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The Loonies are still beating that dead Russian horse when even their propaganda media and various investigations have moved on. Except for Schiffty Schiff. I think he has a crush on Vladimir and keeps this hoax going so no one questions why Vlad topless on horseback is his screensaver.
For anyone with a brain in their head that isn't infected with TDS, it's pretty obvious what Trump is doing. He's trying to create a personal connection with KJU, which he hopes will lead to easier negotiations on denuclearization & help flip NK from adversary to ally. The same way you play golf with a potential client in the business world. What you don't do, is don't accuse someone of being a murderer, when you're trying to negotiate a historic denuclearization deal. Here's another obvious component to think about: Negotiating with NK, in the militaristic, establishment, DC way, has been a failure for 60 years now. Since the vinegar obviously isn't working, it's time to try some honey.
The truth is there's nothing the left would love more than to see peace negotiations with NK fail. They simply can not have that on Trumps' resume come 2020.
For anyone with a brain in their head that isn't infected with TDS, it's pretty obvious what Trump is doing. He's trying to create a personal connection with KJU, which he hopes will lead to easier negotiations on denuclearization & help flip NK from adversary to ally. The same way you play golf with a potential client in the business world. What you don't do, is don't accuse someone of being a murderer, when you're trying to negotiate a historic denuclearization deal. Here's another obvious component to think about: Negotiating with NK, in the militaristic, establishment, DC way, has been a failure for 60 years now. Since the vinegar obviously isn't working, it's time to try some honey.
I agree with this ^^^ and I usually think Trump is the horse's arse. My background is in the business world, and there it is all about establishing personal relationships when negotiating, so I could see what Trump was up to.
Where it fell apart though was after the set-up he did with Kim, at dinner in Hanoi he gave Kim a "take it or leave it" offer. WTF? Why go for the whole enchilada at first especially dealing with someone who needs to show face and look like he is coming out ahead? That was idiotic on Trump's part. It was a gamble and he lost. He should have worked on a path to the enchilada, one step at a time.
Geopolitics is not same as real estate, which is something the left has been trying to tell those who think Trump's business smarts (cough, cough) will make him a good President.
For anyone with a brain in their head that isn't infected with TDS, it's pretty obvious what Trump is doing. He's trying to create a personal connection with KJU, which he hopes will lead to easier negotiations on denuclearization & help flip NK from adversary to ally. .
So you think our doing that with Hitler and.or Stalin would have made a deal??
Trump is not exactly the type of person who can make personal friends. His world consists of whether he perceives he can bully or dominate you. Since he has no idea of how to even lay a foundation in diplomacy, he can't "get there from here" even if he cozies up to a dictator.
And this is no ordinary dictator either.
Rodman and many others already have personal connections to Kim. And POTUS worth their name would know that this type of thing takes many years and the odds that:
1. Trump would even make a deal.
2. That he's be around to see the deal through
Are really low. Kim will be around tho.
As far as the brain in your head I have quite a good memory. The Right, before Trump, said clearly to give ZERO to this guy (Kim) and if he raised a gun to us to smoke him. I could probably find you all the right wing rants of such if you like.
It's as if you think Trump has some Magic Medicine...when ALL proof is to the contrary.
Let's talk the basic facts and then discuss what should be done in light of them....
1. NK is not our enemy in the sense you propose. They are just strange. They are working with S. Korean and have been for decades to achieve more trade (they already trade),etc.
China has the MOST influence in NK and I'm sure KIM is not ready to go up against them either. Russia is even involved. Suffice it to say that Kim is not likely to go "Western Way" when their existence depends on China, Russia and SK.
2. Most people, even here, now agree they aren't going to give up their nukes. Many articles are detailing how they have pretty much perfected their bombs and missiles (good enough for defense...that's for sure!) and they have decent stocks of nuclear materials.
So the "Trump Goals" are impossible in the case of #2 and already underway in the case of #1. Trump is not going to make that happen any quicker as the US Congress and Populace is very unlikely to support a place like NK..
All in all the biggest problem here is priorities. Why are we even dealing with this? We don't "win" anything if NK is more friendly toward us...we do win if, as is going along, they and SK and China all come to understandings...but those are adults in the room, not children like the The Don.
It's hard to imagine any American Corporations as well as Congress approving of giving Kim much stuff (and that is what he wants) while their human rights issues aren't even discussed. It's not like they have oil like the Sauds, etc.
Are you referring to the same intelligence agency that pushed the dirty dossier. The same people who had an insurance policy if Trump won the presidency.
If the thing was true it's good that they had and have it.
People with some kind of "contract" that they have signed will usually be able to be reigned in if they step too far out of line.
The LAST thing I would want our intel agencies to do would be to bury stuff they have on the POTUS. Any POTUS. This is fair game.
Now, directly threatening their families...that's another story. Those are Trump Tactics.
I agree with this ^^^ and I usually think Trump is the horse's arse. My background is in the business world, and there it is all about establishing personal relationships when negotiating, so I could see what Trump was up to.
Where it fell apart though was after the set-up he did with Kim, at dinner in Hanoi he gave Kim a "take it or leave it" offer. WTF? Why go for the whole enchilada at first especially dealing with someone who needs to show face and look like he is coming out ahead? That was idiotic on Trump's part. It was a gamble and he lost. He should have worked on a path to the enchilada, one step at a time.
Geopolitics is not same as real estate, which is something the left has been trying to tell those who think Trump's business smarts (cough, cough) will make him a good President.
- What makes you think Trump made a "take it, or leave it" offer? Maybe KJU did? Maybe something else entirely?
- Maybe this is in fact working on the path to the whole enchilada? No one is suggesting negotiations are over. I consider this to have just been another step in the process.
So you think our doing that with Hitler and.or Stalin would have made a deal??
Trump is not exactly the type of person who can make personal friends. His world consists of whether he perceives he can bully or dominate you. Since he has no idea of how to even lay a foundation in diplomacy, he can't "get there from here" even if he cozies up to a dictator.
And this is no ordinary dictator either.
Rodman and many others already have personal connections to Kim. And POTUS worth their name would know that this type of thing takes many years and the odds that:
1. Trump would even make a deal.
2. That he's be around to see the deal through
Are really low. Kim will be around tho.
As far as the brain in your head I have quite a good memory. The Right, before Trump, said clearly to give ZERO to this guy (Kim) and if he raised a gun to us to smoke him. I could probably find you all the right wing rants of such if you like.
It's as if you think Trump has some Magic Medicine...when ALL proof is to the contrary.
Let's talk the basic facts and then discuss what should be done in light of them....
1. NK is not our enemy in the sense you propose. They are just strange. They are working with S. Korean and have been for decades to achieve more trade (they already trade),etc.
China has the MOST influence in NK and I'm sure KIM is not ready to go up against them either. Russia is even involved. Suffice it to say that Kim is not likely to go "Western Way" when their existence depends on China, Russia and SK.
2. Most people, even here, now agree they aren't going to give up their nukes. Many articles are detailing how they have pretty much perfected their bombs and missiles (good enough for defense...that's for sure!) and they have decent stocks of nuclear materials.
So the "Trump Goals" are impossible in the case of #2 and already underway in the case of #1. Trump is not going to make that happen any quicker as the US Congress and Populace is very unlikely to support a place like NK..
All in all the biggest problem here is priorities. Why are we even dealing with this? We don't "win" anything if NK is more friendly toward us...we do win if, as is going along, they and SK and China all come to understandings...but those are adults in the room, not children like the The Don.
It's hard to imagine any American Corporations as well as Congress approving of giving Kim much stuff (and that is what he wants) while their human rights issues aren't even discussed. It's not like they have oil like the Sauds, etc.
- Hitler & Stalin are irrelevant to this conversation.
- Your thinking is emotional, not rational. You hate Trump, so you assume everyone else must too. Trump is fantastic at forging relationships. Always has been.
- I don't care what the right said in the past. I'm sure I can find plenty of posts of lefties crying that Trump's tough talk with KJU was going to get us into a nuclear war tooe. Now he's trying a different angle as part of the same strategy. Good.
- There is no "magic medicine" & there is no proof to the contrary. Again, that's emotion talking based on your absolute hatred of Trump.
- NK has not been on good terms with SK. That's false. Only since Trump's first summit with NK, has the real warming between those two occurred. That's a good thing for our ally SK, who no longer has to worry about NK threatening to nuke them or launch missiles over them. Russia's a virtual non-factor in the NK negotiations. China is the one that calls the shots for NK. The only way to get NK to denuclearize is to have leverage on China. In the past, we haven't had any leverage on China, nor have we cared to have any. Trump's tariffs, have twisted China's arm and forced them to cede many things to us already. The 25% tariffs were set to kick in on March 1st, but due to advancements in negotiations Trump delayed them. Maybe they'll have to be enacted to get NK to fully denuclearize? One thing's for sure. The left will oppose any & all attempts to denuclearize NK. Tough talk will be criticized. Friendship will be criticized. Working with China will be criticized. Using leverage against China will be criticized. The left doesn't want NK denuclearizing & certainly not on Trump's watch.
- We're dealing with this because we can't let a Communist dictator threaten to nuke the United States & we want our allies/trading in the region to live in peace. We absolutely "win" if NK denuclearizes. The POTUS has a job to protect the United States. Flipping an antagonistic, Communist nation with nukes, from enemy to friend/trading partner would be a "win" for all.
- What makes you think Trump made a "take it, or leave it" offer? Maybe KJU did? Maybe something else entirely?
- Maybe this is in fact working on the path to the whole enchilada? No one is suggesting negotiations are over. I consider this to have just been another step in the process.
You are such a good little Trumpster. No, there will never be a "whole enchilada." There is no way Kim will ever decnuclearize. He has to make sure his country stays relevant.
You are such a good little Trumpster. No, there will never be a "whole enchilada." There is no way Kim will ever decnuclearize. He has to make sure his country stays relevant.
Admittedly, I always think peace is worth a shot.
S. Korea, Japan, Viet Nam, et al. are all relevant without nukes. I think this is what Trump is trying to sell KJU on. Remember KJU attended school in Switzerland, so he's not a complete shut-in, unaware of what the Western world has to offer. KJU reportedly likes Scotch, the NBA & other Western amenities. Selling him on how popular he could be internationally, his legacy as the man who took NK out of the dark ages & the opportunity to be more open & prosperous like Viet Nam or South Korea are worth trying.
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