Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire600
States aren't any better. They didn't adequately fund their pension commitments. They pissed money away on programs for votes and now they are in up to their ass in liabilities they can't pay.
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Yes, indeed. An excellent analysis.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire600
I just don't think the average person realizes the true financial cluster we are in.
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Ignorance is bliss.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossfire600
We will never pay off the trillions in debt,...
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You don't have to pay it off
per se. You just have to keep it from growing.
Most people incorrectly believe the federal debt is $18 TRILLION.
It's actually $126 TRILLION, including all future unfunded liabilities. That's almost 2x greater than World GDP (including US GDP).
$126 TRILLION
-$72 TRILLION
-------------
$54 TRILLION
So, even if you threatened the World with nuclear annihilation, and the World gave you $72 TRILLION, you're still $54 TRILLION short.
And don't forget that the Euro-States have massive future unfunded liabilities as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
"The government does not bail out pensions. It is not guaranteed by the government.
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Your government bailed out Chrysler and GMC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan
Blame Congress for not acting sooner. The PBGC has been asking for increased premiums from these employers for nearly 10 years as the annual report to Congress showed declining fund balances.
We have laws on the books about pension funding and they were all ignored and/or waivered.
Typical kick the can down the road.
SS is headed in the same direction.
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Congress has ignored Social Security and the Medicare Trustees since 2001. Why should the PBGC not be ignored as well?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn
Long overdue. Longer life expectancy overwhelmed this "corps" ability, long-term, to keep up with defaults.
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Please, not that Red Herring.
For Social Security, Medicare, pensions and all life insurance plans, the sole metric used is Life Expectancy from Age 65, not Life-Expectancy from Birth.
The not-too-bright need to go read the Volcker Commission Report from 1983.
In 1983 when Social Security went bankrupt and Congress had to bail out Social Security, the new legislation called for increases in the FICA payroll tax to get Social Security solvent, and Life-Expectancy at Age 65 in 1983 was known and assumed to be what it is today.
The only people who are "shocked" or "surprised" by Life Expectancy today, are those who refuse to read the Volcker Commission Report, or read an of the articles published in profession journals for actuarial science.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
I don't think anyone under 50 expect to receive 100% of their SS, so there is nothing new going on. People like you are strange because you go on about how we need to cut spending, and when spending is cut, you can't stop complaining about it.
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Straw Man.
Social Security is funded by the FICA payroll tax, and not by the General Fund.
Cutting spending does not reduce the FICA payroll tax.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
Next time post and make some sense.
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Which part of
"unions are Socialist" did you not understand?
Which part of "
unions are Soviet-style Command Market Economics" do you not understand?
Which part of "
unions are anti-Free Market" do you not understand?
Which part of "
unions are monopolies" do you not understand?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
Many people put their hard earned money into the pension.
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So?
There are no guarantees in Life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
Not a ponzi scheme when one contributes to their pensions instead of their bank accounts.
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A Ponzi scheme continues only so long as new investors can be lured into it so that the early investors can be paid a return on their "investment."
MLSMK Invs. Co. v. JP Morgan Chase & Co., 651 F.3d 268; 2011 U.S. App. LEXIS 13822
Any scheme that requires new investors to pay off existing investors is a Ponzi Scheme.
Union pensions
are a Ponzi Scheme, like it or not. There is one and only one Element of Proof necessary to prove a Ponzi Scheme:
A "Ponzi scheme" is one "in which earlier investors' returns are generated by the influx of fresh capital from unwitting newcomers rather than through legitimate investment activity." SEC v. Credit Bancorp, Ltd., 290 F.3d 80, 89 (2d Cir. 2002) (internal quotation marks omitted). For a description of the operations of the eponymous Charles Ponzi himself, see Cunningham v. Brown, 265 U.S. 1, 7-9, 44 S. Ct. 424, 68 L. Ed. 873 (1924).
In a court of law, I need only ask one question to prove a union pension plan is a Ponzi Scheme:
If new entrants to the union do not join the pension plan or if there are no new entrants to the union, will the pension plan still be viable?
Answer:
No.
Ergo, the pension is a Ponzi Scheme. The fact that no one lied, or that there is no promise of a ridiculous return amount on monies, or that there is a promise of any return at all on monies is totally and completely irrelevant.
http://www.ponzitracker.com/storage/...Indictment.pdf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
I do not believe a bail out is the answer and she is ranting about the mob.. she needs to come down to earth.
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I'm a he.
Doesn't matter what cute name you give it, it's still a bailout.
Tell us all again, why does Organized Crime fight to gain control of unions and commit arson and murders and kidnappings and beat-downs to that end?
What, it's their civic duty?
You need to spend more time reading RICO cases.
If you want to rail against Obama fine, he makes 100 mistakes a day. There's plenty of legitimate things to rant about that makes him look dumber than he really is.
This isn't one of them....
Mircea
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