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I don't get that first link. 51.5% of what? That's the ultimate tax cap I think.
An opinion piece yes, and a very poor one. Now a AA+ credit rating, and we are supposed to collapse in 5 years. Ok, whatever.
Above all, I think the baby box is a nice gesture from the government, and it's supposed to be handed out to both millionaires and poor people, that's the whole point. And so what? The realities are what they are, and I don't see the point in arguing, as in these issues there's colossal cultural differences between an average European and American.
But saying that the "normal" tax rate in Finland is 52% or we are collapsing in five years because we have a welfare state is just false and a lie. That's all I'm saying.
Yes, I think 51.5% is the highest tax, not the average. It's still staggering.
Your national pride is understandable, and laudable. But what works for one country doesn't mean it would work in another. Your economy HAS caused your country to be financially downgraded, and the generous welfare system cannot be sustained. We have far greater causes to spend money on in the US than giving every new baby a boxful of identical clothing. Aging and dangerous infrastructure comes to mind.
Yes, I think 51.5% is the highest tax, not the average. It's still staggering.
Your national pride is understandable, and laudable. But what works for one country doesn't mean it would work in another. Your economy HAS caused your country to be financially downgraded, and the generous welfare system cannot be sustained. We have far greater causes to spend money on in the US than giving every new baby a boxful of identical clothing. Aging and dangerous infrastructure comes to mind.
I think its a bit disingenuous to snark about a program that increases the health of mothers and babies.
A generous welfare system can be sustained and several countries have proved it to be so. America is really one of the last country's that should be telling others how to run their economies. LOL
All types of programs? Yeah...there are some programs in some areas...it varies greatly and many women in poverty don't even know what is out there....or if they have to travel to get to such places simply can't get to these "programs".
The US has one of the highest infant mortality rates....what does that tell you about how successful the current "programs" are?
How would a box help any of this?
If a woman doesn't know whats out there, who's fault is that? How hard is it to make a phone call to the local social services office to ask a few questions?
I'm a big city girl. All services are accessible by public transportation. If someone lives in a rural area, I'm sure they already have modes of transportation to get them to errands, food, shopping, etc. It's also a part of personal life management to live in an area that meets your personal needs. Prenatal and all.
So, what else can be done? I grew up in a poor family that used Medicaid. I know people that used WIC. Free clinic are available.
If a woman doesn't know whats out there, who's fault is that? How hard is it to make a phone call to the local social services office to ask a few questions?
I'm a big city girl. All services are accessible by public transportation. If someone lives in a rural area, I'm sure they already have modes of transportation to get them to errands, food, shopping, etc. It's also a part of personal life management to live in an area that meets your personal needs. Prenatal and all.
So, what else can be done? I grew up in a poor family that used Medicaid. I know people that used WIC. Free clinic are available.
You don't know much about rural living and just how fair away services can be when you don't own a car...even if you live in a small town and can get to a store. I have a friend that lives in rural Kansas...the have a Dollar General in their very small town.... the county seat is 50 miles.....the nearest grocery 25. They have one car for a family of 4 and that's needed so the hubby can go to work. It's hard finding someone to give you a lift 50 miles one way on a regular basis. There are no buses. There are no free clinics.
You can't compare being a "big city girl" to being born and raised in a rural environment.
If a woman doesn't know whats out there, who's fault is that? How hard is it to make a phone call to the local social services office to ask a few questions?
I'm a big city girl. All services are accessible by public transportation. If someone lives in a rural area, I'm sure they already have modes of transportation to get them to errands, food, shopping, etc. It's also a part of personal life management to live in an area that meets your personal needs. Prenatal and all.
So, what else can be done? I grew up in a poor family that used Medicaid. I know people that used WIC. Free clinic are available.
So you don't understand how someone can't possibly know about social services? How would one know about social services if one has never used them?
You have very little understanding about how transportation works in rural areas and even in smaller urban areas.
Count yourself lucky. Volunteer with the poor. Understand what their challenges and needs are. Come back here and report.
If the goal is to lower infant mortality due to co-sleeping accidents it wouldn't cost much to give people a box. Heck, my mom put me in a laundry basket and told me if I didn't have the crib up in time for my birth to take a drawer out of the dresser and use that. I got the crib up btw.
The clothes won't save babies lives, that's a big part of the cost right there. A box won't set anyone back $200. And I'm guessing a the prenatal education and/or instructions from a nurse would go a long way too, box or not.
The biggest issue is that co-sleeping isn't done these days just because someone is poor and/or doesn't know better. It's a LIFESTYLE that very educated and rich people choose to do as well.
My parents put me in a dresser drawer. I'd guess they figured out a place to put the socks and whatnot for a few months. Necessity is the mother of invention.
Lots of families did this. My father was from a farm family of 9 kids & he remembered his younger siblings in the dresser drawer (taken out of the dresser, of course).
I need to spread some reputation around... Look at the prison industry this country support...people don't mind paying taxes for THAT...
Imagine how many more people could get health care if the US wasn't spending all that money to keep one percent of its population in jail.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpollen
I can imagine many low income people here snubbing their noses at the idea of a box for a baby ("they think poor babies belong in boxes!!!").
This is actually not very different from what poor people in America did in the olden days: USE A DRESSER DRAWER AS A BABY BED. It's a built-in box that you can push in during the daytime. You have to be careful the baby's not in it, when you push it in.
Small countries can do things that big countries, or America, can't. We have too many poor people having too many babies to fund something like that. There are more life critical needs first....like food and a place to live.
Churches and charities often provide gifts to poor babies.
If you have lots of poor people, you also have lots of rich people to support them. If you have a higher percentage of poor people than average, and you're not managing to meet their needs forfood and housing then don't you think that's an indication of a fundamentally flawed country which needs fixing ASAP. Maybe you could learn from Finland?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattie
Yes, I think 51.5% is the highest tax, not the average. It's still staggering.
Your national pride is understandable, and laudable. But what works for one country doesn't mean it would work in another. Your economy HAS caused your country to be financially downgraded, and the generous welfare system cannot be sustained. We have far greater causes to spend money on in the US than giving every new baby a boxful of identical clothing. Aging and dangerous infrastructure comes to mind.
Again, fundamentally flawed country. Not something to be proud of.
The difference here is that there's no will to help people in the US. Look at all the comments here about how people would hate to be considered poor, as if money makes you a bad person. Finnish (and many other countries') people don't consider income as a character trait, and this box reflects that. Try emulating that!
Fascinating article, and a really great ideal! In the US we have approximately twice the infant Mortality rate that Finland does....Just imagine if we gave this a try!
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I got the crib up btw.
Look at the prison industry this country support...people don't mind paying taxes for THAT...
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