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Who said you had to forgive and in a certain amount of time and "roll out the red carpet"?
It really does sound as if you are still harboring a lot of anger. I'm not saying you shouldn't (don't know the details and it really doesn't matter - forgiveness and anger over being wronged is very personal) but I think you need to rethink whether you've forgiven him or not. If not, and it's been 10 years and you are still angry, it might be time to get some help with that. For your own sake - and completely separate from the idea of forgiveness.
I am confident I have forgiven. I don't wish him any bad in the world, and hope he has a happy life.
I don't believe forgiveness means you never get angry over the incident again. I am over that 1990s self-help/family therapy type of thinking.
Realizing that the big hurts in life will probably pop up time and again was a big feeling of freedom. Now if I get so angry I can't see straight, and can't function, that is one thing. But to experience annoyance after he comes up to me 3 years later only after I have done all the work on my own... That is human, I think.
There is this shame that society places on anger. We are supposed to eliminate it or something. But we will be reminded time and again of what happened. If someone else does something similar, or if the person shows up again shortly after, etc. I realize it is just a reaction to a memory.
I was listening to this podcast. The guy was talking about his years in therapy and he realized he felt ashamed whenever his old anger came up and he finally realized "Maybe I am not supposed to resolve everything from my past or figure it out." That was liberating. I was never ashamed of my anger again.
I am confident I have forgiven. I don't wish him any bad in the world, and hope he has a happy life.
I don't believe forgiveness means you never get angry over the incident again. I am over that 1990s self-help/family therapy type of thinking.
Realizing that the big hurts in life will probably pop up time and again was a big feeling of freedom. Now if I get so angry I can't see straight, and can't function, that is one thing. But to experience annoyance after he comes up to me 3 years later only after I have done all the work on my own... That is human, I think.
There is this shame that society places on anger. We are supposed to eliminate it or something. But we will be reminded time and again of what happened. If someone else does something similar, or if the person shows up again shortly after, etc. I realize it is just a reaction to a memory.
I was listening to this podcast. The guy was talking about his years in therapy and he realized he felt ashamed whenever his old anger came up and he finally realized "Maybe I am not supposed to resolve everything from my past or figure it out." That was liberating. I was never ashamed of my anger again.
Who said you should feel ashamed for feeling angry? You keep asking one thing and responding to something completely different. Your posts seem to indicate that you still harbor a good deal of resentment and anger - as does your rude response to the apologizer. If you feel that good about it then great. Why pose the question here?
Who said you should feel ashamed for feeling angry? You keep asking one thing and responding to something completely different.
No, Maciesmom, I am reading between the lines.....
Quote:
Your posts seem to indicate that you still harbor a good deal of resentment and anger - as does your rude response to the apologizer.
I am getting more angry as I am being passive-aggressively attacked in this thread. Pretty indicative right here in this line, how you seem to be factually, innocently analyzing my anger and then turning around and telling me I was rude. And yeah, absolutely, I will always have hurt feelings over what that guy did. But my current boyfriend has taught me a good lesson, "Accept the imperfections in people"... and I have done that. I accepted that the guy did the best he could at the time. Even his "apology" was rude. It was done of sheer convenience because we were in the same place. He would never have written me a letter or called me about it.
Quote:
If you feel that good about it then great. Why pose the question here?
Because I am asking the question: Do you believe it is a sincere forgiveness if, for whatever reason, you choose not to accept someone's apology. But as always, with these kinds of threads it turns into a subtle attack on the OP and psychoanalysis of them. I am seeing right through it, so I don't care.
MSPLove, honey, you never have to forgive the person.
But, the thing is...don't think you have, thats' all...
Resolving something inside yourself somehow and being 'ok' now after years...is diff than forgiving.
You can even say...'I honor you apologizing...but I'm not truly over it...it was that big. I don't hate you and
I don't carry anger around with me about it...but, I want nothing to do with you...I hope you never do that again to someone."
Just a thought....no red carpet.
Edit:
Oh, just saw you're direct question above.
No, if you do not accept the apology it is not true forgiveness.
Forgiveness is actually complex and simple at the same time.
There are many threads discussing it on a spiritual forum I am on.
Passive aggressive is....passive, hidden, cloaked...I'm seeing directness on this thread...maybe
with a touch of tact, sometimes.
Last edited by Miss Hepburn; 09-21-2014 at 03:17 PM..
No, Maciesmom, I am reading between the lines.....
I am getting more angry as I am being passive-aggressively attacked in this thread. Pretty indicative right here in this line, how you seem to be factually, innocently analyzing my anger and then turning around and telling me I was rude. And yeah, absolutely, I will always have hurt feelings over what that guy did. But my current boyfriend has taught me a good lesson, "Accept the imperfections in people"... and I have done that. I accepted that the guy did the best he could at the time. Even his "apology" was rude. It was done of sheer convenience because we were in the same place. He would never have written me a letter or called me about it.
Because I am asking the question: Do you believe it is a sincere forgiveness if, for whatever reason, you choose not to accept someone's apology. But as always, with these kinds of threads it turns into a subtle attack on the OP and psychoanalysis of them. I am seeing right through it, so I don't care.
Ah then, you are one if those people that finds slights or attacks or other wrongs in even a simple disagreement where there was no slight, no attack or other way you victimized. That puts things in a different light.
I am confident I have forgiven. I don't wish him any bad in the world, and hope he has a happy life.
I don't believe forgiveness means you never get angry over the incident again. I am over that 1990s self-help/family therapy type of thinking.
Realizing that the big hurts in life will probably pop up time and again was a big feeling of freedom. Now if I get so angry I can't see straight, and can't function, that is one thing. But to experience annoyance after he comes up to me 3 years later only after I have done all the work on my own... That is human, I think.
There is this shame that society places on anger. We are supposed to eliminate it or something. But we will be reminded time and again of what happened. If someone else does something similar, or if the person shows up again shortly after, etc. I realize it is just a reaction to a memory.
I was listening to this podcast. The guy was talking about his years in therapy and he realized he felt ashamed whenever his old anger came up and he finally realized "Maybe I am not supposed to resolve everything from my past or figure it out." That was liberating. I was never ashamed of my anger again.
I don't agree that there should be a time frame on apologies, but understand the annoyance of receiving a very late (and perhaps insincere) apology.
I am bemused by the comments of you being ungracious. It's a faux pas to expect that a person must give the apologist a note of forgiveness. Its completely up to the person to accept, if s/he doesn't accept... so be it. The apologist here is actually being ungracious by being put off by the undesired effect and involving others in this situation.
Lol. Why are the victims given so much more crap than the offenders?
So he can take 10 years or all the time in the world to "work it out" but I have to forgive ASAP as well as roll out the red carpet if and when he ever comes around?
Something's wrong with that picture.
(I have to wonder if the people responding in this way have something to apologize for themselves and know that my kind of reaction is a consequence they could possibly receive themselves...)
You quit being a victim when you put a time frame on an apology.
Did you ever think maybe he didn't realize he hurt your feelings or did not intentionally hurt your feelings and has/had no idea you were hurt?
Did you ever wonder if he even knows why your feelings were hurt?
Let me clear that up for you:
No, I have nothing to apologize to anyone for. Fortunately those I know are straight forward to the point and we can tell each other immediately when something hurts us and take care of the issue at that moment. We don't have to wait around for the other person to finally get around to telling us or anyone else that they were hurt.
Ah then, you are one if those people that finds slights or attacks or other wrongs in even a simple disagreement where there was no slight, no attack or other way you victimized. That puts things in a different light.
I don't hate you and
I don't carry anger around with me about it...but, I want nothing to do with you...I hope you never do that again to someone."
Now that is closer to how I really feel than what I actually said. Later on, I still would have said, "too little , too late" to friends about it, but yeah, I sure wish I would have thought of saying something like that.
I don't think anyone is required to "get completely over it" to forgive though. That is something that will fade more and more just with time.
Quote:
Edit:
Oh, just saw you're direct question above.
No, if you do not accept the apology it is not true forgiveness.
Forgiveness is actually complex and simple at the same time.
There are many threads discussing it on a spiritual forum I am on.
Passive aggressive is....passive, hidden, cloaked...I'm seeing directness on this thread...maybe
with a touch of tact, sometimes.
I think forgiveness is accepting that it happened and moving on, which I did. There was an awkwardness seeing him, but I had an "oh well" attitude about it. There was plenty going on, other people, no need to talk to him at all.
I had asked for an apology way back when, and I was still angry. He didn't want to give it. Now that I am officially moved on, accepted it happened, come to peace with it, have no bad feelings towards him.... Now he is ready.
Yeah, I have an issue with that. I don't think that at all makes me bitter or unforgiving. I think that is a completely acceptable way to feel. And it doesn't mean that I haven't forgiven. I had completely accepted and made peace with the fact that I would never get that apology....so for him to give it only after I have put in all the work... Pointless.
I believe there is such a thing as too late for an apology for an offense. At that point, they are either:
1) clearing their own conscience. Its about them.
2) they believe they are setting you free. (as if I didn't make the decision to move on and my level of well-being is dependent on what you do/don't do... Even years later. Really? You think you have that much power over me?)
So yes. I believe there is a time expiration where it really doesn't matter. I think it only matters if you can see they are still in turmoil or something. Then yes, you can do something to heal them. But to bother with it after you see they have moved on? Tacky. Its just about you, in some way at that point.
As for directness of posters, no.. hey highlight certain sentences and twist those around, writing 3000 word responses to those, while conveniently ignoring other very valid points. Like him only apologizing because we were in the same place. That is a huge point and makes a world of difference here. But they don't see that. No hey just take one random sentence out of context and milk it for all its (barely) worth to suggest something not-so-nice about me. But its "just their opinion"...
MSPlove,
Just like it took him 3 years to get the guts to finally apologise to you,
You can take as long as YOU want, the person who was wronged in the first
place to forgive him, or NOT forgive him.
It's all up to you.
You owe him nothing.
That's just the way it is.
Don't listen to anyone else either about their opinion on the subject.
How did they even know? Did you tell them?
Sooner or later you will stop harboring ill will towards this person, and
forget the past.
By forgiving him, in reality, you are releasing the control that situation had
in your life. You will see.
Ignore everyone else with their opinions.
It's easy for other people to make judgments about situations they have
never been in.
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