NY Times Liberal readers are Downright Giddy: Slump Alters Jobless Map in U.S., With South Hit Hard (unemployment rate, wages)

[EdwardA]

I guess the comments are a natural outgrowth of these hyper partisan times but it's still unsettling reading so much hate directed towards a section of our country.

Conservatives are guilty of this as well when they attack California, New York and other blue states.

Article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/27/us...nomic-map.html
[quote]
The once-booming South, which entered the recession with the lowest unemployment rate in the nation, is now struggling with some of the highest rates, recent data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics show.
Several Southern states — including South Carolina, whose 11.1 percent unemployment rate is the fourth highest in the nation — have higher unemployment rates than they did a year ago.

[MrRational]

The main issue is the availability of low and lower skilled jobs that still pay enough to actually support yourself and a family on. The south USED to have these in far larger supply before the small town factories closed up and shipped offshore.

The next issue are the availability of moderately skilled and trades jobs (like construction).
These are dependent on a far healthier real estate market that the US has anywhere.

But the REAL and far more fundamental issue is in the raw number of warm bodies that need a roof over their head and food to eat and clothes to wear and schools to go to... which even for the too few who pay attention in those schools... still won't find jobs when they get out.
---

Too many people available for too few jobs that actually need doing.
And this reality exists everywhere.

[enemy country]

South Carolina is owned by red as hell tea party republicans. How can it be doing so bad? I wonder?

[crbcrbrgv]

I'm not finding any giddiness in those comments.

[Boss]

Originally Posted by MrRational

The main issue is the availability of low and lower skilled jobs that still pay enough to actually support yourself and a family on. The south USED to have these in far larger supply before the small town factories closed up and shipped offshore.

The next issue are the availability of moderately skilled and trades jobs (like construction).
These are dependent on a far healthier real estate market that the US has anywhere.

But the REAL and far more fundamental issue is in the raw number of warm bodies that need a roof over their head and food to eat and clothes to wear and schools to go to... which even for the too few who pay attention in those schools... still won't find jobs when they get out.
---

Too many people available for too few jobs that actually need doing.
And this reality exists everywhere.

Its funny that the Furn. and mill jobs that went away are slowly comming back. They are being offered at a pay rate of $9-$10 rising to $13. Thousands of people reply to these jobs. Even in NC you cannot live on $400 a week. Families will still be able to keep there EBT. It reminds me of the early 1930'S

[doc1]

That explains why all of those auto manufacturers are locating new plants in the northeast and upper midwest.

Take that, Southerners!!

[Savoir Faire]

Originally Posted by crbcrbrgv

I'm not finding any giddiness in those comments.

perhaps the OP doesn't know the definition of giddy.

[Backspace]

Originally Posted by enemy country

South Carolina is owned by red as hell tea party republicans. How can it be doing so bad? I wonder?

Because it's filled with low education and no work ethic, caged blue voters.

[padcrasher]

Originally Posted by Boss

Its funny that the Furn. and mill jobs that went away are slowly comming back. They are being offered at a pay rate of $9-$10 rising to $13. Thousands of people reply to these jobs. Even in NC you cannot live on $400 a week. Families will still be able to keep there EBT. It reminds me of the early 1930'S

Sad. I made $9 an hour during the Summer break in the mid 1980s running telephone lines in office buildings. It was a horrible low paying job then. You know what $9 is worth today adjusted for inflation since 1985. $4.42 cents. That same job today would be need to pay $18.50 per hour. If you have no perspective on how things suck..you'll settle for anything. The USA will look like these ghettos in Brazil before people wake up to this right wing propaganda they've been spoon fed for 30 years.

[CK78]

Originally Posted by padcrasher

Sad. I made $9 an hour during the Summer break in the mid 1980s running telephone lines in office buildings. It was a horrible low paying job then. You know what $9 is worth today adjusted for inflation since 1985. $4.42 cents. That same job today would be need to pay $18.50 per hour. If you have no perspective on how things suck..you'll settle for anything. The USA will look like these ghettos in Brazil before people wake up to this right wing propaganda they've been spoon fed for 30 years.

THIS!!!!!^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^+100000000

Right on padcrasher!!!!!!!!!

"You know what $9 is worth today adjusted for inflation since 1985. $4.42 cents." Maybe not even that much.

Once again this post is appropriate.

Originally Posted by wawaweewa
Just because things were better, doesn't mean they were great. I don't deny that there were folks like yourself. Nevertheless, more opportunity (on average) did exist back then.

During college I worked part time at a warehouse. One of my co workers was a Guyanese who came into the US illegally in '77 or '78 (he later received amnesty under Reagan). He used to tell me how his first job, as an illegal, paid $10.50/hour. In 2006, after he was laid off from a warehouse making 33/hour, we were working for $12/hr. $10.50 in '78 or 12 in 2006. Inflation much?

Originally Posted by workingclasshero:

it doesnt

its becoming harder to afford many things for all people

a personal example...I make about 3 times what my father made at his highest level...and it is tougher for me to make ends meet that it was for him

look at the price of a car...a midsize chevy (say the nova) in 1970 was $2200.....today a midsize chevy is 20k or more

the value of the dollar is in the toilet

Yep!!!!! And going lower. Wait till QE3 LOL!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea:

Also the wages aren't there and if you compare that with inflation it just doesn't work.

In 1980, I had an entry level job as a sound engineer with a local independent TV station earning $5.00 per hour. One paycheck paid my rent and utilities and auto insurance and the other 3 paychecks each month were disposable income.

An entry level job today pays $8.50 to $10 per hour and even at $10 per hour it takes 2 paychecks to cover the cost of rent, utilities and auto insurance (and don't forget in 1980 $10 -- or two hours of work -- paid for 2 tickets to the cinema show, a tank full of gasoline and something to eat after the movie -- the cost of two movie tickets now is over $20).

GuyNTexas says IT ALL Here!!!!

Originally Posted by GuyNTexas:

No. I'm really disagreeing with .. not missing your point. And those numbers don't tell a very accurate story, and the proof is demonstrated by the drop in net worth of middle income earners as their debt has increased significantly, while earnings have declined relative to inflation.

By most measurable data points, the middle income class has been dying a very slow, incremental death for 4 decades because the costs on high ticket items have increased more rapidly than the either the inflation rate or rates of increases in income. To further compound the problem, average income levels have failed to keep pace with the inflation rate itself. Much of this goes unnoticed because of it's slow incremental nature (like growing old). But if you are old enough, and still maintain your mental faculties, you can't be bull $hted into believing what you are trying to say here.

As just one example, in 1977, I bought a brand new Pontiac Trans Am for $5200. And since it was my first car purchase, I suspect I was clubbed like a baby seal (paid full MSRP), as I simply asked how much, and said OK (later I learned the error of this way to purchase automobiles )

Now today, that car is no longer available, but a comparable car "Chevy Camero SS" is. And a similarly configured model is around $35,000 MSRP. Which is almost double the adjusted for inflation number of $18,700 that Camero should cost relative to the $5200 Trans Am of 1977.

My income back then was 14,000 or just shy of 3 times what the car cost ... if you apply that same formula to the $35,000 Camero today, I'd have to earn roughly $100,000 per year to maintain the same standard (drive the same car) as my $14,000 income provided then. I was not wealthy then .. I was a 20 year old working in a warehouse driving a forklift. And I don't think there are many 6 figure forklift drivers around today ... I would say, the 40-50K range would be the upper limit ... or roughly the same as my $14,000 would be, adjusted for inflation.

This is one example, and almost any big item ... car, house, etc. works out to be the same. Some other items like Healthcare have dramatically exceeded those rates exponentially compared to 1977 where mine was absolutely free and first rate, including dental.

Now, add to this the higher taxes, social security withholding, and medicare ... all of which have exceeded the inflation rate (and don't let anyone BS you into believing it hasn't), means that the net spending power of your income has declined dramatically over the past 30+ years. (See video below she documents ALL this IN DETAIL)

Now around about that same time frame, my step father worked for one of the US Government agencies earning roughly in the 50-60K range, and at the time, that was very good money, but not even close to RICH & Wealthy .... but adjusted for inflation, that comes out to around $200+K now. The house he purchased then at $50,000 appraised for $480,000 in 2004-5 even though the adjusted for inflation value would have only dictated a $155,000 figure ... 3 times the inflation rate!! By the time he retired in the late 90's, his income may have doubled, yet his house increased by 6-8 fold. What does that tell you?

Now if you are following me here ... this is where it gets real hairy ... if you take a Quarter ... 25 cents ... from say 1964 (the last 90% silver Quarter) that 25 cents equates to $1.76 in 2010 value. But guess what? Today's melt value of that sliver quarter is about $3.70 which is again more than double the published inflation rate ....

So what does that all mean? It means very simply, that the value of your money is worth about half of what it's claimed to be worth, even after being adjusted for inflation .... and all it takes is to actually look at the historical costs of items like cars, and houses and health care costs from the late 60's to today, and also the median incomes. You see that the purchasing power has indeed declined. And this is a result of the devaluation of the currency (a hidden tax).

So when it comes to buying power, there has been a continuous decline that doubles the the inflation rates admitted .. which is why the middle class really doesn't exist for all practical purposes today.

There are the ultra wealthy, and the rest. The $250kers are just at the higher end of that rest of us, and they are the last of the upper middle class, and the next in line to fall ... apparently, much to delight of many who think that they are members of the Wealthy Club, and must fall for the sake of everyone.

I suppose this proves that indeed, misery loves company.








YouTube - The Coming Collapse of the Middle Class