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Idelwile just did. The incidence of disease from unpasteurized milk is more than "statistically significant", e.g. it doesn't just happen by chance and it's not a rare occurrence.
I'd say 2500 cases 200 of which resulting in hospitalization over 13 years is not really all that significant if you consider it's out of 9 million people. But to each his own i imagine.
I'd say 2500 cases 200 of which resulting in hospitalization over 13 years is not really all that significant if you consider it's out of 9 million people. But to each his own i imagine.
Your epidemiology degree is from where, you say? 10% of cases requiring hospitalization is a LOT! Where did you get that 9 million number what does it mean? Do you know what any of these numbers mean? And no, it's not "to each his own". If you had an epi degree, or even any background whatsoever in food safety, you'd know that there are specific thresholds for different diseases.
o.O = And why don't you enlighten me on what i don't know then .
Ah, my favorite topic. Managing risk, and how perception affects the choices we make.
We know that 'raw' milk is statistically more likely to cause illness than pasteurized. This is not a debate- it's a simple fact. Now, you may find that the risk is worth the benefits- but there doesn't seem to BE any benefits to drinking raw. There are supposed benefits, but none that have been actually verified and proven. So you are taking a higher risk for no proven pay off.
But raw milk SOUNDS healthier and if you believe that there are health benefits, the lack of proof won't sway you. That's a perception issue.
On the flip side, vaccinations have well proven benefits. There is also a risk factor because some children do experience allergic reactions. So here there are benefits to be weighed against the risks. The risk of a child contracting a disease that could be prevented is greater than the risk of a child having a vaccine reaction. There's also herd immunity to consider and the risk vs. benefits of society at large.
Now, I'm not saying whether vaccination is right or wrong and I'm not saying you are either....I don't know your thoughts on it, and this isn't that debate. What I am saying is that there is real data available to base decisions on. People who make a choice based on a belief instead of facts have a perception issue. Sometimes it doesn't matter- if say, you perceive that red cars are more dangerous than blue, you buy a blue car and no one cares. But most of the time it can matter a great deal, like when your child falls ill because of a food borne illness.
What the others are saying is that data has real meaning and shouldn't be dismissed in favor of a belief. Your family may drink raw milk and never become ill...that doesn't change the fact that statistically it is more likely to cause illness. So every time you choose it over pasteurized, you're making the choice of greater risk. If it were me, I would want real, proven benefits to offset that risk.
Your epidemiology degree is from where, you say? 10% of cases requiring hospitalization is a LOT! Where did you get that 9 million number what does it mean? Do you know what any of these numbers mean? And no, it's not "to each his own". If you had an epi degree, or even any background whatsoever in food safety, you'd know that there are specific thresholds for different diseases.
I seriously doubt there are 9 million people in the US consuming raw milk.
I'd be curious to know how many of these raw milk supporters who choose raw because it is more "natural" also only eat raw vegetables, shun milled wheat, etc.
I think it's one thing for an adult to knowingly and willingly take on the risks with raw milk. But I do have a tough time with parents who choose that for their young children, especially given that it's kids who form the majority of people with reported raw milk-related illnesses and hospitalizations.
I really don't know of any evidence-based reason to drink unpasteurized milk.
Anyway, to answer the OP (however many pages back that was), I imagine it would have the same effect on a baby's digestive system as pasteurized milk, since the components that cause milk sensitivity or intolerance are still in it,.
Quote:
Originally Posted by uptown_urbanist
I'd be curious to know how many of these raw milk supporters who choose raw because it is more "natural" also only eat raw vegetables, shun milled wheat, etc.
If they truly wanted to be "natural", they would be skipping the cow milk completely and drinking human milk.
A few years ago, a Todd County dairy farmer made the St Cloud Times (MN ) headlines.
He was delivering raw milk to his customers in Sauk Rapids every week.
The state of MN ordered him to stop.
( In Minnesota , a farmer can sell raw milk but only to customers own use and each customer must pick up only their milk and pick it up at the farm )
The Times interviewed raw milk customers and they were furious. They used many of the same arguements raw milk advocates use who post here.
" nutritous"..........."flavor"......." health benefits"
Some women were college grads and mentioned that (as if it meant they had any common sense )
Later, the state gave the reason they were so upset with this farmer from 50 miles away.
His farm had failed state inspections and his milk was so bad that the high bacteria counts were illegal. No processing plant would accept that....slop...he was producing on his farm anymore !
The state had pulled his permit to sell milk so he was out of business.
He then realized if only he could find people gullible enough to buy his milk, he could still make money.
He found them...................raw milk advocates..........in Sauk Rapids MN
It was a good "gig" while it lasted ( selling milk that no processor wanted to gullible folks at a higher price than he used to recieve.
PT Barnum used to say...." there is a sucker born every minute "
I'd say 2500 cases 200 of which resulting in hospitalization over 13 years is not really all that significant if you consider it's out of 9 million people. But to each his own i imagine.
Any risk you can avoid is a boon to your later years--it is not worth it if you are the insignificant percent getting the disease. Not worth the risk.
A few years ago, a Todd County dairy farmer made the St Cloud Times (MN ) headlines.
He was delivering raw milk to his customers in Sauk Rapids every week.
The state of MN ordered him to stop.
( In Minnesota , a farmer can sell raw milk but only to customers own use and each customer must pick up only their milk and pick it up at the farm )
The Times interviewed raw milk customers and they were furious. They used many of the same arguements raw milk advocates use who post here.
" nutritous"..........."flavor"......." health benefits"
Some women were college grads and mentioned that (as if it meant they had any common sense )
Later, the state gave the reason they were so upset with this farmer from 50 miles away.
His farm had failed state inspections and his milk was so bad that the high bacteria counts were illegal. No processing plant would accept that....slop...he was producing on his farm anymore !
The state had pulled his permit to sell milk so he was out of business.
He then realized if only he could find people gullible enough to buy his milk, he could still make money.
He found them...................raw milk advocates..........in Sauk Rapids MN
It was a good "gig" while it lasted ( selling milk that no processor wanted to gullible folks at a higher price than he used to recieve.
PT Barnum used to say...." there is a sucker born every minute "
For what it's worth, I've seen even some of the people who strongly advice against raw milk claim that it DOES taste better. It's been years since I've had raw milk (and then just a few times at that) so I have no relevant personal experience there. It very well could taste better. I also personally think that adults should be able to choose to drink raw milk if they want to; they're adults and can weigh the pros and cons for themselves. I don't think that's the issue here. And illegal raw milk sellers aren't the issue here, either. What's more relevant is whether or not it's a good idea to serve raw milk -- from licensed, legal dairies in states where it is allowed -- to kids. For me, it would take a lot of good, hard evidence to show that there were health benefits that outweighed the risks (which so far the science does not show).
Of course I have considered taking iron, and vit d and thyroid medication. I have been on various forms and dosage for the almost 7 years now. People think that "fixing" (no such thing) thyroid issues is as simple as taking a pill. Well, it isn't.
I have see a nurse practitioner and an internal specialist every 6-8wks. I also have a cardiologist and my PCM is an MD. I don't know why you think that no physician would give ok for raw milk
I am quite aware of WHY their is controversy over raw milk, but I don't understand why as in people shouldn't be concerned with what others want for themselves. It isn't like people are forcing others to drink raw milk if they don't want to.
My husband is well aware of the pros and cons of raw vs. pasteurized. He grew up in BFE South Dakota- his best friends family owned their own dairy farm. He grew up drinking raw milk and pasteurized. He is fine with drinking either
Bacteria can grow every where. Once again, I worked in Quality Control- I performed microbiological testing - I am quite aware of how bacteria forms.
Good to know that all of you here though are eating 100% non-chemical, preservative,bacteria free foods that you grown in your own non-chemical gardens though
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359
Is your physician an MD? Or is he/she a naturopath or an herbalist? I ask because I have trouble with the notion that a licensed medical doctor would seriously recommend that someone feed their children unpasteurized milk.
Has your physician suggested medication for thyroid problems?
Have you considered taking an iron supplement which can be purchased cheaply at most pharmacies?
If it upsets you that people are criticizing your choice for your family than my question is who started this whole thing? Who is the author of a post asking everyone if they have switched their kids over to raw milk? When you wrote this post did you only think you'd hear from the minority of people who are "pro raw milk?
You say your "family is on board". Have you presented the other side of this "choice" to them? Are they aware they are 150 X more likely to become sick from milk that is unpasteurized vs. pasteurized?
Unpasteurized milk is a health hazard not only because of the problem of bacteria getting into the milk from cow manure and such, but because milk itself is virtually and ideal place for bacteria to thrive. Stop and think about it. Its full of nutrients, sugars, and fats. It would be hard to artificially construct a medium more suited for bacteria to grow.
You may choose not to answer these questions. I do hope that you and others will think about them. You're taking a bigger health risk than you realize. It disturbs me when anyone places young children in danger and they don't have to do so.
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And why don't you enlighten me on what i don't know then 
.
Seriously
