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Old 09-27-2008, 06:28 AM
 
4,173 posts, read 6,687,211 times
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(a) Iraq is an un-needed war whereas Afghan war was needed.. Iraq cost us 4000+ lives, $600 billion - $1 trillion. It has made Iran strong.
(b) current fiscal crisis costs are at $700 billion - about the cost of Iraq war

US strength and economy are linked. Iraq is the biggest strategic mistake Republicans have made in the last 8 yrs. The only tactical victory (maybe) is McCain's surge to correct the huge strategic mistake of invading a country with no links to AQueda. Overall, the Republican "Shock and awe" has turned into "aww shucks!". We cannot afford 4 more years of the past philosophy.

Thoughts?

Last edited by calmdude; 09-27-2008 at 07:23 AM..
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Old 09-27-2008, 07:06 AM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,329 posts, read 54,389,283 times
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I think it's a shame the wars have been pushed to the background by the economy when there are still so many Americans in harm's way 24/7.

Last edited by burdell; 09-27-2008 at 07:17 AM..
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Old 09-27-2008, 07:11 AM
 
4,173 posts, read 6,687,211 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
I think it's a shame the wars have been pushed to the background by the economy when there are still so many Americans in harm;s way 24/7.
Lack of money is a big reason we are still in harm's way. Fighting useless war means we have less money to secure our ports etc. Yesterday, part of the debate was about "strategic" vs "tactical". A good tactical decision (surge) cannot make up for the huge strategic mistake (Iraq). We are paying dearly.
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Old 09-27-2008, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Hell with the lid off, baby!
2,193 posts, read 5,803,289 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmdude View Post
(a) Overall, the Republican "Shock and awe" has turned into "aww shucks!".
Thoughts?
Ha!
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Old 09-27-2008, 07:56 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 18,972,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
I think it's a shame the wars have been pushed to the background by the economy when there are still so many Americans in harm's way 24/7.
Yes, and part of the problem we are having is our diminishing friendships all over the world, leaving us to fight battles alone, unless we can bribe them to help us.
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Old 09-27-2008, 08:20 AM
 
4,173 posts, read 6,687,211 times
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Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
Yes, and part of the problem we are having is our diminishing friendships all over the world, leaving us to fight battles alone, unless we can bribe them to help us.
Even the bribes are not working. Supposed "coalation of winning" had a lot of countries but almost all the useful contribution was from US and UK. Most members of the coalition have withdrawn.
And now we have no money to bribe.
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Old 09-27-2008, 01:37 PM
 
Location: Ohio
24,621 posts, read 19,165,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmdude View Post
(a) Iraq is an un-needed war

Thoughts?
I can see you don't understand economics or geo-political strategy.

If I would be you, I'd get one them Berlitz courses to learn how to speak Honduran or something. When things get bad enough, maybe you can actually afford a bus ticket to Honduras.
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Old 09-27-2008, 01:50 PM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,040,852 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmdude View Post
(a) Iraq is an un-needed war whereas Afghan war was needed.. Iraq cost us 4000+ lives, $600 billion - $1 trillion. It has made Iran strong.
(b) current fiscal crisis costs are at $700 billion - about the cost of Iraq war

US strength and economy are linked. Iraq is the biggest strategic mistake Republicans have made in the last 8 yrs. The only tactical victory (maybe) is McCain's surge to correct the huge strategic mistake of invading a country with no links to AQueda. Overall, the Republican "Shock and awe" has turned into "aww shucks!". We cannot afford 4 more years of the past philosophy.

Thoughts?
What many missed and was taken off the front page the other day by the McCain decision to cancel the debate was the following:

Biden gave his major foreign policy speech which was the top new item of the day. At that time he raised this very issue and the notion that while we are contemplating 700 billion for America and debating the merits we are in the process on spending that much on Iraq and they have a surplus. Within hours McCain decides to cancel the the debates. My reaction hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm that is terrible timing for the Republicans and Obama hit that list night.
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Old 09-27-2008, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Albemarle, NC
7,730 posts, read 14,158,279 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
I can see you don't understand economics or geo-political strategy.

If I would be you, I'd get one them Berlitz courses to learn how to speak Honduran or something. When things get bad enough, maybe you can actually afford a bus ticket to Honduras.
Um. Honduras' official language is Spanish. Your English could use some work as well.
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Old 09-27-2008, 03:32 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,193,095 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calmdude View Post
(a) Iraq is an un-needed war whereas Afghan war was needed.. Iraq cost us 4000+ lives, $600 billion - $1 trillion. It has made Iran strong.
(b) current fiscal crisis costs are at $700 billion - about the cost of Iraq war

US strength and economy are linked. Iraq is the biggest strategic mistake Republicans have made in the last 8 yrs. The only tactical victory (maybe) is McCain's surge to correct the huge strategic mistake of invading a country with no links to AQueda. Overall, the Republican "Shock and awe" has turned into "aww shucks!". We cannot afford 4 more years of the past philosophy.

Thoughts?
Personally I think we need to step back even further. We have been so intently focused almost exclusively on the Middle East, that the rest of the world is changing fast. South America is beginning to form a more unified position that is allied with a non-US point of view. The "Stans" region is in complete and utter turmoil as traditional allies like Turkey are shifting their alliances out of expediency. China and Iran have signed several trade and energy agreements, as well as China and the Russian joint military exercises. Africa is being to boil over again with Mugabe running Zimbabwe into the dirt and the South African government under extreme tensions.

It is almost as though we only see the world through a pin hole, one tiny spot at a time. Then again, when you put so many of your eggs into one basket you guard that basket like grim death. Never mind the fox is stealing eggs from all the other baskets.

America used to look at other nations in a tactical sense and view how actions with that nation would effect our strategic global view. Today it seems we view tactics at a military squad level and strategy at the brigade level.
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