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Old 05-04-2021, 09:26 PM
 
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The 1619 Project has been back in the news. From what you've heard of it how accurate would you say it is?

Dinesh D'souza has some interesting responses to it.

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Old 05-04-2021, 10:04 PM
 
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It's a joke.
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Old 05-05-2021, 06:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motion View Post
The 1619 Project has been back in the news. From what you've heard of it how accurate would you say it is?
First, keep in mind that history isn't simply a fixed and immobile calendar of events stretching back to about 4000 BC.

History is a social science, and as such, cannot be monolithic and unchanging: history is our understanding of the past. As we uncover and process more information from prior times, our understanding of the past changes. People, specifically historians but also others, are free to debate the different hypotheses drawn by different scholars working in the field, until a consensus is reached, or until several different schools of thought arise concerning historical events. That's how history works.

From what I've read, there are some issues raised by professional historians with some points of historical accuracy in the 1619 Project. I have no doubt that parts of the 1619 project are pushing an agenda. I don't believe that this necessarily negates the entire project, but it does promote discussion.

Quote:
Dinesh D'souza has some interesting responses to it.

Dinesh D'souza simply is serving up rewarmed conservative non-factual talking points to feed a target audience. If you seek a discussion about American history, please ignore him.

If you do seek better information about the origins of slavery in America, I highly recommend American Slavery, American Freedom by Edmund S Morgan.
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Old 05-05-2021, 09:47 AM
 
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It's about as accurate as " The Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and with a warped, ahistorical agenda just like that useless screed.
Ignorant twaddle, written by the woke morons at the NY Times.
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Old 05-05-2021, 10:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by djmilf View Post

Dinesh D'souza simply is serving up rewarmed conservative non-factual talking points to feed a target audience. If you seek a discussion about American history, please ignore him.
When Dinesh was answering those questions which of his answers was inaccurate?
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Old 05-06-2021, 05:00 AM
 
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The idea that in 1619, Virginia's economy was reformed by newly enslaved people is not correct, but it is correct to say that 1619 was transformative. As more Blacks came, more laws came and more court cases. The ability of "black Englishmen" to own property, to vote, to pay taxes, to participate in civil society started to be restricted. Laws were hodgepodge until the the slave laws of 1705 were passed. Freed Blacks lost their status and rights, even the unborn "issue" could be willed/inherited/sold.

Slavey in America became a unique institution. It was race based, hereditary and the child's status followed the mother not the father. Unlike slavery in South America, in North America slaves could not marry and could not seek legal recourse against harsh and brutal owners.

The system continued to devolve into a system of horror: slave breeding. It was a major export of Richmond with over 10,000 a year being sold to go south - an unforeseen consequence to the end of the slave trade.

Slavery did not end with the Civil War. Through convict leasing an estimated 800,000 men, women and children were sucked into a system under which for minor offenses they could be leased to a business, railroad, farmer and the government would get the money. It was enforced through terror: lynchings, rape, burnings, bombings. Race defined where a person could live, who they could marry, if they had legal recourse, if they could vote, if and where they could own land. It even defined when and if a person could walk:cities, towns and counties passed sundown laws: no Blacks allowed after sundown.

In VA, many counties had "Black Wednesday." White farmers could apply for loans any day of the week, Blacks only on Wednesday. Rather than integrate, for years some Virginia counties and cities simply shut down their public schools. The Commonwealth then gave grants to students to attend white private schools, thus Blacks were denied an education, with no school, they went to work.

When the polio epidemic hit VA in 1950, white patients in the Shenandoah area could go to Roanoke. Black patients had to go to the Black hospital in Richmond which quickly filled up. It wasn't just a matter of loading up the car and driving on to Richmond. There were no interstates of course, but without a Negro Motorist Green Book, a person didn't even know where to buy gas or where to get car service: https://transcription.si.edu/project/7955

This is just a snippet from VA, it was worse further south. Va. was the only former Confederate state which did not engage in convict leasing.

In short, race has defined America and still does through its legacy. To ignore this history is to deprive men, women and children of all races their history.

He is correct in saying that segregation was supported by democrats. Segregationists will go where they find a home. At one time, that was one political party, but that changed and I'll leave it there since that gets into current events.

Last edited by webster; 05-06-2021 at 05:15 AM..
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Old 05-06-2021, 05:48 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motion View Post
When Dinesh was answering those questions which of his answers was inaccurate?
For one, D'Souza repeats the oft told lie that the Democratic Party arose to become the defender and protector of slavery. Point of fact is that the Democratic Party was split on the question of slavery - Northern Democrats tended to either be anti-slavery or content to leave slavery where it existed, while Southern Democrats either were pro-slavery where it existed or pro-expansion of slavery, calling for it to extend to the federal territories and even in some form to states where it slavery was banned. The Democratic Party split in the 1860 US Presidential election, which is why there were four candidates who got Electoral votes - Abraham Lincoln of the Republican Party, Stephen Douglas of the Democratic Party, John C Breckinridge of the Southern Democratic Party, and John Bell of the Constitutional Union Party (formerly a member of the Democratic Party).

This split wasn't just in the Democratic Party, the Whig Party also had the same sort of split in its membership, but that party died out in part due to that split.

There are more in the video, but if you can't spot the above lie by D'Souza, then you wouldn't believe anything else that I would post.
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Old 05-06-2021, 06:17 AM
 
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Accuracy is not the intent of the project, the modern concept of "wokeness" is. It's revisionist history, taking facts out of context to fit a modern political and social agenda. It's received plenty of criticism by historians.

Summary - It's a joke.
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Old 05-06-2021, 07:24 AM
 
7,346 posts, read 4,134,790 times
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Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
Accuracy is not the intent of the project, the modern concept of "wokeness" is. It's revisionist history, taking facts out of context to fit a modern political and social agenda. It's received plenty of criticism by historians.

Summary - It's a joke.
Yeah, never mind Virginia is not the whole country. The New York Times is located in New York where:
Quote:
In 1799, New York passed a Gradual Emancipation act that freed slave children born after July 4, 1799, but indentured them until they were young adults. In 1817 a new law passed that would free slaves born before 1799 but not until 1827.
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1783 On July 8, slavery was effectively abolished in Massachusetts, with the ruling by the Massachusetts Supreme Court in the Commonwealth v. Jennison case.
Quote:
The first black people to come to Portland were slaves, freed in 1780 when Massachusetts -- Maine was then part of the state -- outlawed slavery.
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Kansas entered the union as a "free state," because of the Kansas-Nebraska Act that allowed the residents to decide if their state would allow slavery.
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Old 05-06-2021, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Southern MN
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And something that is never mentioned - White people and Christians (who are currently under social attack) were the initiators of the freeing of slaves in the United States and England.

They, with multitudes of currently living white people and Christians, viewed slavery as an abomination. Not only did they believe that but they acted upon it at risk of harm to themselves.

Citing this fact would go a long way toward providing a more balanced viewpoint in my opinion.
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