Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Maybe you didn't notice that I said when they died..... of course it's not 2012 dollars. But the point is that they never made a lot of money, but also never spent a lot of money and their only debt EVER was a house. Almost anyone can do that today, but they don't have the self discipline to achieve it. They prefer to spend $100 per month on a smart phone than put $100 into an IRA.
Maybe you don't watch the market, so I'll offer some help. The Russell 3000 index is a very broad indicator of the stock market. In the six months prior to the 2008 crash, it was moving between about 1300 and 1400. It dropped to about 700 in 2009, but is now back around 1300. What does this mean? I means (like I said) that most people in the market have recovered their losses. In fact, if you DID NOTHING in 2009 you would now be approximately back where you were prior to the crash.
So, like I told the poster, MOST of us have recovered. He said he lost everything in the crash. That is highly unlikely, and if so, he should immediately fire his financial adviser.
People who are still saying they lost everything jumped on the sell bandwagon and sold at a loss and most likely didn't jump back in.
Because you would, everyone can?
Is that what you're saying.
Did I say "everyone can"? No. Not everyone, but almost all able bodied adults can acquire the skills needed. But nice try at changing my words.
Quote:
Then you must think that everyone has the same abilities and skills.
Is this true?
You really like to twist words, don't you. Nobody said "everyone has the same abilities and skills" nor did I even imply that they do. For example, you have an exceptional skill at twisting words that people post and developing faulty associations. Only a fool would say "everyone has the same abilities and skills." Is that what you are saying?
Nice try, but I'll stick with my original post.
Almost everyone in America can save for retirement by living within their means. Sounds like we've struck a raw nerve on this topic... you must be one of those people who spends more than they make and expects the Nanny State to take care of you.
When the 401k was introduced one of the benefits was control over your own money.
Unfortunately, we now live in a society where people have no self-discipline.
.
While no self discipline is definitely part of the problem. The other part is that people receive no financial education whatsoever in the schools or through their employers yet they are expected to do a good job managing their 401ks. That is a ridiculous proposition if there ever was one. So basically the people who are good at managing their money tend to come from families who understand how to manage money and/or they have a certain personality type. I notice the INTJ personality type is very good at saving and investing. Usually these people are engineers/computer programmers. The personal finance blogosphers is overwhelmingly dominated by engineers. They come by this stuff naturally. The rest of the populace simply doesn't, although a lot of that problem could be fixed with education.
You can generalize all you like.
Let's see you get hit with open heart surgery or cancer and see what your bank account looks like.
81% of heart attacks would go away if people didn't smoke, ate better, and got some moderate exercise. Same is true for 36% of cancer....so I am a little more sympathetic to the cancer.
By the way, I am not just making those figures up. Here is the link:
While no self discipline is definitely part of the problem. The other part is that people receive no financial education whatsoever in the schools or through their employers yet they are expected to do a good job managing their 401ks. That is a ridiculous proposition if there ever was one. So basically the people who are good at managing their money tend to come from families who understand how to manage money and/or they have a certain personality type. I notice the INTJ personality type is very good at saving and investing. Usually these people are engineers/computer programmers. The personal finance blogosphers is overwhelmingly dominated by engineers. They come by this stuff naturally. The rest of the populace simply doesn't, although a lot of that problem could be fixed with education.
• More than half (52 percent) say they don’t have the time, interest or knowledge to manage their 401(k) portfolio properly. • Nearly three-quarters (73 percent) spend less than eight hours per year managing their 401(k) plan account. • Many (56 percent) do not review plan-related education materials they receive. • Nearly one-third don’t know that they pay fees for their 401(k) plan. Of the 70 percent that understand they pay some sort of fees, 95 percent don’t know about investment fund operating expenses and 67 percent don’t know about plan administration fees. • [A significant majority (83 percent) say they are interested in receiving professional investment management from their employer. However, this interest does not translate into action; Schwab data shows just one in 10 participants takes advantage of 401(k) investment management advice when it is offered.
While no self discipline is definitely part of the problem. The other part is that people receive no financial education whatsoever in the schools or through their employers yet they are expected to do a good job managing their 401ks.
I have no formal personal finance education either. But there is information out there for those who want to self-educate.
Unfortunately, most Americans would rather spend their time watching American Idol, Dancing with the Stars or some other
mindless entertainment than spend time self-educating to improve themselves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysticaltyger
So basically the people who are good at managing their money tend to come from families who understand how to manage money and/or they have a certain personality type. I notice the INTJ personality type is very good at saving and investing. Usually these people are engineers/computer programmers. The personal finance blogosphers is overwhelmingly dominated by engineers. They come by this stuff naturally. The rest of the populace simply doesn't, although a lot of that problem could be fixed with education.
INTJ - that's interesting.
My family was blue-collar and started out poor as church mice.
They did well simply by living moral, Godly lives, making good choices and living within their means.
While no self discipline is definitely part of the problem. The other part is that people receive no financial education whatsoever in the schools or through their employers yet they are expected to do a good job managing their 401ks. That is a ridiculous proposition if there ever was one.
Not quite. If you dump money every payday into a 401k and DO NOTHING you will achieve a decent savings rate. You don't have to actively manage a 401k, and I suspect that many people who try actually get worse growth rates because they chase the market.
Quote:
So basically the people who are good at managing their money tend to come from families who understand how to manage money and/or they have a certain personality type. I notice the INTJ personality type is very good at saving and investing. Usually these people are engineers/computer programmers. The personal finance blogosphers is overwhelmingly dominated by engineers. They come by this stuff naturally. The rest of the populace simply doesn't, although a lot of that problem could be fixed with education.
You don't have to have an education to live within your means. You don't need to be an engineer to understand that you should take responsibility for your personal finances. You don't have to be an IT genius to decide that you should put money in a 401k rather than buy a new car or smart phone.
I have a question to those who participate in the anti-older than you generational threads.
People have started threads whining how older generations aren't leaving their kids all of their wealth.
Where is this wealth if as the thread states, 75% of US citizens don't have more than $30k in their retirement funds.
Kind of makes the whiners look selfish and clueless at the same time.
Most of the wealth is in relatively few hands. People who save/invest a decent portion of their incomes are a minority of the population and the wealth is in their hands.
It's very interesting...for her book The Difference, Jean Chatzky hired a firm to survey 5000 households.The findings were that only about 30% of the population saves any significant portion of their incomes, which pretty much jives with the statistic that 75% of people near retirement have less than 30K saved.
Isn't it ironic that the generation that had it easier than any other generation in this nation's history, has nothing to show for it at the end. Sad....
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
