Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 02-28-2016, 08:22 PM
 
7,530 posts, read 11,369,496 times
Reputation: 3656

Advertisements

Interesting article. It seerms that not enough black students are choosing the college majors that lead to higher paying jobs. The article points out how this contributes to the racial income gap.


African-Americans over-represented among low-paying college majors | PBS NewsHour
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 02-28-2016, 08:26 PM
 
7,530 posts, read 11,369,496 times
Reputation: 3656
Here's an interview with a guy who talks about his experiences as a Black man in the tech industry. I found it insightful.

Being Black In The Tech Industry : NPR
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2016, 09:38 PM
 
16,212 posts, read 10,828,810 times
Reputation: 8442
Depends on which source you want to look at. There was a USA Today article which highlighted that 4.6% of Tech majors are black or hispanic, yet they only work in about 2% of the available jobs. Many times, they are not hired even if they have gone to school and gotten a degree.

Also, the statistics cited are for undergrad majors. Many black people today go on to get a Master's degree or above, which would cause them to earn a higher wage versus those cited in the article.

For instance, I was an English major. I have ALWAYS made more than $45K per year.

But FWIW, I found it odd they put Business as a major that black people don't major in. I went to an HBCU and have a large group of family and friends who are college graduates and over half have a business degree. I have thought about going back to get an MBA but don't want to pay for it considering I make very good money. I work in supply chain. And in the chart regarding the % of African Americans with degrees, Business wasn't listed, which makes me think that there are many more business majors than most. I remember reading Business was the top degree for black Americans only few years ago.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2016, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
30,374 posts, read 19,177,636 times
Reputation: 26267
Yes, you should look at the income averages of the degree you choose but also what you are good at and enjoy doing. I have one son that obtained a degree in Computer Engineering (and loves it) and began making 6 figures 1 year after graduating. My other son has no interest and no apparent aptitude for that field so he has to go in a different direction.

The premise of the article is sound, your choice of degree is going to affect your future earnings whether black, white, Asian, or Hispanic.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2016, 11:06 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
28,226 posts, read 36,889,363 times
Reputation: 28563
Yes and no. I work in tech. I am not an engineer. There are plenty of jobs in tech for liberal arts majors and whatever general stuff there is. Yet few of these jobs are filed by black people (and other people of color). Why? Tech is cliquey. Let me sum it up for you, and how institutionalized it is.

Think of your favorite recent startup now powerhouse tech company (you can use Google or Facebook.).

The average "unicorn" startup is founded by a few friends, engineers, who met in college. Maybe they are still in college. Or maybe they are recent grads. They have time, and some family resources to help then seed their idea. They can afford to work on this side project, because they aren't super concerned with money right now. Family support or otherwise.

They go and look for some funding, the VCs like 20-something white guys who went to a good college. They get some money because they match the pattern.

Now they need to hire their firrst few engineers. They call their friends, roommates, maybe former coworkers if they are older. As we know, most people are friends with people like them.

Now fast forward, the company is getting more successful, they need new employees. At this stage everyone is working late and spending a lot of time together. They need people who will fit in. They ask all of the employees to refer their friends. The next wave of hires look pretty similar to the first batch. They are all friends.

Now they need more people. The friend circle is tapped. So they go back to their alma mater, because they have connections. Our startup wants to be super successful, so they only recruit from the "top tier schools," and they have an intensive interview process. Keep in mind the schools that graduate the most Black and Latino engineers are not UC Berkeley, Harvard, Stanford and MIT (Also Wisconsin). But this is the list that gets recruited from. If you are in the Bay Area, you might stop by San Jose State.

So you come in for the interview. And maybe you even know about the whiteboard interview. You are all prepped. You went to Stanford, you kinda match the pattern. And then there is the cultural fit. Which is code word for "do I want to hang our with you at happy hour and on the weekends."

Now let's remind ourselves that most people hang out with people who are like them. And these engineers are a little more likely to be socially awkward than other professions. So the odds are good you won't pass the cultural fit interview. You need to like skiing (maybe snowboarding), craft beer (or perhaps craft spirits). Or rock climbing. Don't forget about that. And maybe bicycling. And "indie" music. Here is another point of exit.

Now the average "unicorn" startup doesn't even think about having HR until they hit 50 people. And these first 50 got all of the good equity. And the HR is pretty understaffed, the company is growing fast. They are still relying on internal referrals, now you get a cash bonus if your friend gets hired. They keep going to the same old job fairs.

So a few years ago I worked on a project to get tech companies to recruit at HBCUs. Here are some of the rejections we heard:
1. No budget to travel for recruiting so we only recruit locally (Stanford, UC Berkeley and San Jose State)
2. I don't know anyone from those schools, how will I know if they are good engineers. I'd rather recruit from places with guaranteed quality.

Now let's pretend said tech company is at the next phase. They need experienced people. And the people with the right experience come from other tech companies that have already passed that stage. So suddenly, for my startup, I only want people who have come from the big name companies (Google, Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, whatever). And keep in mind all of them grew up the same way: picking pools of candidates from their friends, roommates and former coworkers who look like them.

And that is why tech isn't diverse.

Now let's pretend you somehow got around all of that and made it in the door. You were the only person who looks like you. And suddenly you are either the token <insert identity here> or you are supposed to speak for your group all the time. You don't feel very included. And you leave. Opt out and find another industry.

Here are a few more stories:
Twitter engineer resigns due to lack of diversity
Non tech, but stories of black c-level executives
CNN features on being Balck in tech (tons of good stuff in here)
Missing Black women led startups (good study about black female entrepreneurship)


In a nutshell:
1. insular networks
2. retention once you get in the door
a. feeling isolated
b. have to represent for all people of your group
c. diversity, inclusion, retention are not prioritized
d. without full participation in the "clique" it is hard to get ahead

Personally, I am not doing badly in my career, but not being in the "clique" has hurt my opportunities for advancement. My network was not big enough at all. And tech companies use the same recruiting techniques to recruit non-engineers as well. They still come in via the personal networks. But what is different in the the idea of "who you know" in tech, there is an added layer of "can we be BFFS because we will be working long hours, hanging out after work, and basically spending all of our time together." Makes it a lot harder to get in the door.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-28-2016, 11:50 PM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,215,209 times
Reputation: 18824
People get degrees in whatever field they feel comfortable studying.

If black kids don't wanna study tech, then so be it. I don't see why it's a big deal.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-29-2016, 12:00 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
28,226 posts, read 36,889,363 times
Reputation: 28563
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
People get degrees in whatever field they feel comfortable studying.

If black kids don't wanna study tech, then so be it. I don't see why it's a big deal.
Lots of tech jobs do not need tech degrees. Doesn't mean they are recruiting black people for these. Your average sales, marketing, admin, customer service person didn't major in anything remotely tech.....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-29-2016, 12:24 AM
 
10,829 posts, read 5,439,336 times
Reputation: 4710
Get a business degree or study something that will get you a government job.

STEM isn't for everyone -- and that includes whites.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-29-2016, 01:09 AM
 
56,988 posts, read 35,215,209 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by dechatelet View Post
Get a business degree or study something that will get you a government job.

STEM isn't for everyone -- and that includes whites.
You don't think we all know that STEM isn't for the overwhelming majority of whites?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 02-29-2016, 07:27 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,572,795 times
Reputation: 8094
As long as it's not done via AA, I don't care either way it is going.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:48 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top