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In the last 11 years, Detroit has lost Volkswagen USA, Fortune 1000 Companies Comerica Bank and Pulte Homes, and lost popular Honey Baked Ham. In 1999, we lost Spirit Airlines. What can we do to gain corporate headquarters or at least employment expansions like Dallas and Chicago and Austin.
The short answer is public transportation. The long answer is we don't need them and may be better off without them, but we still need public transportation.
What concerns me about Detroit is that it ranks dead last amongst major metro areas (major = MSAs with at least 3 million people) in key areas that are critical to improving the region's economic outlook. As of 2018, it's home to only 52 out of 5,000 of the fastest growing privately-owned companies in the US (this is a decline of 3 from 2017). And as far as the global ranking for innovative cities, Detroit is also dead last amongst major metro areas.
I get the fears people have about Detroit becoming another Seattle with its growing pains (I.E. the homelessness, th city losing its soul, the traffic problems, etc.), but the reality is, we now live in a world where the tech industry controls our economic landscape. These companies are worth close to a trillion dollars or more and are gobbling up all of the young, educated talent because of the sheer amount of money they have. These young, educated individuals they attract also create a feedback loop of attracting more extremely liquid tech companies who will produce more high-paying jobs (besids Seattle, also see Austin and San Francisco as examples).
And I also get people's point about respecting the home grown industries / companies Detroit has (automotive) and encouraging them to grow / prosper, but the reality too is the auto industry reached its plateau long ago (some would argue in the late 90s, some would even say before that, back in the late 1970s). They're currently under siege not only by foreign competition that seems to be beating them in terms of quality, price and perception as far as consumers are concerned, but they're also under siege by the same aforementioned tech companies who are racing against them to perfect EV and autonomous vehicle technology. They're simply not going to be enough to bring economic prosperity back to Detroit.
I'm not sure what the solution is. I hear the other poster mention investment in public transportation, which is a long-term plan, but Detroit needs bold moves now to compete with some of the more desirable cities in the country.
Last edited by citidata18; 09-09-2018 at 12:08 PM..
They're currently under siege not only by foreign competition that seems to be beating them in terms of quality, price and perception as far as consumers are concerned, but they're also under siege by the same aforementioned tech companies who are racing against them to perfect EV and autonomous vehicle technology. They're simply not going to be enough to bring economic prosperity back to Detroit.
General Motors is second only to Waymo (Google) in AV development. SoftBank invested $2.25 billion in GM's AV division.
Ford is further behind GM, but is investing $4 billion dollars and spinning off their own AV division.
Waymo and other AV companies have operations and testing here because they realize they have to be connected to the auto industry to succeed.
Detroit is hardly a backwater when it comes to AV development.
And I also get people's point about respecting the home grown industries / companies Detroit has (automotive) and encouraging them to grow / prosper, but the reality too is the auto industry reached its plateau long ago (some would argue in the late 90s, some would even say before that, back in the late 1970s). They're currently under siege not only by foreign competition that seems to be beating them in terms of quality, price and perception as far as consumers are concerned, but they're also under siege by the same aforementioned tech companies who are racing against them to perfect EV and autonomous vehicle technology. They're simply not going to be enough to bring economic prosperity back to Detroit.
You have a very caricatured and hyperbolic view of the automotive industry as a whole. What you're saying might have been true 30 years ago, is not representative of current situations. You might want to look at actual numbers and trends before using stale talking points like this.
I work in the industry. I can assure you the American automotive industry has found it's footing among it's foreign peers over the last 45 years. After the restructuring and bankruptcies of 2009 they are not the same companies. They are far more competitive than they were going into the great recession. If anything they are an asset to Detroit going forward. Detroit sits on the automotive brain trust. It is much more of a corporate and R&D center over manufacturing now. Better paying jobs in higher tech divisions and a more educated population.
Not saying there isn't room for improvement, but the notions you're pedaling in this post aren't represented by the actual present data and trends.
...I work in the industry. I can assure you the American automotive industry has found it's footing among it's foreign peers over the last 45 years. After the restructuring and bankruptcies of 2009 they are not the same companies. They are far more competitive than they were going into the great recession. ...
I was having this discussion with a friend of mine last night. They made a snide remark about testing fate by driving an American car cross-country. I responded saying that back in 2005 I could've gotten behind a statement like that, but post-recession American cars seem to really be a different beast. They're reliable, and appear to stay on the road as long as their Asian counterparts.
It make take another decade for the rest of the country to realize this, but if I were in the market for an Accord or Civic, I'd consider an Impala or Volt. I think Ford is making a huge mistake doing away with their car production, but when the Ranger and Bronco come online it'll really take a bite out of Tacoma and 4-Runner sales, and based on what I see in the F-150 and Escape, I trust the Ranger and Bronco will be very impressive and reliable vehicles - a far cry from their Pre-2000s namesakes.
I was having this discussion with a friend of mine last night. They made a snide remark about testing fate by driving an American car cross-country. I responded saying that back in 2005 I could've gotten behind a statement like that, but post-recession American cars seem to really be a different beast. They're reliable, and appear to stay on the road as long as their Asian counterparts.
It make take another decade for the rest of the country to realize this, but if I were in the market for an Accord or Civic, I'd consider an Impala or Volt. I think Ford is making a huge mistake doing away with their car production, but when the Ranger and Bronco come online it'll really take a bite out of Tacoma and 4-Runner sales, and based on what I see in the F-150 and Escape, I trust the Ranger and Bronco will be very impressive and reliable vehicles - a far cry from their Pre-2000s namesakes.
So the American Automotive industry started re-evaluating their quality standards collectively in the early 1980's. The big 3 realized they were all buying parts from the same suppliers, but all using different quality systems. They pulled in a lot of Japanese, and other philosophy and standardized the supply base. It was still about another decade after that before American reliability took off. If you look at all of the foreign brands that build their vehicles in North America, they also have localized supply chains. What this means is that you have like the same 12 major tier one suppliers building the parts for pretty much every car made in North America(regardless of the origin of the brand). You have the same people building the drive trains for the Chevy Impala, that also build for the Corolla. The people who aggressively assert that Japanese or European quality is above American, haven't done the math to realize the components all come from the same place.
I'd assert you can take that reliability remark about 2005 and move it back another 10 years. Just look at the number of American cars 15-20 years old that are still on the road. Anymore the foreign vs. domestic quality argument about cars is little more than market perception. The 1970's and 80's were horrible decades for the American Car makers from a product stand point. So much so the negative stigma and media coverage still exists in a lot of peoples mind. The reality is pretty much anything you buy these days is going to go a good 150k or more miles before they really start needing a lot of money for repairs. 200-300k miles is pretty much the norm for vehicle life on cars in general right now. It's just with the way the market, and technology has moved. The level of precision and investment needed to produce a component for any car maker in today's environment is mind-blowing.
General Motors is second only to Waymo (Google) in AV development. SoftBank invested $2.25 billion in GM's AV division.
Ford is further behind GM, but is investing $4 billion dollars and spinning off their own AV division.
Waymo and other AV companies have operations and testing here because they realize they have to be connected to the auto industry to succeed.
Detroit is hardly a backwater when it comes to AV development.
True, Detroit's not a backwater, but it's also not a development that's unique to Detroit and the automakers either. I have my doubts about it being an economic panacea for the city when Silicon Valley and foreign automakers are developing the technology just as aggressively.
You have a very caricatured and hyperbolic view of the automotive industry as a whole. What you're saying might have been true 30 years ago, is not representative of current situations. You might want to look at actual numbers and trends before using stale talking points like this.
I work in the industry. I can assure you the American automotive industry has found it's footing among it's foreign peers over the last 45 years. After the restructuring and bankruptcies of 2009 they are not the same companies. They are far more competitive than they were going into the great recession. If anything they are an asset to Detroit going forward. Detroit sits on the automotive brain trust. It is much more of a corporate and R&D center over manufacturing now. Better paying jobs in higher tech divisions and a more educated population.
Not saying there isn't room for improvement, but the notions you're pedaling in this post aren't represented by the actual present data and trends.
For the record, I worked in the Auto Industry for several years, so I know what I'm talking about. In fact, when I go on trips and rent cars, I specifically request a Ford or GM vehicle (yes, even despite my not-so-positive employment experience with them).
But I'm only one person. I understand what the actual numbers say, but that's not my point. I'm a huge "Buy American" advocate and would never consider purchasing a foreign-made car. As another poster stated, a ton of people feel otherwise and market perception is reality. I overhear my coworkers talk about buying new cars for themselves and family members and they never even bother to consider American brands because of the poor (real) experiences they've had with them in the past (it's always Nissan, Toyota, VW, Kia or Honda). The exception is when it comes to the Big Pickup Trucks, but that's only because foreign automakers have much less demand for those types of vehicles in their home countries (because their roads are so small) and thus they can't engineer them as well as the Big 3.
That's going to be a major uphill battle for the Big 3 automakers to fight against and it won't happen overnight, even if the numbers on paper no longer align with market perception.
As far as the Auto Companies being an asset to Detroit, I completely agree. The question is, how much of an asset will they be? Auto Industry employment overall peaked in the late 1990s / early 2000s with over 1.3 million employees and they only recovered to a little over 900,000 employees by the time sales peaked again in 2016. Even with the industry being profitable again, they're doing more with less and thus not generating as much as a multiplier effect as they did in the past. That alone suggest they're less of an asset than they were in year's past. As far as the Big 3 specifically, despite the economic recovery since the Great Recession, their market share has continue to slowly decline against their foreign competitors, which suggests they're even smaller players in the industry today than they were in years past.
As I said earlier, I do think Detroit should continue to embrace the automotive industry and the home town companies that have planted their roots there. But I think if Detroit as a city wants to remain competitive in the 21st century, it needs to be actively doing more to diversify its economy with the growth and highly liquid industries of today. So far, I don't see that happening.
Last edited by citidata18; 09-16-2018 at 06:38 AM..
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