Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
is the sudden entry point for a modest one family home in the traditional white working class neighborhoods of New York City. I never thought I'd live long enough to see something like this and I'm not even old.
Example(s) would be zip code(s) 11104, 11209, 11211, 11222, 11228, 11357. I could list dozens more, but it would be really monotonous.
One of the common denominators for these neighborhoods is a slow demographic shift from white Christian middle and upper middle class to Asian middle and upper middle class. Certain Asian groups focus on certain areas; for example: koreans for whitestone and fujianese for brooklyn south (southwestern bklyn). Another common denominator is that these neighborhoods never "fell off" or changed much; even when the city was a complete train wreck (I'd choose 1977 as the absolute trough for NYC). The residents of these communities got up everyday, all of the men and some of the women went to work and they raised generally good children. The sons of these neighborhoods went to schools like Xavier and Regis. Daughters and the remaining sons mostly went to local Catholic high schools and public schools like Bronx Science, Brooklyn Tech and Stuyvesant. The more financially fortunate (or, the really good athletes) attended schools like Poly Prep, Riverdale and Horrace Mann.
All of this has nothing to do with that God awful racist code word "gentrification". The intra-city migratory patterns of asian immigrants directly mirrors the movement and settlement patterns of earlier European Christians immigrants such as the Irish, Italians, Scandanavians and Germans. As I've wrote in other comments: you can't "gentrify" a neighborhood with million dollar homes. As hard as it is for white urban pioneers to understand, most Asians don't care about locally sourced beard hair for bath rugs and towels.
I predict that within 2 generations, Asians will dominate the political and economic landscape of New York City. This bodes well for the general future of NYC. At the risk of stereotyping: Asians love law and order. And, commerce. They love commerce! Just as their European counterparts did when they helped build New York.
Cities like Baltimore, Cleveland and the rest of these democrat controlled fever swamps (cities which are openly hostile towards east Asian immigrants) will continue to become dystopian nightmares. They're demographic disasters beyond any hope. The crooked politicians who run these democrat disaster areas should admit failure. Liberals who read Alice in Wonderland think of the rabbit hole as a fun place; as long as they're in charge of the hole.
Anyway, brave urban pioneers from Spokane should focus on gentrifying places like Baltimore and just leave Greenpoint alone. It was doing just fine before Caleb and Molly showed up with a rent guarantee from their poor Grandpa Joe...
Last edited by Citizenrich; 06-19-2015 at 02:19 AM..
not even close on the number? I wouldn't mind being corrected but I own a large enough sample of places in theses areas to the point where I feel like I really understand the market.
the starting price for a 1300 sq ft single family in sunnyside gardens is actually over a million.
dyker is the roughly the same - around 500 per sq ft.
there are outliers (like an all original 1200 sq ft. 1925 attached with a dirt floor basement and the coal conversion boiler for 700k but like I wrote: that's an outlier. Just as there are dreamers asking 2 million for the same house with a new kitchen and bathroom.
The average price is now 1 million dollars. These aren't asking prices - these are closing prices. The chinese are very aggressive with real estate.
These aren't chopped up flop house conversions. These are legit single family homes.
This all happened rather suddenly. Prices jumped ~20%; seemingly overnight. Not sure if it was the spike in the dollar but there's a (((ridiculous))) amount of chinese money flooding the new york and california real estate market.
*edit
now I'm thinking you may be referring to my Asian population prediction? I'm probably wrong but just about everything I've ever read currently places NYC's Asian population @ 13 - 15% and that number is expected to double by 2030 or 2040. There's also a ton of empirical data to show that Asians are undercounted in Northwest Queens and Southwest Brooklyn. I'm inclined to believe that claim.
So, by 2030 or so, Asians will be constitute 1/3 of the population of NYC. That's a remarkable number, considering they were something like 2 or 3% just 30 years ago. I know Asians aren't a monolithic group but most NYC Asians are Chinese with a smaller and equal amount Of Indians, Bangladesh, Paki's and the rest.
Also of note: blacks appear to be disappearing from NYC at a pretty high rate (something like a full 5% drop between 2000 and 2010) and I don't think it's by accident. I believe it's completely by design. Liberals are very clever.
Consider the already in-place legal immigration from west Africa and our acceptance of "refugees" from places like Somalia and East Africa has been on the rise and the drop in black population becomes even more remarkable. These are "American Blacks" disappearing; the ones who came here from the Carolinas and the rest of the south in the 1950's and 60's when they built large scale free public housing.
BTW - the city isn't renewing leases for Far Rockaway and plans on razing those projects and "re-locating" whomever wants to stay in the city. Far Rock is truly the land of misfit toys. Not sure where all those people are going to wind up but I bet many will just leave the city. I'm really digressing here but the city finally realized how that is some of the most valuable land in the world. I know you're a New York guy so you know how our dads and granddads ranted about how NYC is the only place in the world that build free housing projects on beachfront property,,,lol
Last edited by Citizenrich; 06-19-2015 at 04:46 AM..
I'll give you an anecdote: Very dear friends of ours decided to sell one of their homes located on 11th ave and 48th street (right near Maimonides).
They're old school Italian and their families were among the original settlers of the area. I believe the first property purchased by his great grandfather was 1896. Over the years, he and his brother wound up with a dozen or so homes, all within a 10 block radius.
Long story, boring: they listed the house for 1.3mm. Within hours, they were contacted by one of the head beards who very clearly told them "We have a nice family for your home, and they will pay 750k. As you know, we control the area and you'll receive no other offers". End of conversation.
By the end of the day, an offer was made for full price by a Chinese businessman. He told my buddies attorney he could close as fast as they could produce a clear title, and he would be paying cash for the house. The buyer asked if he would accept 1 dollar less than 1.3mm because of some unlucky number thing. He said - "let me think about about and then said - OK"
The transaction took less than 14 days. BTW - 1.2999mm dollars weighs like 27 pounds.
I watch the real estate in 11209. Yes, there are a lot of houses over one million but you can find houses under a million. I still can't afford them but hopefully I'll be gone one day.
I meant your price point. It is way high. There are plenty of white middle/upper class neighborhoods where less than $500k will get one a decent home. Migjt I point to the entire boro of SI as an example.
I wish you were right. I'm a homeowner in a neighborhood so white that a man the coloro of printer paper wouldn't stand out. I would love to sell for $1 million. But that's just ridiculous.
Don't forget the North Shore of Long Island along Northern blvd.
Asians with cash are taking over Great Neck, Manhasset. Creeping over to Port Washington and Roslyn.
I tried to get a house in Great Neck, but was outbid buy cash paying asians. I ended up buying more east in the Roslyn area.
An million bucks doesn't get you much these days anywhere in nyc area and nicer suburbs.
I meant your price point. It is way high. There are plenty of white middle/upper class neighborhoods where less than $500k will get one a decent home. Migjt I point to the entire boro of SI as an example.
I wish you were right. I'm a homeowner in a neighborhood so white that a man the coloro of printer paper wouldn't stand out. I would love to sell for $1 million. But that's just ridiculous.
My bad. I went back and read what I wrote and I wasn't precise enough in my description. I listed specific zip codes as examples of the areas for which I was referring. I never meant to include most towns in Staten Island and pretty much the entire Bronx although there are some exceptions.
There are specific parts of Staten Island (Lighthouse Hill, etc., etc.) which have always been among the most expensive in all of NYC. There are specific areas of the South Shore where a million dollars is now the entry point as well.
For the Bronx, Riverdale and Country Club have always been…Riverdale and Country Club. But, you can still get a nice home in a place like Throggs Neck for 400k - 500k.
My original post only really mean to include specific areas of Brooklyn and Queens. I should have been more clear - my wording was a bit clumsy.
I'm mostly focused on southwest Brooklyn and traditional "working class" Queens, especially the northeast.
In total, there's probably 25 or so zip codes (I listed some of them). For those 25 zip codes, the average per square foot selling price is up 400% or so in less than 15 years. It's truly remarkable.
is the sudden entry point for a modest one family home in the traditional white working class neighborhoods of New York City. I never thought I'd live long enough to see something like this and I'm not even old.
Example(s) would be zip code(s) 11104, 11209, 11211, 11222, 11228, 11357. I could list dozens more, but it would be really monotonous.
One of the common denominators for these neighborhoods is a slow demographic shift from white Christian middle and upper middle class to Asian middle and upper middle class. Certain Asian groups focus on certain areas; for example: koreans for whitestone and fujianese for brooklyn south (southwestern bklyn). Another common denominator is that these neighborhoods never "fell off" or changed much; even when the city was a complete train wreck (I'd choose 1977 as the absolute trough for NYC). The residents of these communities got up everyday, all of the men and some of the women went to work and they raised generally good children. The sons of these neighborhoods went to schools like Xavier and Regis. Daughters and the remaining sons mostly went to local Catholic high schools and public schools like Bronx Science, Brooklyn Tech and Stuyvesant. The more financially fortunate (or, the really good athletes) attended schools like Poly Prep, Riverdale and Horrace Mann.
All of this has nothing to do with that God awful racist code word "gentrification". The intra-city migratory patterns of asian immigrants directly mirrors the movement and settlement patterns of earlier European Christians immigrants such as the Irish, Italians, Scandanavians and Germans. As I've wrote in other comments: you can't "gentrify" a neighborhood with million dollar homes. As hard as it is for white urban pioneers to understand, most Asians don't care about locally sourced beard hair for bath rugs and towels.
I predict that within 2 generations, Asians will dominate the political and economic landscape of New York City. This bodes well for the general future of NYC. At the risk of stereotyping: Asians love law and order. And, commerce. They love commerce! Just as their European counterparts did when they helped build New York.
Cities like Baltimore, Cleveland and the rest of these democrat controlled fever swamps (cities which are openly hostile towards east Asian immigrants) will continue to become dystopian nightmares. They're demographic disasters beyond any hope. The crooked politicians who run these democrat disaster areas should admit failure. Liberals who read Alice in Wonderland think of the rabbit hole as a fun place; as long as they're in charge of the hole.
Anyway, brave urban pioneers from Spokane should focus on gentrifying places like Baltimore and just leave Greenpoint alone. It was doing just fine before Caleb and Molly showed up with a rent guarantee from their poor Grandpa Joe...
You may be happy about the shift in Dyker Heights but many people aren't (myself included). I considered a place off of 13th Avenue years ago and back then it was all Italian. It's disturbing what's going on and I sincerely hope that Bay Ridge can remain the way that it's been (primarily Irish, Italian and Scandinavian). Here in Riverdale we have a comfortable white majority and my thinking is that it's isolated and expensive enough to stay that way. I don't see the Irish or the Jews giving this up, and the Jews control the real estate here. We saw what happened in Bensonhurst. The Italians left and now look at 86th street. It's filthy, and nothing is in English. It's like a foreign country, no longer part of the US. That shouldn't be in America.
I watch the real estate in 11209. Yes, there are a lot of houses over one million but you can find houses under a million. I still can't afford them but hopefully I'll be gone one day.
I believe 11209 is Bay Ridge, yes? There are very few private homes with garages for under 1mm today. Perhaps on a few blocks on the edges but very few. For what what would be considered prime residential Bay Ridge (between 4th Ave. and Shore Road), there is probably nothing as I described under 1mm.
As recently as 2 years ago 750k to 800k was a closer entry point. It's like suddenly, everything is 1mm and higher. And, it's not just wishful thinkers - homes are closing at these prices.
It's feels very bubbly but I remember saying the same thing when the Chinese where paying 300k cash for 250k houses in South Brooklyn back in the 90's. So I'm going to come right and say that the Chinese are smarter than me.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
