Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
First let me say that I've always found myself to be pretty knowledgeable in Politics and have always been a history buff.
I have observed this debate on America's Debt crisis for some time now. As you know it has really ramped up since the Tea Party Movement/Obama election.
I have a lot of Conservative/Republican friends I talk to, I watch primarily Fox News, I also see so much of this Debt Crisis talk in this forum.
Everyone is screaming the sky is falling, America is bankrupt, America is going to blow-up and we will turn into Greece (or insert any 3rd world country) because of Obama's spending.
I have really taken an honest objective look at this debt problem (and history of America's debt) and I am still trying to figure out what in the heck is all the fuss about?
For example I have researched and pulled up articles on exactly how bad the debt problem is. Every article I've read talks about how much we're in debt and also does the America is doomed rhetoric. But NO ONE explains exactly how it could or would happen.
Again I don't want to get into a partisan debate, I really want someone who feels that this problem will destroy America. Please Explain to me how!
In my obvious unaware point of view I'd like to make a few points on some of the main talking points
1) America's debt problem will cause higher taxes
How can this be true? When America had NO debt or very little, taxes were much higher in the last generation. Historically, taxes have not went up as America's debt rose. So why would the taxes magically increase because of America's debt all of a sudden?
The way I see it our taxes and America's debt have no relation to each other. 2) Our children and grandchildren will have to pay America's debt (through taxes)
This is sort of an extension of my first point on how taxes and the debt have nothing to do with each other. Because our children and grandchildren will be paying taxes REGARDLESS of America's debt. Everyone since taxes has been introduced have to pay taxes. So why am I supposed to care that my children's taxes will go to pay down the debt?
What different does it make if a % of their taxes go to the debt or if it goes to something else?
Its the same amount of money that they will be paying. Again why do I care where the money will be going, its still coming out of their checks! 3) America's Economy/Jobs will suffer as the debt rises. The U.S. Dollar will diminish. Inflation. Bread will cost $20 bucks a loaf.
This is one I REALLY do not get. HOW is this possible? I always look at how something could happen by looking at our history and what has/hasn't happened.
And historically we've have great economic times and bad economic times. And good/bad economic times (unemployment, GDP growth or loss, stock market) has never been caused or reflected by how much debt America is in?
Explain to me why in the heck would Wal-mart or Apple care about how much debt America is in when they are hiring or looking at their profit margins?
How can a free-market society be affected by how much Uncle Sam owes? I honestly don't get it! 4) America will go bankrupt, utter chaos in the streets!
Again I really do not understand how this could possibly happen. Uncle Sam gets its money from the taxpayer. So as long as everyone is paying taxes, how in the heck could America go completely broke? The U.S. gets nearly 3 trillion dollar a year in taxes.
Even if we owe 14 trillion or 30 trillion dollars, that money isn't due RIGHT NOW! We have payments, just like mortgage payments.
That's like saying that a person with a 5 million dollar home but they make 1 million dollars a year is broke! How? As long as they can afford the payments and they are still making 1 million bucks a year. How is this person broke?
I am really trying to understand. 5) China (insert name of another country) owns us!
How is this true? Yes foreign debt is relatively high. But the U.S. Government owes far more money (through Treasury bonds, etc.) to Americans/ American companies than we do to foreign countries! America's hold way more Government debt than China/Japan. So how does that translate into China owns us?
Please educate me on that.
Even if the WORSE possible scenario happen and America defaults on the debt to other nations. Whats going to happen? Why would this be Armageddon? They're going to go to war with us, what are they going to do? Nations throughout history have defaulted/not repaid back foreign debt, they are still alive.
I'm seriously trying to understand why would America be doomed if China decides to not loan us any more money? OR if we didn't pay them back?
Why would this be the end of our existence?
Again lets say the worse case scenario happens. Foreign countries no longer loans us money. What would we do? The way I see it we would HAVE to do what everyone is screaming for US to do now, which is CUT SPENDING. If for some reason the U.S. COULD only operate on it 3-4 trillion dollars in income. OK well cut spending. And we'd be fine. That's in the very worst case scenario the way I see it. That the U.S. Government would be force to Cut spending. But still thats FAR from utter destruction, Thats far from ARMAGEDDON!
Again I am not trying to be partisan here. I really would like to be informed on why this is the #1 problem in America right now. Fear tactics and rhetoric aside, please indicate or inform those of us who are not getting it.
**I will make this last point, in no way am I not saying paying down the debt is NOT good or smart. It is. But again I'm trying to honestly and objectively understand exactly how America will be destroyed by this**
First let me say that I've always found myself to be pretty knowledgeable in Politics and have always been a history buff.
I have observed this debate on America's Debt crisis for some time now. As you know it has really ramped up since the Tea Party Movement/Obama election.
I have a lot of Conservative/Republican friends I talk to, I watch primarily Fox News, I also see so much of this Debt Crisis talk in this forum.
Everyone is screaming the sky is falling, America is bankrupt, America is going to blow-up and we will turn into Greece (or insert any 3rd world country) because of Obama's spending.
I have really taken an honest objective look at this debt problem (and history of America's debt) and I am still trying to figure out what in the heck is all the fuss about?
For example I have researched and pulled up articles on exactly how bad the debt problem is. Every article I've read talks about how much we're in debt and also does the America is doomed rhetoric. But NO ONE explains exactly how it could or would happen.
Again I don't want to get into a partisan debate, I really want someone who feels that this problem will destroy America. Please Explain to me how!
In my obvious unaware point of view I'd like to make a few points on some of the main talking points
1) America's debt problem will cause higher taxes
How can this be true? When America had NO debt or very little, taxes were much higher in the last generation. Historically, taxes have not went up as America's debt rose. So why would the taxes magically increase because of America's debt all of a sudden?
The way I see it our taxes and America's debt have no relation to each other. 2) Our children and grandchildren will have to pay America's debt (through taxes)
This is sort of an extension of my first point on how taxes and the debt have nothing to do with each other. Because our children and grandchildren will be paying taxes REGARDLESS of America's debt. Everyone since taxes has been introduced have to pay taxes. So why am I supposed to care that my children's taxes will go to pay down the debt?
What different does it make if a % of their taxes go to the debt or if it goes to something else?
Its the same amount of money that they will be paying. Again why do I care where the money will be going, its still coming out of their checks! 3) America's Economy/Jobs will suffer as the debt rises. The U.S. Dollar will diminish. Inflation. Bread will cost $20 bucks a loaf.
This is one I REALLY do not get. HOW is this possible? I always look at how something could happen by looking at our history and what has/hasn't happened.
And historically we've have great economic times and bad economic times. And good/bad economic times (unemployment, GDP growth or loss, stock market) has never been caused or reflected by how much debt America is in?
Explain to me why in the heck would Wal-mart or Apple care about how much debt America is in when they are hiring or looking at their profit margins?
How can a free-market society be affected by how much Uncle Sam owes? I honestly don't get it! 4) America will go bankrupt, utter chaos in the streets!
Again I really do not understand how this could possibly happen. Uncle Sam gets its money from the taxpayer. So as long as everyone is paying taxes, how in the heck could America go completely broke? The U.S. gets nearly 3 trillion dollar a year in taxes.
Even if we owe 14 trillion or 30 trillion dollars, that money isn't due RIGHT NOW! We have payments, just like mortgage payments.
That's like saying that a person with a 5 million dollar home but they make 1 million dollars a year is broke! How? As long as they can afford the payments and they are still making 1 million bucks a year. How is this person broke?
I am really trying to understand. 5) China (insert name of another country) owns us!
How is this true? Yes foreign debt is relatively high. But the U.S. Government owes far more money (through Treasury bonds, etc.) to Americans/ American companies than we do to foreign countries! America's hold way more Government debt than China/Japan. So how does that translate into China owns us?
Please educate me on that.
Even if the WORSE possible scenario happen and America defaults on the debt to other nations. Whats going to happen? Why would this be Armageddon? They're going to go to war with us, what are they going to do? Nations throughout history have defaulted/not repaid back foreign debt, they are still alive.
I'm seriously trying to understand why would America be doomed if China decides to not loan us any more money? OR if we didn't pay them back?
Why would this be the end of our existence?
Again I am not trying to be partisan here. I really would like to be informed on why this is the #1 problem in America right now. Fear tactics and rhetoric aside, please indicate or inform those of us who are not getting it.
Simple answer, we can't continue to spend more than wee take in. Sooner or later, we will default.
Simple answer, we can't continue to spend more than wee take in. Sooner or later, we will default.
And defaulting means an IMF rescue. And we know what's happened to every country that had to bring in the IMF they are the reason why the 3rd World is still the 3rd World
Well it is like someone who had not learn a lesson to credit cards i call it the trap. They barely make enough to make ends meat, however they continue to charge it up, charge charge charge, but only pay the min balance. Not too good. They are spending up a storm on their credit cards, but sitll making the same amount of money, they are spending more then they can handle.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
they are the reason why the 3rd World is still the 3rd World
