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I was having a conversation with my old, white dad. We both think homosexuals should have completely equal rights as heterosexuals...as in they should be let into the army (without a don't ask, don't tell policy), should be able to marry, and should not be harassed. This is because they are our fellow citizens.
However, I just think that when someone says they want something, I'm going to trust that person unless what they want is clearly destructive. Then I might question that. My dad, however wants homosexuals not to be harassed for the same reason he's against bans on smoking. He hypothesizes that homosexuality is unhealthy for the mind, because explaining it as a natural, common urge from an evolutionary perspective can be done, but it takes a bit of guesswork and isn't necessarily true...like Richard Dawkins did:
So my dad's perspective is that homosexuality should neither be punished, nor encouraged. Basically, he respects homosexual people more if they brag about being homosexuals less. He's a little ticked off that he can't tell people that he thinks homosexuality is not so much a natural urge, as some unhealthy fad or act of rebellion without them getting ticked off at what he sees as the suggestion of that.
We both agreed that old white men are pretty much the most hated group in the nation that doesn't actually do anything, as a group, to specifically attack the nation (like Westborough Baptist Church). He did follow this agreement by cheerfully saying: "And we deserve it. It's our turn"
Still, he thinks there is too much aggression towards opinions (mostly those of old white men,
"And we deserve it. It's our turn.") but still, vengeance aside, are people demonized too much for stating their opinions, not just regarding homosexuality, but any opinions?
Location: In a Galaxy far, far away called Germany
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People do react rather harshly to desenting opinions. But this is due to the deterioration of common courtesy during discourse. People say such borish things like "I speak my mind" (when they can both speak their minds AND speak it with courtesy) or "I tell it like it is" (yes, what it "is" is that they are an a$$). People need to re-learn tact and let their ideas - not their rudeness - interact in the arena of ideas/opinions. If they can't do that, then they have done their view a dis-service.
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
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Dunno that folks ever really had more ''polite'' disagreements than they do now. We simply used to have a much broader ''consensus'' on most of these sensitive matters involving race, sexuality, religion, gender roles, ''white entitlement'', etc.. And naturally there are also many more relatively ''anonymous'' (and risk-free) opportunities now, for expressing those disagreements (tv, internet, talk radio, etc.).
Speaking of which, Richard Dawkins is an azz IMO, and I find his overbearing stridency no less annoying than the fundies he rails about. Then again, that's just my opinion (...LOL)!
People do react rather harshly to desenting opinions. But this is due to the deterioration of common courtesy during discourse. People say such borish things like "I speak my mind" (when they can both speak their minds AND speak it with courtesy) or "I tell it like it is" (yes, what it "is" is that they are an a$$). People need to re-learn tact and let their ideas - not their rudeness - interact in the arena of ideas/opinions. If they can't do that, then they have done their view a dis-service.
I agree, although I'd be hypocritical if I claimed to NEVER let any emotions get involved.
This forum has plenty of examples of letting emotions take the reins of arguments, so logic flies out the window.
I start out logical... I state my perspective, with studies, with common sense, logic to back it up. I also state potential or real consequences.
IE: There is no such thing as a "gay gene" lol. http://www.freewebs.com/theborngayhoax/theapa.htm
It is axiomatic truth that we are born with brains that are only 25% developed, so we can better adapt to environmental influences. Sexuality is learned, more than inborn - both heterosexuality & homosexuality.
Homosexuality is essentially a sexual fetish, since it is not dealing with all sexual organs, but must resort to substitutes. Sexual fetishes should never be the basis of deriving rights - yet LBGT are also pushing to normalize other sexual fetishes like pedophilia. Also, children need a mom & dad, plain & simple & marriage is primarily for the protection/benefit of future society - children, who all come from heterosexual unions & never from homosexual unions. Also, as implied in the OP, it is becoming like a crime to state any of these axiomatic truths, simply because those with homosexual fetishes want to maintain their illusion & want to feel that others are also.
Then, somebody gets offended at truth they'd rather not consider. Then, they engage in adhominem attack, which pisses me off, but I still try to keep cool, yet I cannot help but respond not only logically, but with a need to set them straight.
Still, I see that if I engage in adhominem attack also, anyone with common sense or logical reasoning capablities will see through that too, & it will make both arguments look ridiculous. Unfortunately, many do not have such capablilities & believe any adhominem attacks, instead of seeing them for the logical fallacies that they are. Thus, there is a temptation to stoop to the other's level, but one must have more integrity than that.
Last edited by SuperSoul; 01-07-2013 at 08:38 AM..
LBGT are also pushing to normalize other sexual fetishes like pedophilia
I would think that line of thought is canceled out by two factors:
Prepubescent children don't have much of a sex drive.
Adults and post-pubescent youth are better at judging long term consequences than children.
I don't see the normalization of homosexuality as a threat in this way, so long as people take morality into account.
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