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The the real rub is who gets the shoes. MJ could of:
* given it to a good banker for good fraudulent banking
* an absentee land lord squatting on land.
* an insurance agent who waved Jordan's fees
Instead he gave it to someone who gave him apple sauce which is more than those people make in a life time. Suppose he gave his sneakers for a better mouse trap ...suppose he gave it specifically for labor and industry.
All MJ would have to do is sign an IOU to show up to a birthday party and splitting it in a hundred, like pieces of 8, the bits could be used like money. Of course when one person saved a hundred and had him show up, cashing in an appearance IOU , it might cause a depression.
You have completely lost me here. A guy helps MJ out by giving him some apple sauce and acts like a good guy toward him even though the Bulls are playing the Jazz, the guy, that is helping MJ's, favorite team and MJ gives him a pair of shoes. So now, years later that guy decides to sell the shoes. SO he makes a few bucks on them. Other than that what is the point offered by this thread?
You have completely lost me here. A guy helps MJ out by giving him some apple sauce and acts like a good guy toward him even though the Bulls are playing the Jazz, the guy, that is helping MJ's, favorite team and MJ gives him a pair of shoes. So now, years later that guy decides to sell the shoes. SO he makes a few bucks on them. Other than that what is the point offered by this thread?
Cause that is how a chartalist money system works, and the very same we use despite is various disguises. MJ can create assets with a sweaty towel. So can a sovereign with a negative reinforcement "won't send the goons this month" card. Da gubernment creates land assets by promising to throw everyone off a plot of land but you. Why do you think a "get out of jail free card" is an exchangeable asset in the game of Monopoly? That is pure fiat money backed by negative reinforcement if I ever saw it.
Taking it further is if MJ made "will show up to birthday party" tokens and made them fungible they could easly support liquid exchanges among his fans. He could also destroy this economy by not making enough of them or showing up too much and redeeming the IOUs hence destroying the Jordan fan base economy. Oh yeah, lets pay off that national debt we are using as money...real great idea idiots....
So how to create an asset out of nothing?
Become a superstar or a sovereign...but if you do, try not to pay it all off until we can find a replacement.
So the former kid from Utah has a signed pair of MJ's shoes. Current prices for an authentic MJ signature is $1,000 and can be more depending on the item. I would say that said owner of the shoes probably makes more than $1,000 a year wouldn't you?
So fine, MJ's signature is worth $1,000. Still that is limited because if he were to start signing lots of things then the value would decline. MJ could suddenly flood the market with his name. Guess what happens? Price drop. Still the MJ economy is limited and not a real life example. Collectors are placing a value on the name. Fans are placing a value on the name. The majority of people will never be able to pull this off.
The thread states how to create assets out of nothing. It has not been satisfactorily explained to me how that has taken place with MJ. If I were to sign a basketball could I then sell it to you for $1,000? No, you don't know who I am or what I have done on the court. Since I have done nothing to warrant a value of $1,000 a signature I can not make any money. The issue here is that MJ has done something that many value. He worked hard and had talent that currently warrants a $1,000 pay day for a signature. He did not create an asset out of nothing as has been stated.
So the former kid from Utah has a signed pair of MJ's shoes. Current prices for an authentic MJ signature is $1,000 and can be more depending on the item. I would say that said owner of the shoes probably makes more than $1,000 a year wouldn't you?
So fine, MJ's signature is worth $1,000. Still that is limited because if he were to start signing lots of things then the value would decline. MJ could suddenly flood the market with his name.
It all depends on the buying power of the buyer and the exclusivity of the asset. The MJ appearance is limited since he can appear only so often. The problem is this is a large denomination. So the solution is to break it up into a thousand pieces where to cash in a thousand are needed. I can guarantee you that the float could exceed 365 X 1000 because they would be saved and in circulation.
Quote:
Guess what happens? Price drop. Still the MJ economy is limited and not a real life example. Collectors are placing a value on the name. Fans are placing a value on the name. The majority of people will never be able to pull this off.
Like I said, if used as exchange and savings all would not be redeemed. Then you have not said why dropping in value is a problem
Quote:
The thread states how to create assets out of nothing. It has not been satisfactorily explained to me how that has taken place with MJ. If I were to sign a basketball could I then sell it to you for $1,000? No, you don't know who I am or what I have done on the court. Since I have done nothing to warrant a value of $1,000 a signature I can not make any money. The issue here is that MJ has done something that many value. He worked hard and had talent that currently warrants a $1,000 pay day for a signature. He did not create an asset out of nothing as has been stated.
What you are taking about is not a fungible asset until he creates a token. Money must be fungible. His signature is what adds that quality to the MJ asset .
How is selling a signed basketball selling your skills? The direct sale of skill would be if I needed him to shoot a basket. I don't have a signed wrench from the best plummer in town. I suppose if you want to use an unrefined unsophisticated approach like many modern economic approaches take, you can just call it a day. MJs skill cannot be used in exchange by a third party. See the difference between an artist and a ballet dancer? If the dancer sells their skill then their skill will not be used in the fashion of the carry trade. An artists painting could be used to buy a house a hundred years later. Tickets to the game might be used as a short term expiring currency reminiscent of Silvio Gessell's stamp script. But I hardly seeing it working its way into a more permanent source of liquidity.
I still have no idea what you are getting at. A ball without his name on it is only worth what the ball is worth. His name only makes it worth more because he signed it. The value of his name is set because individuals place a value on it and it may be hard to get something with his name on it. A ball with his name on it would be a work of art and chances are would take a place of prominence in a collection somewhere, probably viewed by those that visit the owners home or office or wherever the item is stored. Not all will place the same value on a signed item. I for one would not pay the $1,000 that it normally cost for any thing with his name on it. I like the guy but not that much. You see the market is still limited. If lots of items were suddenly to show up that he had signed the price would go down. He could flood the market with items and the price would drop way under the $1,000 mark. Your market would still be limited by those that are into MJ.
I still have no idea what you are getting at. A ball without his name on it is only worth what the ball is worth. His name only makes it worth more because he signed it. The value of his name is set because individuals place a value on it and it may be hard to get something with his name on it. A ball with his name on it would be a work of art and chances are would take a place of prominence in a collection somewhere, probably viewed by those that visit the owners home or office or wherever the item is stored. Not all will place the same value on a signed item. I for one would not pay the $1,000 that it normally cost for any thing with his name on it. I like the guy but not that much. You see the market is still limited. If lots of items were suddenly to show up that he had signed the price would go down. He could flood the market with items and the price would drop way under the $1,000 mark. Your market would still be limited by those that are into MJ.
I think we can agree that neither of us understands what the other is talking about.
I said
they could easily support liquid exchanges among his fans.
You said
I for one would not pay the $1,000 that it normally cost for any thing with his name on it. I like the guy but not that much.
Where the comment is that it acts as a source of exchange in a specific market , hence "fungibility issues again which you seem wholly obsessed with ignoring. Since the painting or MJ's shoes cannot break into lessor denominations equalizing the exchange limits its use for liquidity much like a $100 bill for a piece of gum or a bar of gold.
Then you proceed to say
His name only makes it worth more because he signed it.
When I said:
So how to create an asset out of nothing?
Become a superstar or a sovereign...
So everything has already been answered even before you asked. Move on....
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