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Wait, she has yet to apply and you assume that she will be rejected? Also, she is a "local resident"? What does that mean?
Considering that there have been other posters with a similar "style" of username who post similar conundrums in this forum (and have since the days of Weekend Traveler...), I wonder what your true intentions are here.
When I graduated from high school, AP, IB, ECs, etc. were done at a minimum and students applied to perhaps 5 schools tops, if even that many (1 safety, 1 reach (or dream school), 1-3 most-likelies). Over the last decade this has all changed. Now, kids are taking as many APs as possible, doing an insane amount of ECs, paying tons of money to prep for the SAT/ACT, and so on to game admissions. Bottom line is that your local resident is no longer special. In fact, this type of applicant is now the norm at schools like UCB. The irony is that this only applies to high school students. She could also go to a CCC for two years, maintain a 3.0 or lower (yup, wrote that correctly. Admission standards for California Community College students into UCs are way lower than for freshmen applicants. Don't believe me, call up admissions...), and transfer in with no problem.
Also, the Asian population in the UCs is near 40% while the State population of Asians in California is what, 16%? There has been a not-so-public push to reduce the numbers of Asians in the UC system.
Anyways, she would have a better shot at Harvard. Why Californian's want to stay in California is beyond me. Yes, in-State tuition is stupid low for residents at UCB, UCLA, etc. but why not go for a free ride at a private university? (Yes, Stanford and USC are privates) I'm glad I left California for college; it was actually cheaper for me to go to a private university on the East Coast. And let me tell you something: no one gives a hoot where you graduated from later on in life.
What is insane is that it is the applicant pool that made it this way. Not one school ever set the bar this high but when you have over 50% of applicants as accomplished as the one mentioned in the OP, what are they to do? Each kid trying to out-compete the next and game admissions.
Honestly someone as accomplished and driven as your "local resident" could very well do good in life without a college degree. Just saying.
Yes, I'm playing it safe and assuming she will get rejected, since I have seen others with similar numbers repeatedly rejected in the past. This is why I started this thread. I have a healthy respect for the admissions process at that school, and don't want to take anything for granted. 6 years ago, I had another kid who did just that, assumed that Berkeley was a "safe school" given her exceptional numbers and background. She didn't have a major picked out, and wasn't proactive. The result was surprising and an eye-opener ---> rejected. Same with UCLA and UC-San Diego. We were surprised she could not get into these schools given her scores, grades, etc.
Don't make this inquiry by me any more complicated than it is..There is no ulterior motive here. It's irrelevant that other posters with "similar names" have posted similar questions. The concerns that parents have about the admissions process at schools like Berkeley, is a common concern, each year. Millions of parents have similar concerns, which means it is more likely than not, that more than a few other parents will express that here in a similar manner.
I agree about how less convoluted and competitive the admissions process used to be. Like you, when I went to school, there were no AP and Honors classes. I didn't have to damn near kill myself to get top grades, score perfectly on the SAT, and save someone's life, just to get into a good school. Going to a local community college and transferring in, is an option, but she would prefer to go in as a freshman. So we're trying to see what we can do to give her a better chance of making that happen.
Yes, there has been a push to reduce the Asian numbers, but Asians have to be commended for their success in academic settings. One of the reasons my daughter has such stellar numbers, is because her classmates are primarily Asian. Her friends and orchestra members are primarily Asian. It is very competitive, but she has proven more than capable. I don't want to make this about criticizing Asians. They are exceptional in academic settings, outscoring everyone else. If the university strictly focused on the numbers, there would likely be near 100% Asian admits. But that's a topic for another thread.
She may have a better shot at Harvard, sure. She may ultimately want to go to school back East like her sister did. The reputation of the school is important to her, and she wants to go to a school she feels is worthy of her. I go with that. Some kids don't care how selective a school is, others do. She falls into the latter category. She would like to stay close to home, and since we have two world-class universities here (Stanford and Berkeley), they are obvious targets. Hence, this thread. Glad it worked out for you, and you're happy where you went to school. Also, maybe nobody cares where you went to school later in life, but for many people, they themselves care. In her case, going to Stanford, Berkeley, maybe even Columbia or NYU, would be a great source of pride for her, regardless of what others think. This is where she is at this point in her young life.
I agree about how crazy it is now. I'm just trying to find a way to maximize her chances in getting where she wants to go. Many local families have seen their kids turned down by Berkeley, and their kids had unbelievable numbers. During earlier times, these kids could get into any school of their choosing, but this process is bat crazy...just trying to make it work to her advantage, since she's worked so hard to be where she is.
No college degree? Not an option for her. Thanks for the response.
UC Berkeley has the highest standards for admission of the UC campuses. While USC does not come close to the reputation of the UCs, it has improved in the past two decades.
If you read my earlier posts I STATED EXACTLY that. Berkley, I believe(and personally feel) is the top UC... those are obviously going to be more desired b/c they're CHEAPER (obviously) and the national rankings.
I was just stating that USC is a "safety' school. I live in Texas and got into both SMU and TCU... btw I don't believe either are very difficult to get into, but certainly not "easy" either...
HOWEVER, when visiting (when I first applied awhile back) and after attending and meeting many friends at both campuses(there is a "rivalry" but also a mutual respect honestly, most students at both are friends/related with each other) there is a VERY VERY high number of Cali transplants at those schools. EASILY around ~30% at SMU and probably 20-25% at TCU... VERY EASILY (lol)
Particularly through the business schools, Cox and Neeley, which are BOTH ranked HIGHER than USC's Marshall.
I was just stating that.
I mean they're all good schools.
I was just pointing out to the poster that yes, it is (and like I hinted at earlier) ridiculously difficult to get into Berkley because there are SOOOo many qualified applicants.
Her best bet for any sort of "advantage" besides writing perhaps the GREATEST ESSAY(or story) ever written, curing cancer, saving lives, or having built a great relationship with the faculty and staff(which is possible through email and a GENUINE show of interest)... is HONESTLY going to be being an Affirmative Action student.
But it's not like USC is a bad school, because it is not
There is not secret formula, it depends on what the school decides to select that year. The problem with "dream schools", they are just dreams and even if you get in they won't measure up. She may get in, you never know.
I know a girl who went there about 10 years ago who was also in band, although HER sights were set on Stanford and UCB was her consolation prize.
My neighbors daughter wanted to go to UCB last year only she IS Asian, with the same qualifications as the OP. She had to settle for Vassar though.
OP, you kept mentioning Asian in your first post. Do you believe that Asian people aren't getting rejected?
Also, while she sounds like a great candidate, it doesn't make her automatically entitled to attend any school she likes. She has to face the same competition as anyone else. The school has a high rejection rate.
I believe that Asians have it hard too, because they are competing against EACH OTHER, for the few slots the university reserves for them. But if the university reserves 40% of the class for them, that's 60% for everyone else...tough all around obviously.
Yes, I know that she's not automatically entitled, and don't believe I've given the impression here that this is our mindset.
Last edited by LexusNexus; 05-31-2015 at 05:55 PM..
There's no sure fire answer to your question. The admit rate is crazy low. There is no gaming the system.
There are 8x as many superstars applying as there are slots.
All she can do is try to show she'd fit the culture of the school and hope for the best. If she can get a feel for the type of students that thrive there or at least in her intended major (competitive science nerds?? Creative high strung rich kids? Overachieving tree huggers? Future heads of business? LOL) and highlight the parts of her personality that dovetail with that, she'd at least be in the ballpark.
You can try to get an in with a professor as suggested,but it's not really a guarantee. Can't hurt though!
Just be honest and put her best foot forward. It's the best thing she can do IMO.
I agree about how less convoluted and competitive the admissions process used to be. Like you, when I went to school, there were no AP and Honors classes. I didn't have to damn near kill myself to get top grades, score perfectly on the SAT, and save someone's life, just to get into a good school. Going to a local community college and transferring in, is an option, but she would prefer to go in as a freshman. So we're trying to see what we can do to give her a better chance of making that happen.
I sympathize with you and the students. And I agree about "back in the day". It was a given, when I was in school, that anyone in our school (with good grades) applying to Berkeley would get in. The school pegged its graduation requirements to Berkeley's entrance requirements. With all the extra math and science requirements now, not to mention the ART requirements! My god! , I'd never get into college.
There's no sure fire answer to your question. The admit rate is crazy low. There is no gaming the system.
There are 8x as many superstars applying as there are slots.
All she can do is try to show she'd fit the culture of the school and hope for the best. If she can get a feel for the type of students that thrive there or at least in her intended major (competitive science nerds?? Creative high strung rich kids? Overachieving tree huggers? Future heads of business? LOL) and highlight the parts of her personality that dovetail with that, she'd at least be in the ballpark.
You can try to get an in with a professor as suggested,but it's not really a guarantee. Can't hurt though!
Just be honest and put her best foot forward. It's the best thing she can do IMO.
Most professors wouldn't know or care, and couldn't be bothered. This isn't a bad idea though, in a more general sense; if she knows what field of study she wants to go into (even if she later changes her mind--it doesn't matter), she could see the undergraduate adviser in that department for a consultation, and ask if the adviser can offer any tips. After first enthusing about the field and discussing her experience with it, of course (science, languages, linguistics, history, whatever). Some advisers might feel it's unethical to give application tips, but some might not. If they even have a clue.
Most professors wouldn't know or care, and couldn't be bothered. This isn't a bad idea though, in a more general sense; if she knows what field of study she wants to go into (even if she later changes her mind--it doesn't matter), she could see the undergraduate adviser in that department for a consultation, and ask if the adviser can offer any tips. After first enthusing about the field and discussing her experience with it, of course (science, languages, linguistics, history, whatever). Some advisers might feel it's unethical to give application tips, but some might not. If they even have a clue.
Yeah,my sense is most professors have no clue about admissions and probably dont know anyone who works in the admissions office. LOL. Even the ones that think they know something don't most of the time. I've seen professors give really bad advice on that front!
They also tend to be swamped with work generated from managing the actual undergrads while trying to conduct research and publish, so there will be more than a handful that will not even be vaguely interested in humoring an ambitious high schooler who is clearly looking for a way in. Heh.
That said some might take the bait, especially if it comes from a kid who is referred by a friend. So it can't hurt.
I mean the best way for a high school student to get an in with a professor is to take a class with him/her through that schools (typically insanely expensive) summer program for high schoolers, but it is too late for that it seems.
I mean the best way for a high school student to get an in with a professor is to take a class with him/her through that schools (typically insanely expensive) summer program for high schoolers, but it is too late for that it seems.
Maybe not. She's a junior. She could take a summer class at the university, and write her applications next fall.
Maybe not. She's a junior. She could take a summer class at the university, and write her applications next fall.
Wouldn't she have to have already been accepted by now? Maybe not. Usually those things start in late June or July....
ETA: oh wait you said just take a class not do a full program. Yea, she could do that!
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, I'd never get into college.