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The great thing is you don't have to carry or own if you don't want to. I even went out of my way to say that just because you are armed it doesn't guarantee anything, different scenarios play out upon factors. However not being armed or not allowed to be armed guarantees you will never have had a chance to defend yourself.
Given when you know there is a threat taking steps to defend yourself is not giving into fear, if they had stopped making cartoons THAT would have been giving into fear.
Is the Warsaw uprising any different? Whether it is defending yourself and not cowering to a army,or a terrorist, or a psycho ex it is still self defense on a certain scale.
Some have said in this thread "but maybe the guy would have had it stolen instead or shot someone by accident". Well maybe but MAYBE had the 4th or 5th person in the building put a 9mm round through the head of the terrorist he might not only have saved himself but also that terrorist would never have lived to make it to the deli and killed another person there. So maybe can go either way .
You are in a building with a terrorist killing everybody and you know you are next.You knew this could happen specially if you wrote those cartoons. What do you do now? Well if you are unarmed you cower under a desk waiting your fate until he finally finds you. If you are armed you fight back, maybe die anyway but maybe not. Which scenario would you prefer?
Listen, I understand what you and some others are saying from your position. I am saying that I don't want to live in a society where most people are carrying firearms. I don't want anyone around me to carry- ever!!! If we can ever progress beyond our violent selves then maybe we can progress to becoming a more enlightened species. You can laugh if you want but know that if we only laugh off a non-violent world we will NEVER live in one.
I hope for a world where a religious zealot does not kill over stupid things. You want to respond to violence with more violence. That just guarantees a continuation of a violent world where the need for bigger and badder guns are needed.
You bring up the Jews fighting back. Listen, I wouldn't be here if a Jew hadn't escaped that mess so I do think that uprising was justified. I want to live in a world where that would never have happened and nobody would be forced to bring arms against a fascist regime intent on killing an entire group of people from the face of the earth. Again, you cannot compare. This incident is like a Christian killing an abortion doctor. I don't think you would say that is like the attempted extermination of the Jewish people.
Anyway, I don't know if I am getting my point across. I understand yours. Do you understand mine?
Wasn't there an armed guard at the building that was shot first? Having to be armed at all times to feel safe isn't the definition of being safe and free.
Yeah but to die-hard gunnutz it fulfills their "pursuit of happiness" quotient akin to jacked up 4X4 pick-ups to go to the local mall......it's a "faltering-ego" supplement thang.
Listen, I understand what you and some others are saying from your position. I am saying that I don't want to live in a society where most people are carrying firearms. I don't want anyone around me to carry- ever!!! If we can ever progress beyond our violent selves then maybe we can progress to becoming a more enlightened species. You can laugh if you want but know that if we only laugh off a non-violent world we will NEVER live in one.
I hope for a world where a religious zealot does not kill over stupid things. You want to respond to violence with more violence. That just guarantees a continuation of a violent world where the need for bigger and badder guns are needed.
You bring up the Jews fighting back. Listen, I wouldn't be here if a Jew hadn't escaped that mess so I do think that uprising was justified. I want to live in a world where that would never have happened and nobody would be forced to bring arms against a fascist regime intent on killing an entire group of people from the face of the earth. Again, you cannot compare. This incident is like a Christian killing an abortion doctor. I don't think you would say that is like the attempted extermination of the Jewish people.
Anyway, I don't know if I am getting my point across. I understand yours. Do you understand mine?
You are getting your point across BUT on here; it will be simply pizzing upwind.
America: - citizens afraid of each other since 1783.
So reading the last few replies and then calling on me to grow up or come out of some fantasy land it looks to me like some of you are in fantasy land. You don't want to live in a violent world, well nether do I. However it is a violent world at times like it or not. You can choose to be a pacifist fine, but you have no right to decide for others to disarm them.
You want to decide for others to disarm them leaving them at the mercy of violence when it comes around. Pretty selfish of you. Wear your rose colored glasses if you want, but not for me thank you.
If it was up to you everybody would be at the mercy of violent ones, because you want to click your heels three times and make believe everything is sugarplum and fairies.
How is it that during WW2 when the Jews fought back in the famous Warsaw ghetto uprising, history and people tout it as heroic and something to be admired? Or the French resistance for that matter?
Because according to you we all should be dismissing their actions as reckless because "statistically* the Jews who armed themselves and fought back were more likely to shoot their friend or foot off. So according to you it is safer to live like a sheep and take a chance when the lion comes looking for its meal.
You aren't seriously comparing actions during WW2 to this are you ?
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 24 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,560 posts, read 16,548,014 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest
We are under constant survellience, we have already lost. And woe be to anyone who dare violate a progressive tenet by protecting themselves and not abdicating their personal safety to the state
Pretty sure he was paraphrasing Thomas Jefferson and Ben Franklin there.
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