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We already bought a lot in Collin county,Dallas/DFW area and currently considering two options: builder-owner vs. getting it build by reputed builder. I am trying to understand how much I will be able to save as an owner-builder. In addition, if we decide to go with the builder, who provides more value for the money: Paul Taylor, Drees, David Weekley. Please provide your input if you have gone through this. Your help is appreciated. Thanks.
Last edited by dallashomeshopper; 09-03-2009 at 11:40 PM..
Location: East Tennessee...but TEXAS is still HOME!
102 posts, read 429,867 times
Reputation: 64
I can't offer any specific help on your location or choices of builders, but I can advise you about being an owner/builder.
First of all, have you EVER built your own home before? Have you EVER worked on a jobsite? Do you have ANY experience whatsoever in building? If you answer no to any of these questions, then you DEFINITELY need the services of a professional builder.
Being an owner/builder is definitely not as easy as it appears on tv. If you do not know materials, codes, suppliers, sub-contractors, inspectors, and salesmen you will be in a lot of trouble. You have to know the codes backwards and forwards to be sure all work at least meets minimum code requirements. You cannot depend on your sub-contractors to do everything they should. You have to know what they are supposed to do and make sure they do it correctly. Even assuring all subs build to minimum code requirements, Congratulations. Your new home might pass with a D-.
How about specifications for framing lumber, clear spans, live load requirements, bracing, window requirements, etc? What about plumbing and electrical? What size service? How many outlets and or lights on a circuit? How many dedicated circuits are needed? What about GFCI and AFCI outlets? What size drain? How many fixtures can be on a single line? How far can you run a vent line? Where are backflow preventers required?
And this doesn't even begin to touch scheduling material delivery, work flow, special orders, payroll, accounts payable, and daily supervision. I haven't even mentioned selecting cabinets, colors, carpets, lighting, etc because these are so far down on the list of priorities. Carefully consider your choices and your TRUE abilities. Sure, I sound a little discouraging. But I have seen too many people insist they are qualified and/or capable of building their own house, but are absolutely unqualified and incapable of fighting their way out of a wet paper sack, try to build their own house in order to save a few dollars. They almost always end up with a over budget, over schedule, barely passed code, true pile of s#&% with no warranty, or builder to call to take care of "the little things".
dixierambler has many good points. My Wife and I designed our own home and had it built by a custom builder. The builder acted as the General Contractor (GC) but I was on site almost every day double checking, triple checking, etc. The only reason we used a GC is we did not have access to a list of subs for the job. Either way you go YOU MUST be ready to commit to constant checking, independent inspections, etc., etc. Here are some major things to think about.
1. The builder is the GC and will be responsible for identifying, hiring, etc. of all subs. One important thing to consider here are the legalities of using subs. If you're not careful screening and selecting your subs and fail to make sure they have proper General Liability insurance, disability insurance, etc. and something occurs on your build site then you are the one who is ultimately liable. If your contract with the GC is properly written then the GC can be held liable not you.
2. We're in some tough economic times. If your subs are robbing Peter to pay Paul and their suppliers are not paid then the supplier can potentially come back on you if they can identify their materials were used on your job. Sounds far fetched but happens all the time.
3. Timing is important and if you do not have a list of reliable subs you will potentially run into problems and delays. For example the foundation people have the forms set, grade beams trenched and ready and are just waiting for the plumber to rough out the plumbing and the plumber is a no show. Two days of scrambling around to find a plumber to do the job and on the third day you have heavy rains. The foundation area gets washed out and the foundation guys get to re-accomplish all of their work. It is not their fault that your plumber did not show so you get to pay for a second foundation prep.
4. Every sub you deal with is going to require a contract defining their performance objectives, responsibilities, materials to be used, etc., etc. If you do not get the entire process in writing from a sub then you are subject to the subs concept of how to do it, what materials to use, how long to do it, etc. There are many good trades people out there that you can just shake hands with and the job gets done. Are you willing to take the chance that you got that reliable and honest trades person without a contract?
5. Every aspect of your home must be defined before you even begin to break ground. As dixierambler pointed out there are so many things to take into account it is very easy to miss one major requirement and have the whole project stopped by a failed city/county inspection. Depending on the missed item this could require de-constructing major portions of the already built sections to correct.
6. If you are planning to finance performing the build, you very well might have a difficult time finding a bank to provide the financing. If you are not an experienced GC they are going to look at it as an immediate failure or problem project. Even if they do provide some financing they are going to watch you like a hawk! If something negative occurs in the middle of the build they'll yank your financing in a heartbeat!! You're stuck then with a partially built home and not enough money to complete it.
These are only some of the things to think about if you are planning to GC the work yourself. Can you do it? Certainly you can but it is A LOT of work! You will spend more time and aggravation than money you save.
I would expect you are looking at these organizations that offer guidance, etc., to building it yourself. They do work for those with building or trades background and even others without but who are very disciplined, savvy and project oriented. Don't buy into the hype that "Anyone can do it" as it just is not true! I've known several who have undertaken this route using these services who never should have tried it. They either saved little to no money and even lost on the deal.
So can you save some money on the build? Absolutely! Find a good builder,as well as a mortgage provider, who is willing to work with you. Have the home built to "Close In" stage. This is the pre-drywall and insulation stage. By then you have completed all of the really major portions. From there you can bring in your own subs (use the builder's plumber and electrician though as they already performed part of the work) to finish everything out. That is still a large amount of mark-up by a builder after that point. I can give you the name of a professional cabinet maker who decked our home out with beautiful custom, hardwood cabinetry at half the cost our builder was going to charge us. You can even perform some of the work to save a lot such as painting and staining, flooring (Let a carpet guy carpet as that really sucks to do), grading, planting, etc.
Hopefully this helps and good luck on the project!
I just noted another post where your lot is in Murphy. I thought possibly you were in an unincorporated area which would mean building inspections by Collin County. Whereas CC is tough on their inspections, Murphy is even tougher. You can see Murphy's requirements at City of Murphy, Texas - About Our Community (http://www.murphytx.org/comdev/building.asp - broken link). You might want to call them to see if they will even allow you to GC your own build. Murphy is attempting to make sure they are a well developed community with no issues and do this with building by being strict.
Murphy is using the 2006 International Code Council Residential Codes for building and the 2008 National Electrical Code. You can view a free online copy of the 2006 IRC here International. Unfortunately the NEC is not freely available online.
Thank you dixierambler and escanlan for pointing out some of the issues I will have to address. I have worked around the house and have done kitchen remodeling in my old house and being an engineer can educate myself regarding the building codes, etc. I also understand the structural design. As far as the experience of building the whole house, I do not have experience with it. I was also thinking about hiring a construction consultant, who can help me with providing periodic inspection. In addition, I also have to get financing part worked out. As I have understood, I have to have builder of record to get the financing done. Although, I am only looking for 40% of the total cost to be financed, it needs to be done. Please let me know what is your take on that.
Thank you dixierambler and escanlan for pointing out some of the issues I will have to address. I have worked around the house and have done kitchen remodeling in my old house and being an engineer can educate myself regarding the building codes, etc. I also understand the structural design. As far as the experience of building the whole house, I do not have experience with it. I was also thinking about hiring a construction consultant, who can help me with providing periodic inspection. In addition, I also have to get financing part worked out. As I have understood, I have to have builder of record to get the financing done. Although, I am only looking for 40% of the total cost to be financed, it needs to be done. Please let me know what is your take on that.
With your background, and desire to save on the build, motivation and hopefully stamina, you should have no problem doing the GC route with some tutalige and guidance from an experienced construction consultant. From your description the biggest pitfalls would be identifying, hiring and controlling the subs and the timing factors. The construction consultant can help you with that. I would expect that you have project planning and management background that can help you tremendously! If you want a near perfect home you really have to be anal in your planning and project management.
If your backing 60% of the build and you can place that money in some type of escrow account I would expect that a bank would potentially lend you the other 40% with a draw schedule using your money and theirs at each draw.
Being the GC on your own home is not total rocket science for an already aware and intelligent person. As a GC you don't necessarily have to know how to do everything by previous experience, just how, why and when it is done. It will take a great deal of reading and studying before you even hire a Construction Consultant or break ground. The WEB has a lot of free references for that but none that I have found to give you a free, good, in depth view (all in one place) of building a home. You would do well to research it in each step, design or purchase an actual home design and then build your project plan. Once you have that you can approach a Construction Consultant to go over un-thought out costs, requirements, etc. At that point all you have paid for are possibly a few construction books and the Consultants initial time. From there you can decide if you want to go forward as your own GC.
I would be interested in how you progress if you are so inclined to share it. A blog would be an interesting approach to this and can search to help keep your thoughts and goals on track.
if you are planning on getting a mortgage to build/own this house, you need to know that some banks will not set up financing for an owner-builder job--too many possibilities for errors along the way
I think you have to have a licensed contractor/builder as your GC
there are plenty of people who call themselves builders who have never roofed a house, plumbed a bath, layed tile, or hooked up a light fixture---and frankly they can't tell good work from bad and I guarantee that most of the people working in corporate builders like Weekley probably have little exposure to building trades except for passing out checks to them...
the builders that you cited are not what I would consider quality builders--run a scan on this board and Google to see some complaints---
they are such large corporations that the different subdivisions fall or rise on the individual construction supervisors that are assigned to those projects--and the contractors that they use for the work---some of their builds are definitely better than others...
I am not sure from comments if you have bought raw land not in a subdivision or if you bought lot in subdivision where you have limited options as to who you can choose to build your house...
great site for info on construction of a home is gardenweb.com -- the home building thread
many owner-builders, GC's, trades people, newbies--good information about almost anything you want to ask
there is also another site that is about owner-builder construction
called logically enough OwnerBuilderBook.com - Home for Owner-Builders
there are forums for states so you can refer to the TX threads specifically for info that might be more relavant for this area
from what I have gathered from reading other builder/owner posts you have to know what you want when you start--the more specific your plans/parts lists/design footprint---the more likely you are to stay on budget and get quality out of your build
but many people jump in without a plan, have no clue as to pricing or how to run a job, change their minds because seeing things in reality can be very different from your mind's view of what you want...
PS---the standards mentioned for Murphy are probably stricter than generally any builder's plan book because they require better building techniques that are basically "top of the line"--and seek to avoid half-measures and stop-gaps many of which have been in practice for decades...many constuction trades/workers that are NOT licensed--and there are plenty of them around--won't have a clue what those standards refer to--and probably a lot of the "licensed" ones as well-guess Murphy must require that all construction workers/contractors are licensed--that is unusual
and you need to be prepared for the friction that might develop when you as the GC try to tell someone who is 50 and has been doing for more than 30 yrs whatever you hired him to do and you are telling him he did it wrong...things could go downhill pretty fast...
not saying don't do it--but just know how deep the water is first
If the builders you are considering to build on your lot is one of those you posted above, they have a good proven track record about licensing permits etc. I wouldn't worry about that part.
You will incurr more cost from them when making changes. They will charge you when you have to make any change to the plan, even if it's for adding an outlet etc.
I had a major remodel with a GC and I would never try to do it myself. I saw how many headaches he had w/subs. I am happy to pay someone to do that.
If you have a job, you aren't going to be at the build enough to stay on top of things. What about the arguement between subs at 11:00 a.m.? Can you leave work to go out and see what's going on?
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