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Very interesting, thanks for the link. I was unaware that a group had been able to make a fuss about this with insurance companies. I remember seeing this phenomenon described with a semi-slang contract name but I cannot remember it. It's a contract that is indeed signed, but nobody in their right mind would normally sign it unless they had no other choice due to external market conditions (which is exactly what happens when individual doctors sign up for insurance plans). This is the "take it or leave it" contract insurance companies offer.
This is not one article - or a small potatoes dispute. It's a dispute between the largest GI group in NE Florida (about 75 doctors plus who knows how many other employees) and the largest insurance company in the state. I can only imagine what is going on in the "small potatoes" world if this is what is going on when it comes to the "big guys". Robyn
It is rarely the doctor that is setting the price. It is the hospital/clinic/financial people. Most doctors have no idea what things cost and what patients are getting billed. It's not their fault. Their job is to be a doctor.... not an accountant etc.
Big insurance companies bring a lot of patients to that clinic, so they have the power to negotiate price. Cash patients do not.
When I pay out of pocket for something, I have been able to get a 20% discount from my providers. No where CLOSE to the discount insurance companies get.... no where close.
When my Mom was getting chemotherapy for an aggressive cancer, Medicare rejected the chemo recommended by her oncologist. It was a widely used chemotherapy that was covered by most insurance companies.... just not by Medicare because it was still relatively "new". The hospital asked us to pay up front $11,000 for one dose while we waited to see whether her secondary insurance (Blue Cross) would pay for it. Crazy expensive.... but what do we do?!?! Let my mother go untreated and die, or get the money?
But her Blue Cross came through in the end and covered it. They paid about $1500 for the chemo. They got a crazy good discount. While the hospital would have milked us dry if we had to pay for it ourselves.
It is a huge flaw in the system. It will probably never be changed either, as our system transitions to requiring everyone to have health insurance. Then everyone will be getting a "discounted" price. Of course, it will probably fall within your deductible so you will have to pay it!
He is not getting charged 3% on a debit card. He would be on a credit card.
Oh I see what your saying. That's pretty ridiculous and I still wouldn't offer a discount simply for that reason. What kind of person asks for a discount in that manner?
Oh I see what your saying. That's pretty ridiculous and I still wouldn't offer a discount simply for that reason. What kind of person asks for a discount in that manner?
Just FWIW - different vendors get charged different amounts of money by different credit card companies. They may also pay different amounts depending on the volume of business they transact with a particular credit card company. AMEX tends to charge small vendors a relatively higher % than a company like Visa. Which is why small vendors - including health care providers - often don't accept AMEX.
The 2 largest bills I pay through my checking account - and not with a credit card - are my electric bill and my property taxes. Because the power company and the tax collector both charge pretty high "convenience fees" to pay with any credit card. Robyn
[quote=toofache32;42096839]Oh I see what your saying. That's pretty ridiculous and I still wouldn't offer a discount simply for that reason. What kind of person asks for a discount in that manner?[/quote]
Someone who isn't afraid to talk about money!
So are you are asking the cash (including debit cards) patients to subsidize those who use credit cards (3% less to you) and people who have insurance (lower payment and labor of completing insurance forms)?
There is no subsidy when the fees are the same, but there are costs to doing business. The main reason I would not give that discount is because this is a red flag patient and a precursor to further headaches. Ask me how I know. I would not want to encourage that patient to stay in my practice.
Scambags at community hospital once charged me $1,300 for the rock bottom blood test costing $50 at most. Incompetent NP could not make sense of it as a bonus. $1,500 wasted just like that. The rumors about superiority of American healthcare are greatly exaggerated. Health care operates as racket, if you have no protection of a gang (insurance) you are just a sucker to rip off by smaller scavengers. Real money suckers, like specialists, rarely work with uninsured because their prices are way outside of affordable, so they dont expect any undeground millionaires knocking on their door, they just dont want to waste time on the people with very limited supplies of cash.
There is no subsidy when the fees are the same, but there are costs to doing business. The main reason I would not give that discount is because this is a red flag patient and a precursor to further headaches. Ask me how I know. I would not want to encourage that patient to stay in my practice.
A red flag patient, what exactly do you mean by that? This is really interesting.
Can you provide an example? My group of 4 doctors has never been able to get an insurance company to even let us know what fees we are signing up for. Let me state this again....the insurance company doesn't even let us know what their fees are. I welcome any documentation or examples that show otherwise for individual doctors (not university/hospital settings). Otherwise your statement is one from just another member of the public who has been duped by the insurance companies who make the public believe there are actual negotiations.
and in the middle of negotiations you break down.
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Someone who isn't afraid to talk about money!
