Carrying a Gun in Idaho while outdoors (Cascade: home, buy)

[HikemHighJC]

When i still lived at home with my mother/father we use to do a lot of camping & Hiking. My dad use to carry a .22 cal revolver simply for protection.

20 years later with my own family, I have become an avid outdoorsman and hiker in Idaho. However, i do not holster or carry a gun while out there on the trail. I have heard may different views on this topic, but how do people generally feel about packing a sidearm while outdoors?

From what i have researched, it is perfectly legal in Idaho still to carry a loaded sidearm while outside city limits. Within city limits, you can still carry as long as your sidearm is visually open and unloaded. Anything else and you need a CWP. So i have been debating on purchasing a sidearm. I have lived in Idaho all my life so i already know the terrain and the chances of running into trouble. Personally i have never run across any situations where my life was in danger. But i did have a brother get dangerously close to a cougar attack. Luckily he was hunting at the time and had a rifle. He unfortunately felt threatened enough to kill the cougar. I was several yards ahead on the trail and it looked to me like it was crouching like it had been stalking us and seamed ready to pounce at him. Most of the time you never see them before they get you, which always made me curious if we stumbled across it, or if it had actually been stalking us.

Here are my questions:
- How do others feel about this? Would you feel uncomfortable running across another hiker on the trail with a visually exposed sidearm?

- What are your suggestions on a sidearm? Personally, i have been told to carry a .44Mag or a .357mag which is big enough to at least give you a chance against a charging bear.

[RotseCherut]

When I was hiking in the Sawtooth mountains on those remote empty trails I open carried my Ruger Redhawk . Carrying a .22 cal for protection in the woods is good when you need to shoot the person in the leg next to you as a means to escape a bear attack. Sorry, that is an old joke.. But, seriously, never carry a .22 in the woods for self-defense..

Idaho's gun laws are as good as they get.. I don't believe you need a CHL to open carry , but open carry in Idaho is much less common then it is in the state of Washington, funny enough. I was told it is bad etiquette to open carry your firearm on the trails in South Idaho, but I think open carry may be more common in the Northern/Central Idaho wilderness. Personally, if you are in a remote area with little hikers to scare, I would think open carrying is the way to go. Yes, you will scare the occasional hiker passing by, but who cares? Just mind your business, say hello and look the other way. You will not get yourself in any trouble.

In Glacier National Park, I concealed my revolver, because of all the whiny, snotty East Coast/Californian liberals who frequent the park, but I was still perfectly within my rights to open carry there. I didn't want to make a commotion. And, I had a run-in with a moose and a calf on the trail and was glad my gun was within reach, although I wish I could have had a rifle handy. Everyone was freaked out with the encounter and some idiot hikers decided to go hike right pass the moose startling it. I thought I may had to end up saving some other idiots life, because I was probably the only guy with a gun there. On the more rural trails of Idaho, you will not find as much of this tourist element. Idaho just doesn't attract all the liberal tourists to its rugged remote wilderness as places like Yosemite, Rainier, Yellowstone or Glacier would.

I, myself , open carried my Ruger Redhawk 44 mag with a chest holster system made by Simply RUgged Holsters. Google Simply Rugged. I found that carrying the gun on my chest makes it easily accessible in a moments notice and also balances the weight when I am climbing up those steep trails. I climbed up 4000ft trails in 3 mile distances , very steep grades and didn't have any issues carrying my Ruger Redhawk loaded up with 340gr Buffalo Bore +P+.

I would not carry anything less than 44 mag , personally, because it offers much better penetration through the fur and thick coats of bears. A .357 will work, but I find that a heavy framed gun like a Redhawk loaded with lighter 44 mag load will have not much more felt recoil than a 357 and offer considerable better penetration. Rounds like Buffalo Bore use a good quality slower burning powder and really reduce felt recoil, despite having .454 type of ballistics. The Redhawk loaded with Buff Bore +P+ will pretty much work against any land animal in the lower 48. The bears in Idaho are quite small compared to the Western Cascades. However, moose can definitely pose a problem in Idaho and forget about a .357 in that situation.

Bear pepper spray is also worthwhile to carry, if there is no head wind.. If there is head wind, resort to your firearm.


Why debate purchasing a firearm? Go get one What kind of avid outdoorsman would go into the woods unarmed? Remember, four legged critters are not the only threat in this day and age either. And, most people don't think they need a firearm until they need one. The, "I never had any trouble" statements are great for those who haven't had any trouble. Your brother's example is very good one. I, myself, have had several run-ins with bears and had a cougar confront me at a campground in SOuthern Oregon.. Bone chilling to the extreme and you will be glad to have a gun when it happens.



BTW.. Carrying an unloaded firearm is about as useful as carrying a heavy hammer. If you ever needed your gun in life/death situation and kept it unloaded, you can be sure you will not have the time to load it when your life depends on it. Always keep your firearm loaded and holstered on the trails.. Don't do silly things like carry an unloaded gun, thinking when a bear charges you around a bend because you approached its cub by mistake you will have time to sit back, relax and load it up.

[HikemHighJC]

Originally Posted by RotseCherut

Why debate purchasing a firearm? Go get one :P What kind of avid outdoorsman would go into the woods unarmed?

BTW.. Carrying an unloaded firearm is about as useful as carrying a heavy hammer. If you ever needed your gun in life/death situation and kept it unloaded, you can be sure you will not have the time to load it when your life depends on it. Always keep your firearm loaded and holstered on the trails.. Don't do silly things like carry an unloaded gun, thinking when a bear charges you around a bend because you approached its cub by mistake you will have time to sit back, relax and load it up.

Thanks for the reply. I debate it because i have traveled in groups both large/small. Some of the members i traveled with had their sidearms and there was always other group members whom felt a little uncomfortable. They never stirred arguments, but you could tell they were a little uneasy. So i try to respect the others i travel with or around. That is why i debate to carry or not to carry. My wife has now taken more interest and wants to try travelling with me, and so if i go with just my wife ....im sure she would not feel uneasy about it.

For sure an unloaded firearm is useless. I would not buy one and take it into the woods without loading it. The unloaded statement i said in my original post was simply my understanding about what you could do within city limits legally without have a concealed weapons permit. I may be wrong on that one though. But either way, yes, i agree it would be useless and idiotic to walk in the woods with an unloaded sidearm.

Thanks for the reply and advice!

[f5fstop]

Personally, I carry a gun 24/7 but at one time, that went with the job so I'm used to it. And the one I usually carry is not for four legged animals but for two legged animals.

My understanding of the law is to carry concealed you need a permit; regardless of whether you are in or out of a city limit. However, it appears if hunting you can carry without a permit. Concealed Weapons License Information I carry a weapon on my person in Idaho

I do not carry open except in the fields. And coming across someone else with a gun does not bother me at all. It is very common in many open areas of many states.

Your changes of hitting a charging bear with a .44, .357 or any other type of handgun are probably about 2 percent and that is for an excellent shot with steel nerves. A charging bear covers a lot of ground in a few seconds (I believe a black can hit 40 mph, a full size brown can hit about 30 mph). For charging bears, I carry bear spray; and it works, I know from first hand experience. But I also carry a 4" .44 mag, loaded with 300 grain Corbon Hunter round flat nose rounds. Not to shoot at a charging bear but to use if the spray does not work and it is on top of me as a last resort.

Problem with Cougars is you usually have no idea they are nearby until it is too late. They are quiet as heck. But great thing is they usually don't go after humans since there is usually plenty of easier prey to have for dinner and loud noises will get them to move, so a few shots into the ground will normally get them to vacate the area. (At least that was a suggestion from those who know, when I used to hike the Henry Mountains in UT that were known for Mtn Lions.

[RotseCherut]

Bear pepper spray is as good as useless in places like Glacier National Park with those strong 40mph head winds.. You will end up being the only creature that gets the burst of the spray.. Hitting a black bear anywhere with a 44 mag load will more likely than not make it retreat.. I also debate the 2% chance of hitting a bear that is within 10 feet of you. Yeah, you will need nerves of steel, but I would prefer unloading lead than playing dead. The chance of killing it would be not so high, but wounding it and making it retreat are very probable. Even if you miss, most black bears would retreat from the sound alone. Grizzly Bears are a whole other story and yeah, a handgun , is a last ditch effort. However, there is no way I am pulling pepper spray with a strong head wind blowing on me like I had when hiking in Glacier or on the trails on the Oregon Coast.. The Pepper Spray, IMO, is a feel good measure in Glacier NP, so tourists feel they have viable means of protection. But, many fail to realize how those strong winds will affect the spray. Getting disabled with an aggressive bear nearby is the worst possible scenario.

However, there was a grizzly attack in Glacier NP when I was there and a person put it down with a handgun. That year there was limited snow and the bears were more aggressive. Another attack happened int he park that year and a person was mauled and died. The person was reported to have carried pepper spray, I believe, that was not utilized.

Pepper spray I hear is also much less effective for moose and people under-estimate the dangers that moose pose. In fact, they are the most dangerous land animal in Idaho.

[Cnynrat]

Originally Posted by HikemHighJC

Here are my questions:
- How do others feel about this? Would you feel uncomfortable running across another hiker on the trail with a visually exposed sidearm?

No, the gun in and of itself would not make me uncomfortable.

The behavior of the hiker might be another matter ....

Originally Posted by HikemHighJC

- What are your suggestions on a sidearm? Personally, i have been told to carry a .44Mag or a .357mag which is big enough to at least give you a chance against a charging bear.

I'll be interested to hear other's suggestions about handguns. I suspect most will say that .357 is a little light for bear, and certainly not enough for moose. You'll need something that starts with a 4 for that, with .41 mag and .44 mag being the most common recommendations.

That said, you don't have to look too far to find lots of recommendations that bear spray is a better alternative to a handgun, but it's true that wind can create problems with deploying spray.

It's a PITA to carry, but purely in terms of effectiveness I'd rather have a short shotgun with slugs. In a panic situation I'd be much more confident of hitting a charging bear.

Fortunately, I think the chances of needing anything are low, but it's always better to be prepared.

[Shaner]

I don't go many places that I think bears would be, but when I do go out, I have a thigh holster and a S&W .40 that suites me just fine. Never had a problem before, and have run into people doing the same thing, no problems or looks.

[KurtAngleDoesn'tSuck]

Originally Posted by f5fstop

My understanding of the law is to carry concealed you need a permit; regardless of whether you are in or out of a city limit. However, it appears if hunting you can carry without a permit.

Negative Red Ryder.
In Idaho (and Montana) you may carry concealed outside of city
limits without a CWL while doing any lawful outdoor activity,
provided you are able to legally possess a firearm.

Statutes

18-3302 (12)(d):
Any person outside the limits of or confines of any city while engaged
in lawful hunting, fishing, trapping or other lawful outdoor activity;

[RotseCherut]

Originally Posted by KurtAngleDoesn'tSuck

Negative Red Ryder.
In Idaho (and Montana) you may carry concealed outside of city
limits without a CWL while doing any lawful outdoor activity,
provided you are able to legally possess a firearm.

Statutes

18-3302 (12)(d):
Any person outside the limits of or confines of any city while engaged
in lawful hunting, fishing, trapping or other lawful outdoor activity;

I forgot to mention that to the OP, that Idaho doesn't forbid conceal carry in rural areas while performing outdoor activities. Same goes for open carry.. Good info

If it wasn't for the dang state income tax, I'd be in North Idaho yesterday. Still thinking about Idaho, myself, but the tax and high costs of North Idaho are keeping me at bay for now. Idaho is a sportsman paradise and a very gun friendly state..

[volosong]

Are there rattlesnakes in Idaho? NID specifically. Normally, humans make enough noise that they'll slink away long before you come too close to where they have to warn you. But, sometimes things happen. Would it be worth carrying a .22 revolver loaded with some CCI Shotshell?