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Old 09-05-2012, 03:34 PM
 
775 posts, read 741,061 times
Reputation: 316

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
I'm being "robbed" of my property. Something our Constitution protects.
So you consider your property being "robbed" to feed starving children is a transgression on your liberties?

Because all taxes are technically robbery. If you concede the necessity of any society to have taxes at all, you give up using the "taxes = evil!" argument.

Your control over your property isn't absolute. Can I take my fully owned house and secede from the United States?

Quote:
And who are you, or anyone, to say how much is "enough". That hard working single mother (implying that the wealthy are lazy?) with 50 grand, has more than someone else does. So why can't I "take" her's and give it to them?
That someone else that has less than her is probably receiving welfare as well, although the mother clearly needs more to feed her kids (I can't believe I have to explain this to you). You still haven't explained why it is such a terrible burden on a billionaire to pay more in taxes so that people don't starve in the streets and can receive an education. Apparently, this is "slavery".

Quote:
Selfishness is not a virtue, but that is what the Left is - completely selfish. Wanting to live with poor choices (that single mother should have made better decisions with her life, perhaps?) at the expense of others.
Newsflash: studies show that most self identified liberals aren't poor themselves. In fact, liberals are by far the most educated ideological group in the United States, and tied with enterprisers as the most affluent.

Quote:
Leave my property to ME. And I will decide who I will help.
Private charity isn't enough on its own. Otherwise, the Gilded Age wouldn't have had a 40% poverty rate.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:37 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,357 posts, read 51,950,786 times
Reputation: 23786
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zyngawf View Post
And after that those that don't pay take the most. My biggest problem with this is that most of them are taking by choice rather than necessity.
Do you have sources to verify these statements? I'm not necessarily denying them, just would help to see evidence of such definitive claims.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:41 PM
 
Location: In the Redwoods
30,357 posts, read 51,950,786 times
Reputation: 23786
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal View Post
Don't you understand yet that the left believes (and falsely so) that the government can make better choices of how to spend money than can you. Furthermore, that not only does all money belong to the government; but, your private property: "you didn't build that".
Funny how the right keeps milking that last quote, when you don't even understand the meaning or context behind it... getting old, really old.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:54 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,031 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randomstudent View Post
The fact is the very wealthy really don't pay their fair share.
COMPLETELY FALSE. They pay FAR MORE than their fair share.

The low-income, on the other hand, are in fact TAKING much more than their fair share...



Furthermore, yet again, it is only the low-income who actually get more from the Social Security program than they paid in. Everyone else (including retired middle class workers) LOSES money on Social Security.
Social Security turning into a bad deal | Sandusky Register
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,286,152 times
Reputation: 11416
If you don't want to pay taxes, don't work in the US or any other country.
Be sure not to enjoy any of the support others who pay taxes provide, like roads and street lights and water and plumbing to your house, etc.

There you go.

I pay my taxes because I'm a member of the society.
I don't even live in the US and I pay income and property taxes without whining.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:00 PM
 
17,401 posts, read 11,978,162 times
Reputation: 16155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sci Fi Fan View Post
So you consider your property being "robbed" to feed starving children is a transgression on your liberties?

Because all taxes are technically robbery. If you concede the necessity of any society to have taxes at all, you give up using the "taxes = evil!" argument.

Your control over your property isn't absolute. Can I take my fully owned house and secede from the United States?

That someone else that has less than her is probably receiving welfare as well, although the mother clearly needs more to feed her kids (I can't believe I have to explain this to you). You still haven't explained why it is such a terrible burden on a billionaire to pay more in taxes so that people don't starve in the streets and can receive an education. Apparently, this is "slavery".

Newsflash: studies show that most self identified liberals aren't poor themselves. In fact, liberals are by far the most educated ideological group in the United States, and tied with enterprisers as the most affluent.

Private charity isn't enough on its own. Otherwise, the Gilded Age wouldn't have had a 40% poverty rate.
Yes, I do believe that. If my property (money, food, whatever) is taken by FORCE and given to someone else, no matter the reason, it is a transgression.

There really is no point in trying to reason with liberals. They will never understand the concept of freedom. Yes, control of my property SHOULD be absolute. But thanks to progressives, that freedom is being taken away, inch by inch.

I can't believe I have to explain that someone making less money that I, and needs to feed her kids, is clearly in need. Ever been behind someone that pays with food stamps? That has a nice shiny phone, and expensive clothing?

And quit putting words in my mouth. I never said it was burden - I said it was WRONG for a billionaire (or any citizen) to pay more. Just 'cause a liberal thinks they should.

You are illustrating my points exactly. You point to the need to help others, yet you don't think private charity alone is enough. Of course you don't, since liberals donate FAR less than conservatives. They adhere to the mantra: give to the poor, but not MY money.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:01 PM
 
17,401 posts, read 11,978,162 times
Reputation: 16155
Quote:
Originally Posted by gizmo980 View Post
Funny how the right keeps milking that last quote, when you don't even understand the meaning or context behind it... getting old, really old.
We know the meaning full well. We just don't buy the after-the-fact backpedalling - that it was taken out of context. Right....
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:04 PM
 
Location: Albuquerque, NM
13,285 posts, read 15,308,502 times
Reputation: 6658
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
liberals donate FAR less than conservatives. They adhere to the mantra: give to the poor, but not MY money.
So liberals are in favor of taxing on non-liberals? I don't understand how that would work.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:06 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,031 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sci Fi Fan View Post
You can't be serious. So if I make five hundred million dollars every year and have to pay three times as much as you, a working class citizen, and some of my money goes to feeding starving children, I'm "enslaved" now?
Your example is WAY off.

Given, one person earning $3,000,000 per year and another earning $30,000 per year.

Average effective federal income tax rate of the first is 24.28% for a federal income tax bill of $728,400.
Average effective federal income tax rate of the latter is 1.85% for a federal income tax bill of $555.

Allow for the difference in their income by dividing the first person's tax bill by 100 to equalize their incomes, and that results in $7,284. That is 13 times what the latter person pays, NOT 3 times.

Equalize everyone's tax bill by implementing a flat tax and then we'll be closer to everyone paying their fair share but still quite far from the ultimate in fairness, a capitation tax in which everyone pays the same AMOUNT.

And if you wish, you and everyone else is perfectly welcome to voluntarily donate money to feed starving children. In my opinion, the liberals' ideology of PAYING the poor to breed and INCENTIVIZING the growth of the starving class is nothing short of child abuse. Why doom even MORE children to a life of struggle and poverty? That's pure evil.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:09 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,031 posts, read 44,840,107 times
Reputation: 13715
Quote:
Originally Posted by ringwise View Post
So the American Dream of working hard, and reaping the rewards of that hard work is, what, null and void now? The harder you work, the more will be taken from you?
Yes. That's the liberal ideology.

Quote:
How long before those hard workers decide that they're sick and tired of working hard, just to have it taken from them and given to a loser?
Not long. Witness the defunct USSR.
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