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Maybe a chemical imbalance, such as certain behaviors occur with other ailements (Kleptomania, Pedophila, etc...?). Could be such, could be learned, could be a lot of things. It is all just guesses at this point.
I am sort of divided why people are gay as there are a number of possibilities and also questions. Anything is possible but I am more skeptical toward the "chemical imbalance" and "gay gene" theories and I tend to believe it is more environmental.
For instance - The age that children reach puberty has been getting younger over the past 150 years so isn't possible this is having various effects on kids that we do not yet understand?
Not the same. Ethanol and nicotine are intensely addictive chemicals. Horrible eating habits can be very rewarding in the short-term. Riding without a helmet is exhilarating, and you'll probably die instantly from smashing your bare head into the ground at such speeds.
Choosing to be gay on purpose would be choosing the very real possibility of a lifetime of immense emotional torment and suffering, possibly starting as early as early childhood. Think about all the youths who are disowned and abandoned by their parents that often end up homeless; think about the people who endure and have endured prolonged violence and bullying, often to the point where they feel they have no other choice to commit suicide to escape the pain. Think of what it feels like to have others tell you you're not even a second class citizen; you're just plain less than a person. Where is the reward in this?
If people had a choice, almost no one would ever choose this, ever.
I'm not buying it.
People choose lifestyles all the time - ALL THE TIME - which cause them great emotional torment and suffering. Kids are abandoned by their parents for many reasons other than homosexuality. People make choices that result in violence and bullying, often to the point of suicide - choices which don't involve homosexuality at all. I don't know what they think they are gaining, but to act as if this isn't common human nature is in error. Our hospitals and institutions and cities and streets and neighborhoods are full of straight people who make lifestyle choices that result in all of the above. What's their excuse?
By the way, sexual behavior can be very addictive as well. Sexual addictions are some of the hardest addictions to break.
I love it! A phobe says homosexuality isn't natural. Someone counters that it IS in fact seen in nature. Phobe comes back with how we shouldn't follow what's in nature. Circular thinking to support hate. Sad.
From a physiological and anatomical standpoint, human beings' butts did not evolve to be a two-way chute; It exists solely for expelling excrement. Indeed, from an evolutionary perspective, homosexual behavior is an abomination; It does not propagate the species. It is indeed unnatural.
As to the 'seen in nature' fallacy:
Incest has also been seen in nature (animals). Incest among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
Cannibalism has also been seen in nature (animals). Cannibalism among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
Infanticide has also been seen in nature (animals). Infanticide among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
As to the morality of the behavior, it has been immoral and an abhorrent practice from day one in the United States. And just because a certain deviant segment of society decides that it's okay doesn't make it any less immoral or abhorrent.
From the spiritual perspective, there isn't a monotheistic religion in the world that tacitly advocates such behavior. Some Christian churches may look away, or not directly acknowledge such behavior, but in all such religions the practice is taboo.
As to the law, if the owners of the photography service decide that they cannot provide services to a homosexual couple, because by doing so means they are tacitly advocating such behavior and thus infringing on a core tenet of their religious beliefs, then they possess that right per the First Amendment. It is no different than asking a practicing Christian to knowingly drive a woman to an abortion clinic; The act of doing so is tacit support of helping a woman get an abortion -- which the help provided in of itself is a grave sin.
I suspect the New Mexico Supreme Court is going to find itself overruled by the Supreme Court. Such a ruling violates the Establishment Clause. Homosexuals are not a protected class.
Nope. I didn't say I hate them, but I won't let them try to block people from pursuing happiness and contribute to murder and suicide without calling them out. I am the opposite of hate, since I see no desire for them to suffer. They want homosexuals to suffer though, that is hate.
Nope. I didn't say I hate them, but I won't let them try to block people from pursuing happiness and contribute to murder and suicide without calling them out. I am the opposite of hate, since I see no desire for them to suffer. They want homosexuals to suffer though, that is hate.
How does one "contribute" to suicide? That's a personal choice on the part of the individual, perhaps the most personal of all. Hurt feelings? Well, whoever hurt their feelings didn't put the gun to their head and pull that trigger...
And how does refusing to conduct business with a certain individual (or group of individuals) cause them to suffer? It makes them find another route to obtain said service, that's all.
How does one "contribute" to suicide? That's a personal choice on the part of the individual, perhaps the most personal of all. Hurt feelings? Well, whoever hurt their feelings didn't put the gun to their head and pull that trigger...
And how does refusing to conduct business with a certain individual (or group of individuals) cause them to suffer? It makes them find another route to obtain said service, that's all.
From a physiological and anatomical standpoint, human beings' butts did not evolve to be a two-way chute; It exists solely for expelling excrement. Indeed, from an evolutionary perspective, homosexual behavior is an abomination; It does not propagate the species. It is indeed unnatural.
This is not "homosexual behavior". In fact, heterosexual couples actually engage in this behavior more often than homosexual couples. Also, just what does the evolutionary purpose of a specific body part have to do with how two consenting adults use those parts? I'll help you. NOTHING. It is none of your business. As for being natural, of course it is. It arose naturally and continues to do so through natural processes. Whether or not it directly propagates the species is irrelevant. If it was so harmful that it was negatively affecting population numbers it would have been selected out of the population eons ago. Seriously, do you even have any idea how evolution and natural selection actually work, or what the words even mean or entail?
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As to the 'seen in nature' fallacy:
Incest has also been seen in nature (animals). Incest among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
Cannibalism has also been seen in nature (animals). Cannibalism among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
Infanticide has also been seen in nature (animals). Infanticide among humans is regarded as abhorrent. Thus an argument that deems a behavior okay among humans, just because it's "natural," is fallacious and not credible.
False equivalence is also a logical fallacy, for the record. I'll leave it up to you to figure out how homosexuality is not equivalent to incest, cannibalism, or infanticide. (Or pedophilia, or bestiality, or all of the other things you people seem to enjoy spending your time thinking about.)
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As to the morality of the behavior, it has been immoral and an abhorrent practice from day one in the United States. And just because a certain deviant segment of society decides that it's okay doesn't make it any less immoral or abhorrent.
I'm not sure what rock you've been hiding under, but a majority of Americans are now supportive of homosexuals and same-sex marriage, and the gap is growing faster and faster all the time. And even if most people believe it is immoral, that is meaningless. You don't make law and policy based off of religious teachings, period. Also, if you could kindly explain to me exactly what makes it immoral and abhorrent (without reference to any specific religious belief, naturalistic fallacies, or false equivalence fallacies) I would appreciate that.
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From the spiritual perspective, there isn't a monotheistic religion in the world that tacitly advocates such behavior. Some Christian churches may look away, or not directly acknowledge such behavior, but in all such religions the practice is taboo.
Again, irrelevant. People's religious feelings have no bearing whatsoever on these kinds of civil issues.
Quote:
As to the law, if the owners of the photography service decide that they cannot provide services to a homosexual couple, because by doing so means they are tacitly advocating such behavior and thus infringing on a core tenet of their religious beliefs, then they possess that right per the First Amendment. It is no different than asking a practicing Christian to knowingly drive a woman to an abortion clinic; The act of doing so is tacit support of helping a woman get an abortion -- which the help provided in of itself is a grave sin.
Owning a business is a privilege, not a right. In order to own and operate a business one must follow the laws of doing business, both state and federal. In New Mexico it is illegal to refuse business to people based on their sexual orientation. If they don't like that, they shouldn't have agreed to follow the laws of business in that state.
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I suspect the New Mexico Supreme Court is going to find itself overruled by the Supreme Court. Such a ruling violates the Establishment Clause. Homosexuals are not a protected class.
Heh, OK. I'll be waiting for that.
Last edited by Lunar Delta; 08-24-2013 at 12:15 PM..
Adultery is a capital crime in some countries too. So is pedophilia. So what? People still make those choices in spite of the dangers.
People make all sorts of lifestyle choices that will probably result in great personal unhappiness, loss, etc. I'm not saying whether or not being gay is a choice - I actually don't know, though I personally think that it's probably partly genetic and partly environmental.
All I'm saying is that the argument "Who would CHOOSE to be gay and choose a lifestyle of personal difficulty?" is not a valid or reasonable argument. People choose lifestyles that create personal difficulty all the time.
Kathy I will make it easy on you. I am gay, and I will tell you first hand, there is no way in Hell I would break my folk's heart. I was reared on a farm in rural Oklahoma in the 70s, I have always known, even as a young boy I liked men. Now my folk's have no grandkids and wonder who is going to take over the farm when I'm gone. I promise my folks I will keep it in the family and leave if for one of my cousin's grandkids. How do you think that makes me feel? Do you think I chose to be gay to pis my folks off? You think I did it to pis you off? Don't you think I would love to have a boy of my own to show him how to hunt, fish and to work on the tractor and an old truck like my dad did with me? You think I chose to be gay to throw all that way?
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