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This didn't happen in San Francisco - it was in Alameda, CA, which is an island.
My stomach churns as I read a story like this - a disturbed man WALKS into the surf (takes him about an hour to get out to neck deep) while he keeps looking back to shore - they call 911 for help.
Police, Fire Department, Coast Guard, ambulance crews ALL just stand around and discuss how "they can't do anything" (NOT my job), watching this man drown while his feet are still planted on a sandy bottom. A crowd of about 75 people stood and watched this man drown - in an island community. I can't even wrap my head around something like that.
In 2009 - Budget constraints caused the City of Alameda to do some cut-backs in funding ...... the salary/pension benefits of Union employees (80% of the city budget) were just too much to handle ..... the Fire Department has 'trained' water rescue, has boats ...... but they now don't use them (what do you want to bet that it went in the Union Contract that they would not go into the water). Boats are still tied up at the City docks and one has to supposed that all the 'trained' water rescue folks have forgotten how to swim/rescue in the last 18 months AND that there are NO Union Fire/Police personnel that have any idea how to either swim or walk across the sand to rescue a citizen who was standing on a sandy bottom with his head barely above water.
75 people (mostly citizens) stood waiting for either the Police, Fire Department or Coast Guard (who also has nobody who can swim) watched this man drown. A citizen finally waded out and brought in the dead body when it was clear that no official was willing to do anything at all.
I can't help but wonder how all of them are able to sleep now ....... but not to worry ...... according to the OP of this thread - it's the fault of some strange group called The Tea Party.
Well done California - this country may be way beyond any repair when we read a story like this. It looks like there is no such thing as 'public service' from those we have all counted on - they are for themselves and it's worth noting that the rest of us should pay attention to that.
On the up-side - the Alameda Fire Department Union is in negotiations for another contract with wage/benefits increases in spite of a City that is on the verge of bankruptcy (while they are bringing suits against the City of Alameda to fight paying any of their benefits).
Is this a great country or what? Time to wake up folks, could have been a kid in trouble - wouldn't have made a bit of difference. These clowns would stand a watch - "not my job".
thats the moral part of the story i brought up.
is it wrong that 75 onlookers and capable emergency service providers did nothing and let him die, or did he deserve his fate by putting him in that situation to begin with.
I responded to a post that said: "This happened in SF" which is simply not true, why should I believe anything else in the post ?
Because you can read the article. I am merely pointing out for those not familiar with the area that Alameda is a jump, skip, hop away from SF. It's not like the same culture doesn't exist there. I worked in SF and lived in the East Bay and, trust me, Alameda isn't different at all from SF. Same people, same commute to the city (well by those commuting from Alameda). Now talk to me about Marin and I'll have a different opinion or even the south bay.
Or perhaps due to corporate greed supported by conservatives he had LOST his job (think outsourcing) and was homeless and despondent and felt he had no choice but to do himself in.
If you want to know who sold us out to red commie china it was Bill Clinton, who is still laughing all the way to the bank. Nice try though.
If you want to know who sold us out to red commie china it was Bill Clinton, who is still laughing all the way to the bank. Nice try though.
I'm not trying to turn this into something political, but was responding to someone who was.
Like I said, this guy could have well been broke, homeless, jobless and his last act was to see if ANYONE would care enough to give a damn about his life. No one did.
I'm not trying to turn this into something political, but was responding to someone who was.
Like I said, this guy could have well been broke, homeless, jobless and his last act was to see if ANYONE would care enough to give a damn about his life. No one did.
Well you lived there or near there. Why were no private boats available.
Once in CT the cops came to me to see if I knew the guy across the street. I did. They told me he called in to report his own demise. That upset me. The Cops asked if i was willing to go talk. I said I was.
I went over there the cops followed, I say the guy he had a shot gun, I asked if we could talk. He siad ok. I asked if he was willing to put the gun down a while and he did. Then I hit him so hard I almost broke my hand, and knocked him cold.
I dumped the shells out of the shot gun then broke it in 1/2. The cops called from the door, asking if everything was ok and I told em comon in.
They cuffed the guy, took him somehwere and 3 days later he was back and just as upset. The social workers did what they got paid for and quite when it was time to go home.
My life was upside down then too, and I moved again far away, as I was there for work only and it got done. Later the guy succeeded in killing himself.
So you know this place and why no other boats came out. The cops have no responcibility to stop these things until after the fact, where a crime has been commited.
The story on line doesn't give enough info to determine much.
But the Tea Party having anything to do with this is simply a wacho liberal nut case story. The Tea Party doesn't get to set up local funding anywhere.
Local swimming here often takes place in water around 54 degrees too. I don't buy that.
I have gone in water at below freezing, can't say I liked it, but some people can function long enough to get out.
I will give you no one cares much about others. I stop to help much of the time if i think I can. I have been downed before and it's real hard getting any for me.
So hard I lived in the forest for 3 straight years crippled from a industrail accident, lost that job, lost my house, lost my son a while and got divorced. My X wanted me for money and nothing but money.
Well you lived there or near there. Why were no private boats available.
Once in CT the cops came to me to see if I knew the guy across the street. I did. They told me he called in to report his own demise. That upset me. The Cops asked if i was willing to go talk. I said I was.
I went over there the cops followed, I say the guy he had a shot gun, I asked if we could talk. He siad ok. I asked if he was willing to put the gun down a while and he did. Then I hit him so hard I almost broke my hand, and knocked him cold.
I dumped the shells out of the shot gun then broke it in 1/2. The cops called from the door, asking if everything was ok and I told em comon in.
They cuffed the guy, took him somehwere and 3 days later he was back and just as upset. The social workers did what they got paid for and quite when it was time to go home.
My life was upside down then too, and I moved again far away, as I was there for work only and it got done. Later the guy succeeded in killing himself.
So you know this place and why no other boats came out. The cops have no responcibility to stop these things until after the fact, where a crime has been commited.
The story on line doesn't give enough info to determine much.
But the Tea Party having anything to do with this is simply a wacho liberal nut case story. The Tea Party doesn't get to set up local funding anywhere.
Local swimming here often takes place in water around 54 degrees too. I don't buy that.
I have gone in water at below freezing, can't say I liked it, but some people can function long enough to get out.
I will give you no one cares much about others. I stop to help much of the time if i think I can. I have been downed before and it's real hard getting any for me.
So hard I lived in the forest for 3 straight years crippled from a industrail accident, lost that job, lost my house, lost my son a while and got divorced. My X wanted me for money and nothing but money.
I don't think this has anything to do with the Tea Party but I also don't think just anyone could have hopped on their boat to save him. The article says it was in shallow water. Certainly in the Bay there are strong undercurrents, but still...
People trained in this stuff (like lifeguards) know how to navigate the undercurrents (although I must say the Bay is mighty fierce) but I do think the average boater could not have gotten to him without risking their own boat. I can't believe that someone did not have the guts to just wade out to him in a wet suit and talk him down from that ledge.
The artical says he was neck deep. I used to dig clams as a kid, and could drive a small wooden boat with a outboard into water about knee deep. I don't buy no one had access to a shallow draft boat either. Yeah the Coasties couldn't get a ship in there, but they have speed boat rafts. They take less water than the boats i had as a wee lad. There should be tons of water patroll in Cal I would think too. i don't buy that water was too shallow for a boat with a 50 horse outboard on it.
But you lived near there. Don't you see small craft?
is it wrong that 75 onlookers and capable emergency service providers did nothing and let him die, or did he deserve his fate by putting him in that situation to begin with.
i lean towards blaming the dead guy.
im torn on it though.
My point is that not only an estimate of 75 people stood and watched a man drown, those people expected (and had a right to expect) that 'public servants' - Police/Fire Department/Coast Guard (that we pay Millions of dollar to) would DO something, but they ALL in the end decided "it's not my job".
It says a lot about what this country has become. We are now in an "everyone for himself" culture and fault lies with the dead guy. How big a jump is it to get to a bank robbery where the police decide "this is too dangerous for me" and "those folks in the bank should have known better than to be in the bank" ..... Not my job.
Is an attempted suicide or even a 'cry for help/exhibition' now a spectator sport? I guess so in Alameda, CA - probably the same in cities around this nation.
Has anyone noticed? Teachers/Fire Fighters/Police used to be some of the most respected members of any community ...... this is "changing", the members of those groups had better wake up and do something about that before it's too late. The membership is really the only one that can "fix" this.
The artical says he was neck deep. I used to dig clams as a kid, and could drive a small wooden boat with a outboard into water about knee deep. I don't buy no one had access to a shallow draft boat either. Yeah the Coasties couldn't get a ship in there, but they have speed boat rafts. They take less water than the boats i had as a wee lad. There should be tons of water patroll in Cal I would think too. i don't buy that water was too shallow for a boat with a 50 horse outboard on it.
But you lived near there. Don't you see small craft?
Nope, I never did in the Bay. But I do agree with you that certainly some sort of even life boat could have been sent out, even in choppy waters to get the guy.
The smallest craft you'd ever see on the Bay would be a sailboat, and I don't think a sailboat would be seaworthy in five foot waters? But clearly you know more about this than me. I am just recounting my experience living there.
The easy thing for the victim to do would have been to not go into the water...
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