency RTA is now, would seem to be more. You then get into the sticky situation as who to furlough? It's easier when you're a private entity like Punch Bowl Social who furloughed all 120 workers because the restaurant is closed (and I sure hope they can reopen which has been thrown into question since Cracker Barrel has now backed out).

But RTA, like other agencies, are still running services. So who do you cut? ... not so easy.

Sales tax collections will be minimal. RTA faces a massive budget hole. Failure immediately to slash expenses, including labor costs, threatens the agency's ability to resume service when the stay-at-home order is lifted. Inaction is a fiasco, and certainly politically motivated, not economically motivated.

Paying persons to do nothing, providing services when there is no demand, creating a multi-year budget morass, will not merit any tax levy bailout if RTA ridiculously expects a financially stressed public to come to the rescue in the aftermath of this economic disaster. Similarly, nobody except possibly the federal government, will provide any financial relief.

Ask yourself if Rob Portman will vote to bail out RTA and whether a President Trump would sign a mass transit bailout bill, especially if the quid pro quo is raising his taxes.

If RTA engaged in lay-offs, not furloughs, it perhaps could continue health insurance until the economy begins a come back and employees could collect the enhanced federal unemployment benefits, saving the RTA substantial resources to reemploy employees when needed.

[bjimmy24]

Being downtown, whenever I leave home I see many buses, almost all completely empty or 1-4 people. I kinda think they should cut back service even more. I would hope they will save enough money to still be serviceable once things get back to normal.

[teacherdad]

Here where I am, they only allow a person to sit about every 4 rows to space them out. Busses will say, "full" and have about 6 people.

[bjimmy24]

I hesitate to say anything about the current situation is "good", but one thing that is "not bad" is the noticeably clearer air and less traffic. I don't think Cleveland was too bad on this in the first place compared to other cities but still. Especially air quality for me though is important as someone who has occasional bouts with asthma. Right now we are seeing some pleasantness in these regards. However, if we kill public transit after this is over, or if rta dies before then (for practical purposes, rta before the crisis operated on the minimum you can do and be a legitimate transit option, but further reduction any inch past where we are now just makes rta all the more unusable), we are going to see even more cars on the road leading to even more respiratory issues which is the main problem caused by this virus in the first place!


I hope there are some people out there thinking critically in the statehouse and fed gov right now. Its not all that obvious to me there is any kind of plan going forward.

[TheProf]

^RTA is not going to die. And even the talk of decommissioning and tearing up the Waterfront Line, which some here/in Cleveland seem to strive for, for some odd reason, ain't happening. The amount of red tape and $millions of give-back funds RTA would have to pay for all the WFL improvements, alone, would be staggering... again, ain't happening.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by TheProf

^RTA is not going to die. And even the talk of decommissioning and tearing up the Waterfront Line, which some here/in Cleveland seem to strive for, for some odd reason, ain't happening. The amount of red tape and $millions of give-back funds RTA would have to pay for all the WFL improvements, alone, would be staggering... again, ain't happening.

If service is cut anymore than its pre covid levels (after this is over), I dont think we have an actually usable transit system anymore. With the massive losses suffered now, I see it being cut severely even after this. Hope I'm wrong, but as someone who doesnt have a car, it's a concern. So I dont mean I think the rta will cease to exist or any rail will be dig up, but the utility of the system could decline to such a state that nobody would voluntarily depend on it.
In my personal opinion, this would be a good time to INCREASE service post covid. Keeping air pollution and traffic down is quite important, as is trying to avoid too much crowding on the buses and trains (which admittedly isnt a huge problem but still). This is pretty much a fantasy scenario though.

[TheProf]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

If service is cut anymore than its pre covid levels (after this is over), I dont think we have an actually usable transit system anymore. With the massive losses suffered now, I see it being cut severely even after this. Hope I'm wrong, but as someone who doesnt have a car, it's a concern. So I dont mean I think the rta will cease to exist or any rail will be dig up, but the utility of the system could decline to such a state that nobody would voluntarily depend on it.
In my personal opinion, this would be a good time to INCREASE service post covid. Keeping air pollution and traffic down is quite important, as is trying to avoid too much crowding on the buses and trains (which admittedly isnt a huge problem but still). This is pretty much a fantasy scenario though.

None of us know what the world will be like after the virus restrictions are lifted. Private industry is far more vulnerable than a govt owned and funded agency like RTA -- ie, I'm very fearful whether Punch Bowl Social, a major FEB anchor, will reopen after laying of its 120 employees and Cracker Barrel pulling out its investment in the chain... RTA will be around. It's up to management as to what form we'll see it in once restrictions are lifted, but I think it would be horribly irresponsible to start making cuts on the fly without observing ridership and trends over a significant period post-virus. The RTA Board would have to implement any severe service cuts and, you can rest assured, the public will be watching.

Perhaps RTA realizes it had become, more or less, a bare bones operation prior to COVID-19, and doesn't want the public to fear their particular service is going away -- most would agree the freeway park'n rides and the downtown trolleys could be mothballed; both tend to be popular with riders. Other services? Perhaps not so much. If you'll note over on the Philadelphia board, SEPTA has cut their services to the absolute minimum: only 50-60 bus lines running, and less than half the Regional Rails -- most RRs have been shuddered. Of course SEPTA is a much larger network in a much larger city with serious traffic issues and, hence, a much more loyal and dependent ridership than RTA.

I certainly believe in RTA's servicing the poor and transit dependent and want to keep those lines going.

[ferraris]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

If service is cut anymore than its pre covid levels (after this is over), I dont think we have an actually usable transit system anymore. With the massive losses suffered now, I see it being cut severely even after this. Hope I'm wrong, but as someone who doesnt have a car, it's a concern. So I dont mean I think the rta will cease to exist or any rail will be dig up, but the utility of the system could decline to such a state that nobody would voluntarily depend on it.
In my personal opinion, this would be a good time to INCREASE service post covid. Keeping air pollution and traffic down is quite important, as is trying to avoid too much crowding on the buses and trains (which admittedly isnt a huge problem but still). This is pretty much a fantasy scenario though.

"after this is over" is not a very precise term right now. We could have Amtrak commuting Joe Biden in office by then.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by ferraris

"after this is over" is not a very precise term right now. We could have Amtrak commuting Joe Biden in office by then.

I suppose I am the only one concerned about this. kinda surprised this isnt being taken more seriously.

[TheProf]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I suppose I am the only one concerned about this. kinda surprised this isnt being taken more seriously.

It's not that I'm not concerned about RTA. But mine were pre-COVID-19 worries; the system is in a seriously messed up financial state and losing riders despite much growth in the city... I just don't share your belief that the virus crisis will possibly "kill" the system. It will be back to the same as pre-virus... which wasn't good... I wish RTA could or could have used this time to spend the grants that they got to work on some Rapid rebuilding projects... Now is the time to do some of those ubiquitous Rapid-to-bus shutdowns with hardly anyone riding... But no, they'll probably wait until riders return and get comfortable with riding again... and then do the repair work and have system shutdowns... such is RTA.