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My mgr @ work was saying something one day to the effect that when her retirement runs out she'll just kill herself. Now, is she *really* serious? I don't know, but she sounded like that was a possible plan since she doesn't believe she'll have enough for retirement. For what it's worth, I think she's 15 years away from retiring from work, assuming she works until she's 65 and doesn't get laid off. Plenty of time to sock away more $$$$.
I invested in the Magellan Fund about a week before the crash of 1987. Granted, it wasn't much I invested--maybe $3K (I really can't remember) but I remember thinking, "ignoreItignoreItignoreIt." It was just ironic, my bad timing, as these things go. Of course it came back at some point, though I can't remember when. I was in my 20's and just starting to open IRAs. Now I would know to throw more $$$ at a good fund when the price was way down. Then, I didn't have more to throw at it, or if I did, I didn't know any better.
The thing about paper losses is that assuming you still own shares of something and assuming there is a value to those shares and the company or organization still exists and still is a going concern, the loss isn't 'locked in' and finalized until you sell. Sure, it might be that the value never comes back. Or sure, the value could go down even more. But the share price could also rise as well in the future. I'm not talking about options and advanced trading, just talking about the real ownership of shares or funds that own shares. The loss is "on paper," until you perform the action of selling.
There have been Chinese people who have committed suicide when their stock market crashed and some citizens and traders have seen their entire life savings evaporate. At least one man in the U.S. killed himself after the Ashley Madison hack knowing he'll lose his marriage/family because his name is in the database.
So yes people do kill themselves over severe losses and it's not necessarily being dramatic versus being serious.
That said I still encourage OP bobcat to get busy and pile up that to-do list to move himself forward in any direction, whether or not the action makes immediate impact on his fiscal bottom line. When the news is dominated by market fluctuation and everyday people are guessing the market going in both directions (still a bull market versus "don't buy dips! sell the rips!" crowd) - this is truly the time to know your risk tolerance and make some decisions about what to do from here.
OP knows he no longer wants to play the market. Ok... now what? I say get busy on a to-do list, maybe even volunteering just to get out of the house and meet different people and have totally different conversations.
The thing about paper losses is that assuming you still own shares of something and assuming there is a value to those shares and the company or organization still exists and still is a going concern, the loss isn't 'locked in' and finalized until you sell. Sure, it might be that the value never comes back. Or sure, the value could go down even more. But the share price could also rise as well in the future. I'm not talking about options and advanced trading, just talking about the real ownership of shares or funds that own shares. The loss is "on paper," until you perform the action of selling.
The positions have already been closed so the losses are realized but even if that wasn't paper losses are losses. People fool themselves into thinking it's not real but it's real
Huh...That's a long time to gain that amount in the game of options.
Anyway, too late now but what is that saying, "what the market gives the market can take back"? OK, I just made that up, but the lesson is one should take profit out of the market regularly because one dollar in hand is better than two dollars on paper.
David, what options strategies do you use and what kind of returns do they generate? I have heard some spectacular numbers but in most cases the end result has been 100% loss, just a question of how long it took.
OP, i'm sorry you feel that way, and i hope you will step back and look at the big picture for a minute.
You took a big risk that 'could' have had big returns, or big losses. you got unlucky and lost. that's it.
(yes, i think what you did was a mistake in hindsight but the bottom line is that you took a risk)
There are many many millions (billions?) of people that work all their lives and have less than 100k (which you are left with). If you die, you won't be able to enjoy the simple things in life like walking on the beach, holding hands with a loved one, or stare at the night sky; so, think long and hard about what you would be giving up.
as a side note, look at the link below. This dude lost $15 BILLLLLLLION dollars in 1 hour. Feel better.
This is very true, and is something I have thought about recently. If you take the philosophical view, that everyone in the world comes into this world with nothing and most leave with nothing (having nothing in between as well), there isn't any reason to expect to be any different. I was for a while, I blew it, nothing can change that.
There have been Chinese people who have committed suicide when their stock market crashed and some citizens and traders have seen their entire life savings evaporate. At least one man in the U.S. killed himself after the Ashley Madison hack knowing he'll lose his marriage/family because his name is in the database.
So yes people do kill themselves over severe losses and it's not necessarily being dramatic versus being serious.
That said I still encourage OP bobcat to get busy and pile up that to-do list to move himself forward in any direction, whether or not the action makes immediate impact on his fiscal bottom line. When the news is dominated by market fluctuation and everyday people are guessing the market going in both directions (still a bull market versus "don't buy dips! sell the rips!" crowd) - this is truly the time to know your risk tolerance and make some decisions about what to do from here.
OP knows he no longer wants to play the market. Ok... now what? I say get busy on a to-do list, maybe even volunteering just to get out of the house and meet different people and have totally different conversations.
Now THAT is excellent advice. Meeting people who don't care about, don't want to talk or even think about the markets. My guess is the best place to do that is, as you said, volunteering in some under-served area.
I assume you are kidding and/or being dramatic about this, if not you need professional help now. Being past 50 you must know that all set-backs are temporary.
Your surviving family wants you around, not money. If you are that concerned about leaving a legacy just keep the insurance in force for crying out loud.
I have a number of friends who made a lot of money investing. With a few exceptions they are no different than degenerate gamblers. No matter how much they have they want more..............none of them use their wealth to enjoy themselves, which of course was the reason they started investing.
I assume you enjoy having fun, go have some. A retired friend of mine who lives off of a small pension and SS just got back from a week in China, she could not be more thrilled. The kicker is she did it for $1300.00, all in.
Perhaps its time to reevaluate your priorities. Your a smart person, when we pass away what do we have but a good story to tell.
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When I was a kid my father inherited $2000.00 from an aunt which in circa 1960 was a lot of money to a young family. He thought he was smart and "invested" it with crooked broker who gave him a carving knife set as an inducement. (Now before you are hard on my Dad he was still in his twenties and naïve). Of course my mother wanted to know the details and he told her he had only invested $200 of the money. Needless to say he lost every penny but somehow was able to keep the totality of the situation from my mother for decades. The funny thing about all of this was every Thanksgiving my Mother would break out the carving knife set and say in a sarcastic tone "Here is our $200.00 knife set". Being able to share that smiling glance with my Dad and him saying in a soft voice, "$2000.00 knife set" still makes me laugh. Say what you will about my father's financial prowess but he could always laugh at himself, perhaps the most important skill.
No, I was serious about it at the time, but not today. Today I'm just ticked at myself. Love your dad's story, that's awesome! Hopefully I'll be laughing about this someday.
Ted do you really think this is a bear market? It seems to be heading to new all time highs. In fact that's now becoming the hardest thing for me- not to check the markets so I won't get even more depressed when the Dow is 20K.
Yes. 10,000 before 20,000.
The "free money" days are drawing to a close. There is a whole generation of "professionals" who know nothing other than "buy each dip". The market will teach them a lesson; they'll promise to never do it again and be too scared to invest at the bottom, and we'll get a new crop of "brave" portfolio managers.
But for now, we are broken...have been for some time in the transports and the utilities.....and we are headed lower. Watch the last full week of September...the stats for that period of time are horrendous....really bad.... We have McClellan just turned bearish, and McHugh , another Elliot waver, is calling for the end of the world.....assuming you don't believe me and want outside confirmation.
And I have more years in this market than either of them. Survived 1987...but have not forgot what it looked like. Back then it was "portfolio insurance", today it is "gamma"...the rate of change of delta...or volatility, in simple terms. Portfolios are NOT hedged against it, so the lower we go, the more selling is required by portfolio managers (and option dealers who are short puts (not to pour salt in the wound), and that is the key driver of the market at present. It needs to work off about $300 BILLION of gamma...and that is a LOT! One of these "major" late day sell programs is about $3 Billion. Do the math to get to $300 BILLION....
Bear Market.
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